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Published Monday, July 12, 2010 | 3:06 p.m.
Updated Monday, July 12, 2010 | 7:02 p.m.
Reader poll
Sun Archives
- Caesars Palace mulling change on dealer tips (6-14-2010)
- Casino dealers stymied in reaching labor agreement (2-13-2010)
- Caesars Palace plays hardball with dealers, asserts right to tips (1-18-2010)
- Caesars Palace dealers protest on Strip (9-17-2009)
- For Wynn dealers, deal slow to come (6-24-2008)
- Dealers sour on Caesars (11-19-2007)
- Under the radar, Caesars dealers push for union (10-11-2007)
Steve Wynn
Steve Wynn’s controversial policy of splitting casino dealers’ tips with their immediate supervisors doesn’t violate state law, according to a ruling issued today by Nevada Labor Commissioner Michael Tanchek.
Dealers say the high-profile case, which marks the first major ruling of its kind on the subject of tip-pooling, may have wide-ranging implications for other tip-earners in Nevada by opening the door to efforts by employers to pool line workers’ tips with supervisors.
For example, Harrah’s Entertainment executives recently sent a notice to dealers at the company’s Caesars Palace resort stating that the company reserves the right to be able to split dealer tips with supervisors. At the time, Harrah’s executives said they had no immediate plans to follow Wynn’s lead.
Monday's 18-page decision, which comes after months of deliberation and weeks of public hearings last year, delivers a significant blow to dealers at Wynn Las Vegas who have been fighting the tip policy for the past four years. The ruling also applies to dealers at Encore, who are bound by the same tip policy.
The battle isn’t over yet, though. Dealers expect to appeal the Labor Commissioner’s ruling to Nevada District Court on up to the Nevada Supreme Court. The state court system would then determine whether Tanchek’s reasoning was correct.
“We know this will be a long battle. It’s only Round One of Round Three,” said Meghan Smith, the former Wynn Las Vegas dealer who brought the original complaint to the Labor Commissioner in 2007. “We certainly want to win at every round but it’s the final round, the Supreme Court, that’s going to be the one that counts.”
Las Vegas attorney Gregory Kamer, who represented Wynn in the dispute, said the ruling was thorough and will be difficult to win on appeal.
“The Labor Commissioner, after a lot of thought, addressed all the points raised by the dealers and concluded there was no merit to the case,” he said.
Tanchek’s decision isn’t surprising in that it relies heavily on previous court rulings that have allowed employers to dictate how tips are pooled among employees. It follows a 1999 decision by then-Labor Commissioner Gail Maxwell, who determined that a small Summerlin casino could force dealers to share tips with supervisors.
“Based upon substantial evidence in the record, the plain language of the statutes, and prior case law, the Wynn may unilaterally establish and change a tip pooling agreement that is a term and condition of an underlying at-will employment agreement,” Tanchek wrote.
The issue wasn't clear-cut, however. The state’s tip law lets workers decide with whom to split tips and doesn’t grant such authority to management, though the statute is subject to multiple interpretations.
California-based attorney Jay Litman, who represented dealers in the case, said he was “disappointed” that the ruling avoided any reference to one of the main arguments brought by the dealers -- that the tip-sharing policy violates state law pertaining to how table games are regulated.
“We disagree with the ruling in terms of the law,” Litman said. “He addressed issue of labor law but failed to address issues related to the control of gaming.”
Casinos prohibit supervisors from receiving tips to avoid potential conflicts of interest, as table games supervisors charged with maintaining the integrity of the games could make questionable, harmful or even illegal decisions should they receive a portion of customer tips intended for dealers, Litman said.
The Gaming Control Board, which received a separate complaint about the tip policy last year, has not intervened in the case. While the regulatory agency investigates allegations of cheating or fraud in casinos, it doesn’t typically get involved in civil disputes. That includes tip-pooling policies, which the Board has said are best left up to companies and courts to decide.
In his decision, Tanchek referred to multiple cases brought by dealers who failed to defeat casino efforts in years past to force tip pooling among their ranks.
Until the 1980s, Las Vegas dealers pocketed tips given to them by players or split tips among dealers working certain tables or shifts. Nowadays, tips collected over a 24-hour period are split equally among dealers who worked that day.
Tanchek's ruling references a Nevada Supreme Court decision in 1975 stating that casinos should be entitled to split tips with other types of workers besides dealers, including supervisors.
Floormen, boxmen and cashiers “contribute to the service rendered to the player” the way busboys and waitresses work together to provide customer service to diners, the decision read.
Similarly, Tanchek’s ruling said Wynn’s dealer supervisors, now called “casino service team leads,” perform customer service-related duties such as opening or closing tables to accommodate players, changing out cards, rating play, handling lines of credit, changing limits on tables upon request and “concierge type services such as ordering drinks or making dinner reservations.”
The tip-sharing plan is motivated by management’s sense of entitlement to the hefty tips earned by line workers rather than any change in how the games are operated, as supervisors’ job duties are little changed from before, dealers argued.
State law, they said, prohibits forced tip-sharing by stating that employers may not “take all or part of any tips or gratuities” given to employees.
Though Wynn’s “team leads” oversee dealers and perform supervisory duties, they don’t have the power to hire and fire other employees, nor do they “have control of the business” the way higher-ups do, Tanchek reasoned. Therefore, state law doesn’t prohibit them from also receiving tips, he said.
He also disagreed with the dealers’ contention that Wynn benefited financially from redistributing dealer tips. While Wynn’s company indirectly benefited from the move, the company didn’t retain the dealer tips for its own use but instead used the money to compensate supervisors, he said.
The labor dispute began shortly after Steve Wynn implemented the tip policy in August 2006.
The following month, more than 100 dealers filed anonymous complaints with the Labor Commissioner, whose office issued a press release stating that the policy appeared to be legal but failed to make a formal ruling because the complaints were anonymous.
While one group of dealers filed a class-action lawsuit in September 2006 against Wynn Las Vegas, Smith, the Wynn dealer, pursued a different path by signing her name to an individual complaint with the Labor Commissioner in July 2007.
A state court judge dismissed the previous lawsuit in 2006, saying dealers didn’t have the right to sue over tips and that the matter must be decided by the Labor Commissioner. The Nevada Supreme Court upheld that decision in October 2008.
