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AP Photo/Scott Sady
Gov. Jim Gibbons discusses his speech with Dan Burns, his communications director, as the governor prepares to give his State of the State speech upstairs in the Capitol building in Carson City on Monday, Feb., 8, 2010.
Tuesday, Feb. 9, 2010 | 2 a.m.
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State of the State
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Gov. Jim Gibbons gave an emergency State of the State address at 6 p.m. Monday, Feb. 8. Video is courtesy KVBC Channel 3.
Sun Archives
- Governor plans emergency address on Nevada budget (2-7-10)
- Governor’s speech will lay out state’s budget problems (2-7-10)
- State budget comes up $800 million short (1-22-10)
- Forecast: Economy will begin to rebound in mid-2011 (1-22-10)
- Gibbons’ no-talk order further divides branches (1-22-10)
- Special session may require help of state Supreme Court (1-10-10)
Sun Coverage
The lesson of the night was that no matter who’s talking, the message is motivated by politics.
In a State of the State address that sounded more like a rallying cry for conservatives to re-elect him, Gov. Jim Gibbons on Monday burnished his credentials as a slasher of government, holding the line on taxes against the forces of bureaucrats, politicians and unions.
And in his party’s response, Senate Majority Leader Steven Horsford called for changes in the state’s tax structure after the economy improves.
By night’s end, nothing new was gleaned about the state of Nevada and the two men’s differing visions for its future.
For his part, Gibbons hit the highlights that will play to a Republican base. He landed punches on the Legislature, decried that “unions dictate Nevada’s education policy,” complained about the lack of help from Washington, and mocked the notion of raising taxes. “Even with $1 billion in new taxes, the state budget is now nearly $1 billion short. You tell me, did raising taxes work?”
He quoted from Ronald Reagan, about how government programs never go away willingly. He said “we much accept that limiting government means expanding personal responsibility ... I will ask our citizens to accept less from government and to take more personal responsibility.”
He attacked state spending, even if studies show Nevada spends the least nationally, as measured as a part of the economy, or funds education at among the lowest levels per pupil in the country.
“Nevada,” he said, “can no longer pay for the bloated government services, which were funded when Nevada’s economy was booming.”
On education, he said, “It’s time to stop whining that education in Nevada doesn’t work because of a lack of funding. We need to quit throwing money at programs that haven’t worked and don’t work for our children.”
Meeting reporters after his speech, Gibbons denied he said state government was bloated, and then said he had been referring to previous budgets.
Gibbons’ staff last week released proposed cuts that included 10 percent reductions in school districts and higher education. In total, the cuts he submitted would equal $418 million. Still, that’s not even half of the $881 million needed to balance the state budget.
Pundits were hardly surprised that Gibbons, suffering from poor poll numbers and with an empty campaign chest to stage a comeback, would deliver a politically stoked message.
“The governor’s speech came off as more of a candidate’s speech,” said Fred Lokken, a professor of political science at Truckee Meadows Community College. “Overwhelmingly, it was a Republican attempt to define the problems facing us and appeal to the Republican ideology.”
“This was a campaign speech, more than a State of the State,” said Eric Herzik, a political science professor at UNR. “It was heavy on slogans and symbols to appeal to his base.”
Even as lawmakers have agreed to not raise taxes and to work together to solve the budget crisis, Gibbons took swipes at the Legislature, which is controlled by Democrats.
“The balanced budget I submitted imposed no new taxes and allowed no expansion of state government. The Nevada Legislature disregarded my solution. They raised taxes $1 billion, and they made government bigger. They made the wrong call.” In his remarks after the governor’s speech, Horsford, a Democrat, agreed that taxes were off the table in the short term, but said the Legislature must enact a “fair, broad-based and equitable” tax structure when the economy recovers.
“We must invest in economic growth and expansion,” Horsford said. “And we must learn from the mistakes of the past so that we never return to this period of time where we are forced to choose between meeting our basic obligations and investing in our future.”
Horsford said that rather than considering tax increases, the state’s tax structure should be analyzed and changed to make it more stable and fair.
After the speech, Horsford said Gibbons “seemed more focused on promoting issues to his base, than leading as governor.” Despite the shots from the governor, Horsford said he was willing to work with the executive branch — or its staff at least. “The governor came to one meeting, for 5 minutes last week. I’m not sure how engaged or not engaged he is.”
Herzik didn’t have any laurels for Horsford’s legislative response, either. “Everything was put off to the future. We need to change the tax structure, but not now. We need to make cuts, but not the ones the governor is making,” he said. “After listening to Horsford’s and Gibbons’ speeches, the one thing that you’ve learned is that an election is coming up.”
"The governor came to one meeting, for 5 minutes last week. I'm not sure how engaged or not engaged he is."
The public who are victims of Gov. Gibbons lack of leadership, know he's not engaged.
Code Translation:
Big Corporations, good
Big Banks, good
Big Tax Cuts, good
Bombmakers, Big Pharma and Big Insurance, Good
China products, good
High Consumer Spending, good
High Trade Deficit, good
Patriot, good
Conservatives, good
Gingrich, Luntz, Rove, Palin, good
Labor, bad
Small Business, on their own
Family Savings, on their own
Education, see Television-Movies-Related Gadgets
Doctors, on their own
Maybe he is the only one with the gut to do what is needed to save Nevada from ruin.
We need to get rid of this loser next election and get a real Governor who understands what the job entails...
IF the legislature had listened to the Governor last year when he told them cuts were needed the state would not be in the condition its in.
You cannot spend your way to prosperity, in Nevada or Washington DC
Amazing, and typical. The Governor has been consistent in his candidness regarding no new taxes. The legislators gleefully over road him, and increased taxes. Their efforts did not work so now it is obvious the Governor is a loser. Critical thinking at it's worst.
"IF the legislature had listened to the Governor last year when he told them cuts were needed the state would not be in the condition its in."
NO-Neiman, if the idiots (GOVERNOR) would have listened the the economists, they would have devised strategies to diverisfy the economy. What our "leaders" chose to do was keep the lazy parasitic habits they always enjoyed and let gaming and any other big business off the hook. Gibbons didn't even attend the meetings when the economy was being discussed last year, he (or big business) already made up his mind.
Who voted for this idiot? Can't you find another place to live? I hear houses in Detroit are even cheaper than here. Please buy one before the next election.
Good one, Gregory. This guy complains about schools doing a bad job? Well, he oughtta know what a bad job is. The schools are one of the biggest bargains around here. Gibbons sure ain't, though.
Somebody needs to take this spoiled brat's toys away. What a creep.
No mater how anyone feels about both speakers last night or whatever the side of politics you are on, it was a campaign speech. It should not have been used in that context. It just goes to show that both sides are out for themselves not for the people of Nevada. Kick them all out and start over. Not wondering about this at all.
Per Gibbons the Legislature raised taxes by $1 billion dollars and the State still has a $1 billion deficit. Wouldn't that mean that if the Legislature had not raised taxes the current deficit would be $2 billion dollars?
Gibbons pledged "No New Taxes" before the last Legislature and then introduced a budget which demanded tax increases.
He demanded an increase in the room tax and then cowardly refused to sign it into law. Instead, he hid from it and let it pass into law without his signature... or veto.
He signed a pledge to the taxpayers of the state of Nevada that he would veto ANY AND ALL tax increases.
Nevada voters can't trust a lying republican like Jim Gibbons. I hear Sandoval is more of the same.
This man is an embarrassment to the office of Governor and the State of Nevada!
I understand that there are different opinions about how best to handle this financial crisis, but taking advantage of your office to give a campaign speech is inexcusable. Gibbons does not know what it means to be a leader and should be ashamed of his behavior.
Dickerjd,
Not necessarily. When you raise taxes you change behavior. For example, doubling the modified business tax punishes businesses for hiring more workers and paying them more money. To avoid the tax you lay off people, make a hiring freeze and or lower wages.
Tax increases never raise as much as they hope because they alter behavior in a negative way - they almost never account for that.
The smart thing to do last secession would have been to cut spending down to projected revenue levels rather than raising taxes. That would have provided the necessary cushion for the private sector to get moving again. Personally, I would have slashed the MBT all together, that would have pumped nearly $300 million into the private sector. Nevada would, in all likelihood, already be on the road to recovery if we had.
By raising taxes on an already depleted economy, our legislature basically kicked us while we were down and prolonged the recession.
Sblour,
Government does a terrible job "diversifying" the economy. They almost always invest in the recent fads which flop just a few years later.
Also remember, diversifying the economy is meaningless if you don't grow the economy as well.
Nevertheless, Nevada has been diversifying the economy (WITHOUT government direction). Moody's Analytics provided the proof during the Nevada Vision Stakeholder's Group meeting earlier this month. It showed that gaming in Nevada made big gains, but so did other sectors of our economy. Our economic diversity index actually increased and did so faster than several of the comparative cities.