After waiting for the Supreme Court’s decision, Tanchek began hearing testimony on the Smith complaint in July 2009.
Both parties filed summary briefs and counter-briefs in early 2010. Tanchek has been deliberating on the matter since May, after receiving responses from both sides.
Wynn has said the policy, intended to improve customer service at his casinos, has worked as intended by motivating supervisors to give better service to gamblers and making it easier to recruit them from among the ranks of dealers -- people who often make more than their immediate supervisors. By giving supervisors tips while also increasing their salaries, Wynn has reversed the historical wage gap on casino floors and thus, an industry standard.
Many Wynn dealers, who say the policy cut into their annual, pre-recession earnings by more than 10 percent, dispute the service argument, saying the tip scheme has divided the staff and hurt morale.
Before the tip policy, Wynn dealers earned more than $70,000 per year in tips alone. This tip money was believed to be the highest in Las Vegas at the time because of Wynn’s reputation for operating superior resorts. In anticipation of high tips, dealers as well as supervisors left other casinos to deal cards at Wynn. Some dealers, including Smith, voluntarily left high-paying jobs at Wynn to protest the tip scheme.
During last year’s testimony on the case, a manager at Don Laughlin’s Riverside Resort testified that dealers at the Laughlin casino had been sharing tips with their supervisors for years. Also, a Wynn table games supervisor spoke of the customer service demands of the job and told of receiving tips directly from customers.
Just because something has happened in the past doesn’t make it legal -- or appropriate, Litman said in response to today's ruling.
“That’s like the speeder saying that 10 cars passed him when he was doing 90 miles per hour,” he said.
CORRECTION: A previous version of this story failed to include all of the relevant information. After initially siding with dealers in a dispute with management at the Resort at Summerlin casino, then-Labor Commissioner Gail Maxwell in 1999 reversed her opinion in a letter, stating that the casino's policy of sharing dealer tips with management was legal. | (July 13, 2010)
This still does not change the fact that it is theft. Unfortunately for dealers, dealers are a dime a dozen...if you can't do anything else its still a job but get out of the industry if you can and work somewhere where you will be treated with respect, that is the only solution. With the continued destruction of the economy by the government these folks will likely be stuck in these jobs and putting up with the theft of tips that are given to them by patrons.
Why would this be theft any more than pooling is theft. If we are claiming the person giving the tip intends for the dealer to have the money then pooling should also be illegal. Then the casinos will start a no tipping policy as it could be considered a bribe for favors to the player.
Even the car wash workers pool their tips and divide them up at the end of the day.
To the dealers at Wynn: nobody forces you to work there. If you don't like the compensation structure, take your talents somewhere else (as LeBron would say).
Yes its a lousy thing for Wynn to do, but I do believe there is more than one casino in town. This is a right-to-work state. When times are good, employees can demand more compensation. When times are bad, employers will squeeze the work force. This is simple supply and demand. Get over it, and either get back to work or apply somewhere else.
If enough good employees refuse to work at Wynn due to lousy compensation, then eventually Wynn will have to improve the compensation if they want the better employees. Or Wynn could settle for 2nd rate dealers. Eventually a market driven equilibrium is reached.
WHOOT!
If the dealers care so much, why don't they unionize and strike instead of screw around with litigation?
Oh, maybe it is because they are completely unskilled workers and would be replaced in about a day.
OK, bad idea!
The end result is the supervisors pay will be cut as it will be compesated for in the shared tips. I wouldn't want to be a dealer or supervisor in this town.
Restuarant tip pools typically go to the bar, runners, and busers. Those employees make the same hourly wages as servers and deserve their portion of the tip money. Back of the house typically makes a higher hourly and does not receive tip compensation. If these supervisors are making significantly more money they shouldn't be gettig a portion of their dealers tips, but the company can do what it wants with tip policy.
Ok Wynn and Ceasars Palace dealers if you dont go on STRIKE now then stop your crying and let managment give your tokes to their girlfiends because you will deserve it..................
If you want to pay your "management" more money, then pay them more money--don't steal the tip earners money to compensate the management because you are too greedy to pay them the right amount! The bar managers do not "split" the cocktail waitress tips, the valet managers do not split the valet drivers tips, and the restaurant managers do not receive waitress tips--why does everyone feel is OK to screw the dealers all the time by stealing their money when no other group of workers gets treated in this way! This is very clear cut and weinberg is wrong again--as usual.
All the other tips earners in town had better watch out on this because once weinberg gets this on--he will turn his attention towards your money also---if he can get out of paying his managers less money and steal your tips and give it to his managers--he certainly will do so---and all the other scumbags will eventually follow suit--no matter what they say now--they will all be looking for ways to take your tips also!
in college I did an internship for a local megasort. I handled the scheduling of dealers in the pits between all games. Even at that age, I found out the dealers complain and act like children fighting with each other and their managers about EVERYTHING. I am now out of the hospitality industry, but in my opinion...the supervisors should be included in the tip pooling. They work harder and do not get 15 minute breaks for every 45 minutes of work...and they do not get the cozy, "dealer only" break room.
Maybe Mr. Wynn will now get a piece of the tips, and take them to Macau with him!
Even though he is dead wrong---it will be nearly impossible to get a decision against weinberg since everyone knows he controls all the power brokers in this state. You'll need a court out of this state to get a fair decision.
Sorry but some of you are wrong...
If the law says it is ok to share the tips, then it is NOT theft.
Some restaurants and bars DO split the tips with the managers.
The reader poll won't change the law...
I'm not taking sides, just stating facts.
I'm sorry...When I tip,whether it's a waiter,a bell hop or ANYONE that provides me "personal" service I expect that tip to go to that individual,not to someone who HAD NOTHING to do with the obvious good service I received. I have been places and have seen the bus boy pick up a tip from another table and place it in his pocket.Whether or not he actually put that into the kiddy,I have no idea. It only prompted me to hand my tip directly to the person serving me. When I am shown exceptional service....so is my tip,and I'm grateful to them for that service.What did his/her supervisor have in giving me that service...nothing,that's what.
WYNN Las Vegas takes dealers tips puts them into an interest bearing account, and keeps the interest for themselves. But the Nevada Labor Commissioner says "WYNN does NOT directly benefit from taking dealers tips..." The Nevada Labor Commissioner is probably going to buy an island in the Bahamas with all the money WYNN Las vegas paid him to rule in their favor!!!