Anybody seen Reid, Jr.????
What are his thoughts on all this?
He is promising to raise taxes by the billions to fix all this. Is he really?
Oh......I think I see him under the rock over there.
Go get him before he moves on to a different rock to hide under.
Maybe it's time to turn the whole state back to the Feds -- turn it into a one giant nuclear dump/test zone.
Would the last one to leave the state please turn off the lights? Thanks.
The legislature didn't raise the right taxes and fees. Nothing on mining, which takes the profits out from under out feet. Instead, they did the tourists with room tax, car rental, etc.
So fewer tourists now, fewer taxes. Also, remember when times were good? We decided to cap the property taxes. We decided to remove the tax on food at the grocery store.
The Governor's speech, Horsford's response the "debate" between Washington and Leslie on Public TV did nothing to inspire confidence in our "leaders'" ability to adequately address the challenges that lie ahead.
Ah yes, the evil MBT!
The tax rate for MBT to .5% for the first 62,500 in total company\employer taxable wages (that is, wages AFTER lavish deductions), and 1.17% for all remaining company\employer taxable wages after deductions. 1.17% of post-deduction wages is not the jobs killer that they would have you believe.
Furthermore, why obfuscate the diversification issue? The businesses of Nevada can diversify all they like, but so long as our tax structure heavily targets a few industries rather than businesses as a whole, revenue continues to be volatile.
ksand99 posted...
"Gibbons pledged "No New Taxes" before the last Legislature and then introduced a budget which demanded tax increases."
...where do you get your information? The article above says this...
"The balanced budget I submitted imposed no new taxes and allowed no expansion of state government. The Nevada Legislature disregarded my solution. They raised taxes $1 billion, and they made government bigger. They made the wrong call."
Ksand99 is lying; Gov Gibbons' budget did NOT demand tax increases; the mere notion that a budget could demand a tax increase is absurd. This is not rocket science, even a moron like ksand99 should be able to understand it...a budget can only be balanced in two ways, either decrease spending or increase taxes. The Republican Governor wants to decrease spending; the Democratic Legislature wants to increase taxes; it's a pretty clear choice.
Governor Gibbons' budget relied upon tax revenue from increasing the room tax. That is a tax increase.
When it passed the Legislature, Gibbons did not veto the tax increase. He allowed it to pass into law.
Enteaser would rather call fellow commenters "morons" than be truthful.
http://www.lvrj.com/news/41139677.html
"Republican Gov. Jim Gibbons' announcement that he'll let a hotel room tax increase take effect without his signature has prompted state Senate leaders to accuse him of misleading them and being a political coward."
"Senate Minority Leader Bill Raggio, R-Reno, said Wednesday that Gibbons, while opposed to most tax increases, indicated he would approve the 3 percent increase in Las Vegas- and Reno-area room taxes if the plan had voter support."
"If he is now not going to sign it, I and others have certainly been misled," said Raggio, one of four Republicans who joined with the 12 Democrats who control the Senate to give final legislative approval to the tax plan on Tuesday. Five GOP senators voted "no."
"Raggio said Gibbons "proposed" the room tax, which was supported by voters in the Las Vegas and Reno areas in November, in the state spending plan he outlined in January, adding inclusion of the plan in the budget was "one of the reasons I supported it."
Said Horsford:
"Once again, the governor has chosen to abdicate his responsibility to lead Nevada. After including the voter approved Room Tax Initiative in his budget, he has taken the easy way out by choosing to take no stance on the initiative. It is without a doubt that we are not in normal times. Jobs are disappearing and entire industries are suffering. We are at a crossroads. We must face the future with courage and competence, not with the cowardice the governor has demonstrated today."
"It is clear that he lacks any vision for what Nevada should be now and in 20 years and that the people of Nevada cannot trust what he says or does. Legislative leaders will have to do the hard work to balance the budget responsibly. The hard work started today and will continue until our work is done on behalf of the people of Nevada."
Patrick,
You are too smart a guy to really believe that raising the MBT by such a small amount a few months ago has caused an $881 million dollar deficit this biennium. You can make a good case for reduced government spending without exaggerating the impacts of decisions that you don't like. You are seemingly trying to blame our current fiscal problems entirely on taxes, and that is disingenuous.