As usual, the devil is in the details. I work in the casino biz on the strip and know that more often than not, supervisors often make less, sometimes a little, sometimes more than a little, than dealers. Wynn made a move to correct this by more or less evening out the wages between supervisors and dealers. But what I'm worried about is the potential for abuse, the taking advantage of the already minumum wage dealers in Vegas. Supervisors make a secure salary, but dealers have to rely on tips to make it. Watering down or taking away the tips will take the rug out from under them. So, why are we changing a system that has worked for Vegas for many, many years? What kind of dealers can we expect if we don't pay them nor treat them right? They are the first casino experience and the front line for many customers...treat them right, they treat the customers right, everybody is happy. Let's be careful about the lifeblood of dealers and dealer service...tips.
Oh and when you cruise....be careful. Many cruise lines "automatically" bill your account daily for everyone from the wine stewart to the your suite room stewart. I had a dining stewart who was so obnoxious for the entire cruise, I refused to tip him...but caused everyone else their tips...and you think that's right? Obviously,I dealt with the tips directly with the other 7-8 persons involved.
Absent a collective bargaining agreement, the employer is who determines tip policy and how they are split. Bartenders tip out barbacks, waitresses tip out bartenders. Management always has the final decision on the percentages at each place. Management can even decide not to allow dealers to accept tips at all if they wish. (although they'd have to make up the difference in salary if they want to stay competitive with regards to hires). If the employees don't like it they can always use their union voice and go on strike.
Of course the Wynn Dealers want to keep all their tips...they'd probably also prefer to keep their own rather than pooling. They don't get the final say...Mr Wynn does as it's his casino.
Babyboomer, I have some bad news for you. The majority of jobs that rely on tips have some type of tip pooling.
If you give a fat tip to that charming waitress that got your blood pressure boiling, chances are she has to put that into the bucket to be shared with the goon who was waiting on the tables at the other side of the restaurant.
Tip pooling is a common practice, and generally accepted, particularly across employees who perform the same job function.
The controversy with the Wynn tip pooling is the idea of sharing it up the management chain.
Sorry, but you are generally wrong to believe your generous tip belongs exclusively to the person you gave it to.
What I find interesting is how many people who are posting about this keep referring to this as "stealing" As I understand it you cant run a blackjack pit, craps pit, poker room...etc. without supervisors as well. They are there to protect the interest of the house, make sure players are getting tracked and taking care of their needs. It is not all about the dealers and yes most of you can be replaced rather easily. The floor managers and shift supervisors should be cut in a portion of the tips because they do a lot to keep the games full and players happy. Bottom line is dealers are greedy just like everyone else.
Nightmare is spot on. Tip Pooling is as old as the hills and is found everywhere across the country in many environments.
Steve Wynn....our Republican Communist!
Mr.Wynn is GOD!! in this town.
It's a shame that people who make the comments they do have never delt,oh how your opinon would change you have no idea of the crap we take,you all must be democrats its ok to take my money and do what you want with it As long as its not yours.
show some class come and work for minium wage for a couple of years and have someone start taking a portion of your toke that you live and pay your bills on, AND SEE HOW YOU LIKE IT.
AND I WILL BE HAPPY TO LISTEN TO WHAT YOU HAVE TO SAY ABOUT IT UNTIL THEN BUTT OUT
I don't agree with what Wynn did but since it went to the court and the first judge dismissed the case and said it was up to the Nevada Labor Commission, and the Nevada Supreme Court agreed. The dealers should abide by the outcome, there is nothing written about tips being split with supervisors. It does set a bad precedence, because where does tip sharing stop. Now there are issues that both sides are not stating, are dealer's hourly wage less because they get tips, like some wait persons do in resturants. Now, if this is the case, then the Nevada Labor Commission is wrong, because supervisors probably make more hourly which does not include tipping, now if supervisors want to make less hourly because they are getting tips, then that needs to be considered. I think the dealers are just looking at this issue because of tips, but they need to research the law about hourly wage and tipping, and approach the case from this angle. Now if dealers' are making the standard minimum wage and getting tips, then they don't have a case. If this is the case then the dealers need to decide, their job or move on.
when I tip a dealer, that tip was meant for the dealer, not the dealer and a menber of management.
This is Steve Wynns way of making the dealers pay
part of managements payroll. Its just not right! Stop stealing from the dealers STEVE WYNN , you have no right to thier money.
It's the Republican way! What's mine is mine and what's yours is mine. Steve Wynn or none of these casinos in this town play fair. There would still be slavery if Republicans had their way. Isn't it GOP? Greedy oppressive People! Too the dealers and us poor folks. If it's any consolation... When we die, we can't take it with us.
I would hate to be a dealer right now (or holding any job that is a tipped position). If the supervisor is hard to deal with, I wouldn't welcome sharing my tips with him/her. Dealers should focus on training for a new career ASAP.
It is just another reason why Vegas, and Nevada for that matter, should diversify its economy on a greater scale. We can't have nearly a good chunk of the populace be in the casino industry and having to deal with all this nonsense as stated in the article.
Comment removed by moderator. Comment was in all caps.
I TOTALLY AGREE WITH BABYBOOMER...Unless the Supervisor is going to wait on my hand and foot, then he can get a tip too..until he does, he's out of it as far as I am concerned..
@fw190d You work for minium wage and you're a Republican. You must be kidding. It's your Republican friend who want you to work for minium wage. Never be able to advance and if your a dealer for them take your tips and do the splits with them. Steve Wynn is Republican to the core. So it get right, learn the facts!
Forget about the arguement that it is stealing. From the Gaming Commissions point of view, it is 'CONFLICT OF INTEREST.' Anytime you allow persons, with the authority to grant comps, to receive tips, that persons willingness to grant comps will be subject to if and how much the player tips. Favoritism will be rampant when issuing comps. Tantamount to the enforcement of the Alcohol Awareness Policy. The only way a player will be cut off from being served is by not tipping.
I have got to laugh. If it wasn't for Wynn they wouldn't make any money, nor have a job, and you call him a communist. This is pure greed on the dealer's part.
We used to give supervisor's a share of our tips without anyone having to ask us. We appreciated them taking care of our game, comping the customers at our table, responding promptly, and keeping chips on the table. We felt good about sharing our good fortune. It takes a team to make good tips. Starts at the top with an owner that brings in the quality of play that gives these crybabys an opportunity to make this kind of money. Boo Hoo.
Today's dealer is a monkey in a suit that never smiles, never provides service, gets mad at those that chose not to tip, rarely is talkative, but expects a tip for being there. That is a joke.
I watched this profession go down hill for forty years. The dealers have less skill, have no appreciation for the person who brings in these players that fill their pockets, and for the most part wouldn't know "how to take care of a customer" if they had a flow chart. They cry if a customer smokes, cry if they're rude, cry if they don't tip, cry, cry, cry....Good for Wynn!!
The simple solution to combat this injustice towards the dealers is to STOP TIPPING, and work out a way to compensate them later away from the eyes of management..
big mike
I would rather be a conservitive than somebody that wants the government to give them hand outs
and spend money that we don't have
its people like you that think its the republicans fault that they won't extend unemploynment benefits when all they want is for the democrats to pay for it up front with some of the stimulus money from last year that hasn't been spent yet.
and best of all as a conservitive I have enough to walk away from the green felt jungle and I wish the same for you
those of you relating mr. wynn's tip pooling to that used in restaurants are making a false analogy. when tips are pooled in a restaurant it is among those that have constant, direct customer contact--the tips are for a service provided. additionally, those sharing the tips are on roughly the same level of hourly compensation and rely on tips to make up the bulk of their earnings. the tips are not pooled with the restaurant manager.
casino supervisors are paid significantly more than dealers--not that dealers are poorly compensated. supervisors don't have constant, direct customer contact. they do not provide a service to the customer. they are supervising the employees who are providing the service. therefore they should not be included in the tip pool. taking from lower wage earners to give a raise to higher wage earners is bad form and very petty.
but coming from mr. wynn, none of this surprises me. he can--and will--get away with this because jobs are scarce. when the economy corrects itself this policy will be corrected by people flocking to jobs where they are treated with respect.
in detroit casinos (mgm included) it is illegal for supervisors to accept tips. tips are pooled and reserved for the dealers.
in the poker room if you try to tip the floorman they politely say thank you but we are not allowed to accept tips.
Dealers make hourly wage, supervisors (contract Salary) should split their Christmas bonus with dealers period.
fw190d has said it all.....
If the dealers kept there own tips , table for table, then yes it would be unfair to spit with floor people. However they pool them. So the ruling is fair.
It won't be too long before the casinoes keep all the tips.
It would seem that tip sharing among dealers and supervisors would create a conflict of interest.
Since the supervisors are supposed to be watching the dealers (cheating, collusion, mispays, disputes, etc.) does this now mean that dealers and the supervisors now have a vested interest to make money?
I wonder if a "generous tipper" will get better treatment at Wynn table games since the supervisors get a piece of the action now?
Also -- this goes out to any full-time Wynn dealers: What is your average tip take home per week? Just curious what kind of money can be made as a full-time dealer at Wynn/Encore.
As always, check out my LV blog:
http://jimmyhoofa-lv.blogspot.com/
"This is the end result of all the bright lights... and the comp trips, of all the champagne... and free hotel suites, and all the broads and all the booze. It's all been arranged just for us to get your money. That's the truth about Las Vegas. We're the only winners. The players don't stand a chance. "
-- Sam "Ace" Rothstein, Casino, 1995
Is it any surprise that this ruling went in favor of Wynn? MGM/Harrahs/Wynn/Sands and the bunch run this corrupt town and they can get away with whatever they want, including robbing dealers of money that is intended solely for them. If a player really wanted to tip a floor person he would hand him the money. When I tip a dealer I expect the tip to go to the dealer, not the suit standing behind him.
If Wynn had made this decision in the beginning BEFORE they accepted job offers, it would be one thing. But since Steve Wynn strutted into a mandatory meeting and said the dealers had 7 DAYS to adjust their lives to their pay cut, HE IS IN THE WRONG. The floor supervisors were dropping like flies due to being over worked AND underpaid. In the 1st 6 months SEVERAL quit due to this. I couldn't and can't blame them. All that needed to be done to make the job the 1 that they applied for was to hire a few more to ensure 2 days off a week. Or at least so that they were not working 14-21 days in a row and most 9-12 hour shifts. Because this is what was going on. This was NOT what they left their previous jobs in the understanding that this is how their livelihood would be going. Wynn made NO effort to hire more supervisors to compensate for the ones that were working their butts off and not getting paid for it. They are SALARY. But they accepted the job offer knowing what their salary would be and knowing on occasion would have to work overtime. We are all in that understanding working in the casino business. What they DID NOT sign up for was being over worked CONSTANTLY. Instead of hiring a few more supervisors on each shift to provide the much needed REGULAR days off Wynn thought it more appealing to take it upon himself to SHOVE his hand into the dealers pockets and say "You're paying for my short commings." God forbid after putting out $2.7 BILLION to build Wynn he sure couldn't afford the $230 a day it cost per supervisor.
It's funny how they mention server and bus boys, when at the wynn the server have to split tips with managers as well, I can't believe Food & beverage Department have not done anything about this as well....
I am a Supervisor and agree with the tip pooling policy!! I hope all the Casino's in this town follow in the footsteps of Mr. Wynn. Hey Dealers, hows that Union working out for ya?? It looks like you lost the Tip pooling argument and you also get to pay Union dues on top of that!!
No doubt things have changed for dealers and floorsupervisors. All casino workers must understand that the casinos spends millions to bring in the gamblers. The employee spends zero! Many casino workers think they are entitled, or they are the straw that stirs the drink. Maybe many years ago this was true, but now we have a new breed of casino workers that do not understand they are in the hospitality and entertainment business. Many dealers do not greet the guest, many come to work in wrinkle uniforms; do not speak to follow workers; deal the game in an unprofessional manner, and consistently complain about what management should do for them.
The Wynn dealers brought this whole mess upon themselves. Maybe not all of them, but reasonable people did not step in and take charge when Steve ask for a simple request. The dealers bit the hand that feeds them. So Steve give them the horns.
I don't see all the major casinos like MGM following suit, but I lay odds Harrah will jump high on this ruling.
What a sad day for Vegas. The nearly blind owner robs his employees blind...Apparently that hooker didnt slap him hard enough to knock some sense into him.
"denver21" go ahead and talk smack but i bet those union workers will keep their jobs alot longer then you.
cbarrious wrote...
"those of you relating mr. wynn's tip pooling to that used in restaurants are making a false analogy. when tips are pooled in a restaurant it is among those that have constant, direct customer contact--the tips are for a service provided. additionally, those sharing the tips are on roughly the same level of hourly compensation and rely on tips to make up the bulk of their earnings. the tips are not pooled with the restaurant manager."
You are incorrect, at least at Wynn. I know several restaurant managers at Wynn. Although a few of the rooms are not "tip pool rooms", most of them are - and the managers DO get a cut!
I am a middle manager at a hotel casino, and I hope my bosses are reading this! I can't WAIT to get a cut of my employees' tips!
Money = Power. Mr. Wynn has Money witch means Mr.Wynn = Power. It's really no big the surprise that The decision for tip pooling went in his Mr. Wynn's favor. Republicans are the scum of this earth. No one in this town will ever beat Mr.Wynn or any of these corporate casinos. I miss the days of old Vegas Dunes new frontier the sands ect. They had it right. Now it is Greedy old wigs who take every las dollar for anyone who dares to enter their casino and try and win or make a buck. This is not capitalism it is pure Greed. How is that fair? Seeing most wealthy people are born into it. Let us the dealers keep are tip. Yes, I am a dealer in one of these Las Vegas casinos. Let's just say, this is not his pizza nore his palace. Mr. Wynn you are the man in life and this town. But when your maker calls upon you. You Billions can't pay him off.
I can not believe Steve Wynn would go so low and to be so cheap as to take the dealers tips, and for the labor commissioner to think it is all right.I bet if it was his tips that were being taken he would rule differently.The supervisors are paid alot more and do not earn or need the tips.Hey Steve try living on the minimun wage.
to Michael1 I was a server not to long ago at the wynn for 3 years, the only restaurant that don't pool tips are the cafe's and the buffet all the other gourmet rooms as they call them are pool tips and all the manager do get a cut and in some restaurant almost a full point, which means that they do almost as much as a server, and what does a manager do in the floor, verily nothing just spend all there time in the office...
"By pokertd
July 12, 2010
4:18 p.m What I find interesting is how many people who are posting about this keep referring to this as "stealing" As I understand it you cant run a blackjack pit, craps pit, poker room...etc. without supervisors as well. They are there to protect the interest of the house, make sure players are getting tracked and taking care of their needs. It is not all about the dealers and yes most of you can be replaced rather easily. The floor managers and shift supervisors should be cut in a portion of the tips because they do a lot to keep the games full and players happy. Bottom line is dealers are greedy just like everyone else."
DEAR POKERTD THIS IS ONE OF THE BEST POSTS TODAY, THANK YOU.... KNOW LETS GET A CLASS ACTION SUIT ON ALL THESE DUMB A-S'S THAT DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU NEED TO DO TO STAY IN BUSINESS WITH ,KING OBAMA AND PRINCE REID. THANKS AGAIN. EMVANCE LAS VEGAS
I've seen pit bosses get tossed a black chip or a couple of greens now and then for giving a comp to the 'gourmet room'... Bet your ass that the pit boss did NOT put that money into the tip pool to share with the dealers.....
sorry god[ stevie boy], your a cheap son of a b----, what's next mistro, pool side tips being shared with your mistress. this guy is a plague in your town, he's not the savior, he's your demise, took the strip and ruined it.
BULL**** it sound like a little socialist country (CHINA)
Its sad.. I kinda feel sorry for ol Steve-O.. He used to be someone in this town that EVERYONE admired. Now he is a joke.. a laughing stock. More known for his ex wife taking half, putting his elbow through a Picasso painting, and stealing his dealers tips to pay his management what he thinks they are worth but doesnt want to pay himself.
Sounds like it is time for the dealers to unionize. It is BS for Wynn to do this. Now all the casinos will be screwing dealers. The new modis operandi in vegas. Screw all the staff as hard as you can. Go NY bankers and your financial models.
NRS 608.160 Taking or making deduction on account of tips or gratuities unlawful.
1. It is unlawful for any person to:
(a) take all or part of any tips or gratuities bestowed upon the employees of that person.
(b) apply as a credit toward the payment of the statutory minimum hourly wage established by any law of this State any tips or gratuities bestowed upon the employees of that person.
2. Nothing contained in this section shall be construed to prevent such employees from entering into an agreement to divide such tips or gratuities among themselves.
Where does it say steve wynn can take tips from dealers and give them to other employees?
So don't go to WYNN. Thats my plan.
Wynn's "Toomb" is "Verboten".
His "Joint and (City Center)is "Verboten".
I love "Club Grazie" for a excellent stay.
Dealers are basically PAID minimum wage, about $60 per shift. The Floor is paid $225 per shift. What is the difference between the Floor and the dealer? It is NOT "education" as the Floor comes from the ranks of the dealers. So why are the Floor paid so much more? Because they are not allowed to receive tips as per Nevada Gaming Control Law. NGCL states that ONLY a "Supervisor" can enter cash transactions to comply with the IRS. This makes the Wynn CSTL's "Supervisors" then doesn't it? Then if they are also receiving tips, there is a violation of the NGCL. When a casino operator willfully violates NGCL they face fines and possibly lose their gaming license. Maybe Wynn's license should be REVOKED.
There is a solution to all of this that will satisfy everyone, including Wynn, the dealers and the Floor. The solution will be presented very soon, but it is too early to "tip" our hand.
Hey Mikey, you left out #3:
3. Steve Wynn can distribute his casino chips in his toke boxes to anybody he wants too.
Its a fine line I know but the way I see it is that the casino chips are the property of the Casino until redeemed by the Casino. The toke box that those tokes are placed in are a property of the Casino. I see nothing legally wrong with what Mr. Wynn is doing even though it might not be the right thing to do in some peoples eyes.
Concernednative: The Wynn dealers do have a Union that the tragedy in this. The Union basically agreed to the %15 tip share!! Great Union, now the dealers are stuck for the tip share and they have to pay Union dues for weak representation!! This is happening at Caesars Palace as well. In fact not only are the Caesars dealers going to be sharing their tips, they are also going to be working 80/20's instead of 60/20's. Basically, Union Casinos have Tip Share and Non-Union Casinos don't have tip share!! Go Figure....
There is nothing prohibiting patrons from directly mailing their servers a thank-you card stuffed with dead presidents effectively tossing the casino & revenuers to the curb, while the unexpected appreciation DIRECTLY received by your servers' becomes reciprocated into a priceless "investment".
I simply request a mailing address from the servers I wish to reward, while informing them I'd like to send them a thank-you card worth receiving.
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denver 21
I see that you think their is no skill in dealing wait till things get worse in the economy
and they get sticky fingers catch them if you can or lose your job
bye denver 21
i have submitted an editorial to the sun but i fear it will be rejected due to it's length. i couldn't make my point in 250 words. that's not a lot of space to work with... i will make my argument here.
to all you naysayers, to those of you who say go back to school and get a real job, dealing cards is simple. i would challenge you to spend your first hour breaking in and see how you do. i'll even offer to "shadow" you.
i agree with you to a point. i could shave down koko the signing gorilla and teach her to deal blackjack in 2 days. the flip side would be that when she felt she was needing a tip, she'd take it. when you get a blackjack and stack up your 37.50, she'd just take the 2.50 and you wouldn't argue with a 600 pound gorilla
customers as a whole have no concept of dealers as being people. they treat us like human vending machines. rarely a please, never a thank you. the occasional tip but overall, no respect whatsoever. people give more consideration to the person behind the counter at mcdonalds...
what we do is not just an art, it is a craft taking many years to perfect. it takes many many years of effort to make what we do look simple. can any of you do this? multiply (35 X 14 + 17 X 11 + 8 X 9) come up with the answer in 15 seconds and make it look easy? now, what happens when a customer asks for a purple cheque? ok, how do we do that with one hand, make it look easy and make it proffesional?
i put it to all of you that we are one of the last tradeskills left in america. it takes years and years of practice and effort to make what we do look simple. it is an industry standard that it takes 5 years of practice in craps before you're considered to be a "dealer". most people have a hard enough time playing it, imagine dealing it.
in essence, you tell me that since i know how to type, i must be qualified to work as a software enginner. it's just pressing keys on a keyboard, right?
my 8 year old daughter knows the alphabet and she is therefore qualified to work in human resources because the alphabet is all you need to know to file papers in files.
simple skills, right? you know math... tell me then, if every 6 pays 5, what does 100 pay? is it proper? no. does it pay 116, yes. how do you know that? training and practice.
you insult me, my trade and yes... my art. it would truly shame you to show how inept anyone of you would be.
we provide no food, shelter or needed service. we serve for entertainment. however, don't be so quick to tell any of us that dealers are disposable. you couldn't do it.
Does anybody still gamble at Wynn/Encore? LOL
Shame on you Steve. It's about treating your employees well and they will take care of you. The cost of bad moral is greater than the savings of tip splitting. Don't screw your employees, they are the people that got you your billions....and they have your customer's ear Steve. Do the right thing...change is very bad decision and set the good example, not the bad.
Since we are in a democratic country, Steve should give all his casino dealers a democratic choice: split the tips or walk out of the door.
Hey Denver 21,
Nowhere in the statute cited does it say anything about your reply.
They are not wynn's casino chips. The player has possession by winning the chips. The player gives the dealer a tip. Tip now belongs to dealer.
The law is very simple yet lawyers and their ilk always try to complicate things. Of course $$$$ can buy any lawyer, judge, or politician.
When the State legislature changes the statute then it will be law not when you have law changed by judicial fiat
hate to be the one to point it out to you unclegig, we don't live in a deomcratic country, we live in a republic.
something the common man is slowly waking up to and catching up with.
If the corporation has dominion and control over the tips and there allocation, then wouldn't this qualify as income for the corporation and need to be filed as such for IRS purposes? I wonder if Wynn has included this income in their tax returns since 2007 or have false income information been filed by a gaming licensee?
Denver21 just smacked you dealers in the face!!! Ouch!!!
Here is a link to the Nevada Gaming Control Law
http://www.gaming.nv.gov/documents/pdf/m...
Now what does it say about "Supervisors"? And who is performing the tasks dictated by Nevada Gaming Control to be done by "Supervisors"? The CSTL's at Wynn? Hmmmmmmmmm, they must be "Supervisors" then huh? And what does the Law say about "Supervisors" and tips?
Denver21 knows not of what he speaks. He is telling half-truths again.
The Union did NOT agree to a 15% taking of the tips at either Wynn or Caesars Palace.
BTW Denver21, to punish or retaliate against an employee for their union activity is a violation of Federal Law under the National Labor Relations Act. So are you saying that is what is occuring at both Wynn and Caesars Palace? I guess it may be time to bring in the Feds then.
So I guess that Harrah's can incorporate retaliatory acts against the dealers at Caesars Palace and not against those dealers in Las Vegas who work for Harrah's who have not voted to organize? This will get interesting when the DOL gets involved.
Go Steve I knew you would win again.Doesn't matter how many rounds.Now I'm in the casino business also and you have the option to move to another house!So do it.;We've heard enough already
Six players on the table and each and every one of them have bet on the number 17. Click-clack-click, the ball drops in the number (provided the dealer could spin it without the ball immediately falling out of the track or shooting it out of the wheel and sending it flying across the casino floor) 17!
Six people have 17 loaded! Okay, so we have the person with the white wheel chips who is playing with dollar value chips and they have a total of 16 corners at 8-to-1, 9 splits at 17-to-1, 16 straight up at 35-to-1, 18 streets at 11-to-1 and 11 alleys at 5-to-1. NOW PAY IT OUT and DO IT QUICKLY AND SEEMLESLY!
We also have the person with the green wheel chips who is playing with five-dollar value chips and they have a total of 13 corners at 8-to-1, 23 splits at 17-to-1, 27 straight up at 35-to-1, 29 streets at 11-to-1 and 19 alleys at 5-to-1. NOW PAY IT OUT and DO IT QUICKLY AND SEEMLESLY!
We also have the person with the purple wheel chips who is playing with twenty-five-dollar value chips and they have a total of 9 corners at 8-to-1, 17 splits at 17-to-1, 7 straight up at 35-to-1, 8 streets at 11-to-1 and 14 alleys at 5-to-1. NOW PAY IT OUT and DO IT QUICKLY AND SEEMLESLY!
Gee, we have 3 more players still waiting on their payouts, and they could be just as complicated! And a dealer DOES IT ALL without the aid of a calculator and should be able to make EACH AND EVERY payout in less than 2-3 minutes total time (if there is no apron assisting them).
And who walks away during the transactions because they can not figure out the payouts and do not want to be caught in a jackpot if they are wrong? THE FLOORMAN!
I would like to see the "monkey" or the "break-in" accomplish this task. Then spin the ball and do it all over again and again for the next eight hours! Let's not forget to "smile" and "be happy" and "converse" with the customers while we are mucking up 300+ chips between every spin of the ball too. And make sure that we get the minimum number of hands-per-hour out as well so the casino can have their advantage! Oh, and make sure that we give directions to the person who is leaning over the glass and asking where a partiucular restaurant is at. And where is the Floor? Standing at the podium drinking water and complaining about having to put ratings in.
Then when the players walk away, the Floor comes over and has the audacity to ask, "What was that guys average bet? How much did they walk with?"
This is a sad day for all tip-earners in Nevada. That includes the single mother working two jobs for tips to feed her kids, the bartender at your local watering hole who now has to give part of his tips to the guy moping the floor, the slot attendant who paid out your jackpot at the bar who has to now verify a tip given to him so that he can take it back to split with some supervisor who has never left the office, the hairdresser who now has to give part of their tips to the person who is writting down appointments in the book, etcetera.
A sad day for Nevada tip-earners. Let's see what happens to forclosures and bankruptcy levels now when the tip-earners of Nevada have to "share their wealth" with those who are paid higher salaries.
steve wynn is not a republican or democrat nor independent,his donations or to what party Candidates he thinks will serve him, so when you see him back someone you know it will not be in your best intrest
No more tipping, and I don't got no stinking players card, junior.
watch a good craps dealer or roulette dealer work and maybe you'll appreciate what they do a little more.it's a thing of beauty. most people on this board could never do it.
I am a supervisor at a major resort on the strip. Take it from me, the supervisors do not deserve any portion of the tips. For people who have no clue, the dealers put up with soo much from the costumers. From sexual innuendos, to smoke being blown in their face, to players crying about losing too much. Is dealing an unskilled job? Yes. But the mental anguish is out of this world. The only thing that makes the job bearable on most days is knowing that you will make pretty good tips. As a supervisor I don't put up with any of the junk that the dealers do. I was once a dealer and dealing with the public on such a close and personal relationship was crazy, so, I knowing the money would be less I became a supervisor and no longer have to put up the public. The key here is I KNOWINGLY did it. The dealers at Encore really have nothing to complain about. They took the job knowing what they were getting into. The dealers at Wynn have every reason to complain. Mr Wynn changed the rules in the middle of the game. He also knows that with the unemployment rate so high in town, the dealers just have to "dummy up" and deal.
Are the supervisors getting the same lowly hourly wage as the dealers? If not, then I say cut their pay to the same level if they're gonna share in the tips..... If they're going to be paid a higher hourly wage than the dealers they're stealing from then I say they do not deserve to share in the tips. I also contend that the integrity of a game IS compromised now that the supervisors realize that the decision they make could make or break their potential tip. One can not remain unbiased in their decision making when the result of their decision affects their 'pay' - albeit in the form of a tip. Wynn is scum.
mykaelJ and a few others are obviously in the industry and have a clue about what they are talking about--most people posting here have no clue about this situation or industry and love rubbing salt into the dealers wounds. Basically the casino and directly the dealers still make the lions share of the income for the casinos performing their work each day. It is a damn shame the corporations don't treat the dealers with any respect and continue to take things away at every chance. Eventually you will run all the best people out of the industry and the service will be on par with walmart or mcdonalds. Weinberg is totally wrong--AGAIN--and the labor board is obviously "influenced" by the corporate power brokers who will get their way at any cost. Does that make it right??? Not at all.
This is so wrong! I'll never go near another Wynn casino.
I am a cocktail waitress in the casino and every day I have to tip out the bartender, the bartender's breaker for that hour he or she is on lunch, I have to tip out the porter who takes the glasses and cleans them, and I also have to tip out the cashier when I cash in my chips/tokes. I believe the ruling was justified. Every hand washes the other in this town. Thats Vegas! The "team leads" do a lot in assisting in the customer service. The only thing that I think is that I believe this should have been determined since the opening of the casino, then there wouldn't be any problems as the dealers would already know what to expect. I also have to say that the Wynn is the best gaming resort in town!
You really expected Wynn to lose ?? (trying to ask that with a straight face isn't easy) Wow, how long have you lived here?? Or still a tourist??
j1979, if you're having to tip out all those extra people I would suggest you make sure that their hourly wage is no higher than yours - usually min. wage - I would esp. check out the cashiers wage - cashiers usually make above min. wage and this is a first hearing that the cashier is sharing in the tips. My son's been in the industry for years - tips out bussers, bartenders etc. but has never been made to tip out a cashier - so check to ensure that the cashiers hourly wage is the same as yours - if it's higher then I say you need to speak up on that one.
I'm surprised Wynn hasn't found a way for someone to give a tip to a slot machine - and then give a portion of it to the slot techs. Those "floor supervisors" make close to #30.00 an hour whereas a dealer makes minimum wage on top of Tips (called Tokes actually). If they are required to split their Tokes, then the supervisors need to take a pay cut. While we are at it, why not pool tips with everyone in a casino, Wynn. As an administrator, I'd sure like a little extra on my pay check each time. If I take 10 cents from each employee each time they are paid - I'd be sitting pretty happy.
Steve Wynn's having employees share pay is an old trick. It's used in the car selling business. Share commissions with your boss! Let him get his own commissions or tips. Meanwhile Wynn blames the financial climate on Barack Obama. He forgets about the 2 Repub Govs, apparent unsuccessfull attempts at "fixing things". This tip decision should make him a little happier. Maybe he'll decide to stay?
I've never had to work for tips nor have tips part of my weekly salary. I am sensitive to those that are and understand when I deal with those that are I return to the same people that helped me initially so that he/she gets that Gratuity.
Yes it all comes from whinning supervisors,Wynn just didn't decide to change the rules the supers complained,and complained till he did something about it now turn around and look at the super behind you and you will know why your sharing your tips.So Wynn takes the heat for them.
I am astonished by Tanchek's (the labor commissioner), decision. I am completely convinced that this man was paid off by S. Wynn. It is more than disheartening that justice cannot be attained. If supervisors make $225 per day plus tips and dealers, minimum wage plus tips, where is the disparity here? Common sense. What the hell happened to JUSTICE? Is this America? No! Unfortunately, Corporate monies dictate. The officials that have the power to do the right thing cannot see past the lining in their pockets.
There have read alot of things written here and I respect all of them...... NOT! I wonder about those that are completely oblivious to a casino dealers job... and/or self seeking.
I think Steve Wynn stinks! His total disregard for the working men and women in his establishment. Those floor managers became floor managers because they got sick and tired of people blowing smoke in their faces. They knew good and well what they were going to be paid to be floor managers and that is that! The don't work half as hard as the dealers do! Steve Wynn will never see any of my money! Just because it is not against the law in Nevada to allow this tip splitting, it is a moral issue and I wonder in my opinion who got paid off to see this in favor of Wynn! The moral issue is the lazy floor managers are dipping into the pockets of the dealers. Maybe the slot techs should petition to get some of the tips from the floor managers that they got from the dealers. In my opinion Steve Wynn is an American Bourgeois! I hope the earnings in his establishments keeps going down!
I am a dealer and i do not belive in the tip pool share but i may have a solution if the floor gets part of my tips i should get part of his salary
floor 235 + tips
dealer 60 + tips
not fair at all regardless of tips earned
how about floors and dealers paid at same rate
just split the pool and the salary
new split floors and dealers would make
117 a day + tips and the dealers would split half there tips with the floors
I know alot of dealers in town would love to make that kind of money think your local casinos that dealers are only making 50 to 100 a day + there 60 buck base rate this seems more fair
people on this form are forgeting alot of things that all of there superviors are or where dealers! Most supervisors are burnt out dealers who did not want to deal with the customers anymore or dealers who could not deal due to the toll it takes on your body the bending over all day long or the pain that devlops over millions or hands suffled and delt they would rather pucnh ratings in.
Being a floor has gotten harder casinos have gotten rid of boxmen, pit clearks, and pit bosses and make floors watch more and more games casinos are not trying to make the table game expericance better for guests there trying to kill the bizz totally
If harrahs could run slot only houses and be competive it would why else would they put 6to5 blackjack on 8 deck shoes and play 15 for 1 not 15to 1 on craps there trying to kill tables foucs more on the machines.
Anyway people wonder why dealers dont talk as much or smile anymore or speak english! Its becuse the job does not pay well enough anymore!..
Dealers used to make great money and could support familes on it try getting into the biz today and you end up working downtown for min wage plus 30 a day in tips..
so what do you get asian dealers who cant talk to you. you dont get good looking girls anymore they make more serving drinks...
So for the people on here who say leave the job people have and do leave and it forces people to take floor jobs becuse they pay better. Now your asian and non freindly dealers cant get promoted so you are stuck with them dealing you cards
this policy was put in before the economy crashed in 90% of casinos on the strip the floors no make more than the dealers and now your gonna take a job that is already hit 30% and give more away it will only force more jobs out. that leaves worse and worse dealers to do these jobs and they have made jobs like ceasers wynn and hard rock (the hardest jobs to get) into places where bad dealers are need cuse thats it that is left.
I take pride in what i do i been dealing for 7 years and love dealing dice it is an art when dont right and is a fun job but I have to move on becuse it does not make sence anymore.
the casinos have cut my match on 401k my benifits and thats on top of the already negative parts of the job ie weekends and working holidays its just not worth it anymore and its sad that esp in this economy that a job is that bad you walk away from it.
now the caisno i work at does not give tips to floors yet but the fear is that this will spread across the stip and that is a very scary thing to know you have a job that anyday your boss can take 30% of your income away
When I play at the tables and see a dealer that give good service you want to tip, but when you know the pit boss with the nice suite and all the bling on that yells at the box man do you realy want him to get some of that tip? So people will tip less I think!
the cocktail waitress comment is the pure example of my theory: the corporations are presenting themselves as huge casinos with excellent everything, but then, if you look behind the curtain, you see the nasty reality. the corporations are taking full advantage of the "unwritten system", generating millions and billions on the shoulders of others, not even paying their people a fair paycheck, and in a consequence, making them completely depending on tips. Just picture this: a cocktail waitress must pay the bartender and the bartender breaker plus the person that's cleaning up the casino from empty glasses. I mean, hey, that's just ridiculous. In other words, the casinos are too tight to pay a fair paycheck to the people and everybody get's what he deserves?
If I want to tip the cocktail waitress because she's extremely pretty and brought me my coffee, then I am not thinking of tipping other 4 or 5 people in the casino. Next thing, the tip goes in a percentage to the hiring manager who decides who's going to keep the job,....and who is not.
If this happens, my fine and interested readers, the term "tipping" becomes a completely new meaning: "palm greasing"/ job security, etc.
IF the cocktail waitress "must" share her tips with others, I think then dealers also must share them. How about pooling them all, just like in most European casinos? They pay a decent paycheck to everybody, guaranteed, and collect all tips, but then, distribute a percentage of these tips on top of everybody's paycheck. You could think this is an unfair policy, maybe, but then I will tell you that it's completely unfair that a cocktail waitress will also have to share her tips with others.....(not officially, of course).
The system will not work out if people stop tipping. I am sure the economy already made people cut down their tipping, simply because there's not enough money available to tip. But then, if there are not enough tips anymore to share with everybody, the service industry in the casino will have to revolutionized completely. That's how I see it.
From Switzerland
I have never been a floor supervisor. But, for a long time have felt they are underappreciated. When Las Vegans had class, the dealers took care of the supervisors. Now, good, easy job and all they do is complain, and whine. Most are like robots anyway. Yuck.
If working for Wynn is so horrible, apply downtown.