Raise taxes, lower taxes or freeze taxes -- none make any sense until they overhaul the entire tax system. We cannot continue along our current path. If we are hit with another situation that scares tourists away from traveling, then Nevada is really DOA. What did we learn from 2001 terrorist attacks? What did we learn from the sky-high gasoline crisis? Take those lessons and apply them to a new tax structure that is not dependent upon visitors to this state. Residents need to pay their own share. If it is too onerous for you, then you may need to look to a less progressive state where you can take your particular brand of no.
Azbycx
The MBT takes about $270 million out of our economy each year (and would have been more if the economy hadn't shrunk as bad as it did).
The effect of the MBT is to reduce wages and employment since it is a direct tax on every dollar paid to every employee.
It didn't cause our deficit, but it did reduce our ability to climb out of the economic recession. It contributed to our high unemployment and it helped fuel boom town government spending in a ghost town state - meaning it gave the legislature the opportunity to sustain our unsustainable government spending for one more year before they would have to go back and make adult decisions on what to cut.
Irresponsible spending is the culprit. This spending was fueled by high taxes, specifically taxes raised on a housing boom. We taxed a bubble and then spent every dime. That is why we have the deficit.
This explains the problem: http://npri.org/publications/legislature...
This explains how some fiscal responsibility would have prevented the mess: http://npri.org/publications/about-that-...
edgewise,
what exactly is your point? You posted..."Enteaser would rather call fellow commenters "morons" than be truthful."
...I would much rather that fellow commenters would not lie when they post like ksand99 did and I documented how and where he was lying. But not you, you come in here and accuse me of lying but everything you posted agreed with what I had just posted...you never pointed out one thing that I said that was NOT the truth. Ksand99 and you are either liars or morons, and that is the truth.
Gregory,
Good posting. Sad but true; the Republicans are marvelous in getting working people to vote against their own economic interests. You can bet any Republican bill does the opposite of its title: "Clear Skies Inititative" (read: polluters are allowed to increase toxic emissions); "Consumer Protection Act" (read: personal bankruptcies no longer protect you from big corporations); Patriot Act (read: no representative could vote against this... why, it would be unpatriotic(!), regardless of the junk that is really in the bill); No New Taxes (read: we'll drive down wages, give tax breaks to billionaires, and the "little people" are on their own).
ecm
Not so good. You state..."The legislators gleefully over road [sic] him, and increased taxes. Their efforts did not work so now it is obvious the Governor is a loser. Critical thinking at it's [sic] worst."
Are you a graduate of Nevada public schools?
Enteaser, it's a documented fact that Gibbons proposed FY09-11 budget included revenue from an increase in the room tax.
"As expected, the governor's budget also included a 6 percent cut in state worker salaries, including those of teachers, and an increase of 3 percentage points in the hotel room tax in Clark and Washoe counties. "
http://www.lvrj.com/news/37701409.html
In essence, he demanded an increase in the room tax, and his spokesperson, Dan Burns, confirmed this.
Later, when Gibbons refused to sign a bill for a tax increase that he a)demanded via budget and b)said he would sign, Gibbons ducked out and let it go into law without his signature.
He was criticized by Grover Norquist:
"The room tax hike is a blatant violation of the Taxpayer Protection Pledge that Gov. Gibbons' signed as a candidate." said Grover Norquist, president of Americans for Tax Reform. "The Governor and his staff have repeatedly and falsely asserted that it is not a violation of the Pledge if the taxed industry agrees to the hike. The Pledge is a simple one page document that includes no such loopholes or technicalities."
You can call people morons but you can't refute facts, enteaser. I've given citations for these facts. When you've got some facts to offer in rebuttal, let me know.
the republicans talk the talk but they don't walk the walk.
if you like the republicans, vote for sarah palin for prez...she'll set you free! (of your money).
then she'll give you a bible to console yourself when you can't feed your kids.
oh well, that's those republicans for you, folks!
"The lesson of the night was that no matter who's talking, the message is motivated by politics."
hi writer. how is this any different from any other POLITICian, regardless of party line? get off the crack please.
sam55; Are you really correcting my grammar? No substantive comments, just correcting my grammar?
edgewise,
Here's what I posted from the article...
"The balanced budget I submitted imposed no new taxes and allowed no expansion of state government. The Nevada Legislature disregarded my solution. They raised taxes $1 billion, and they made government bigger. They made the wrong call."
...now that is factual. How does an increase of 3% in the existing room tax qualify as a new tax? I was responding to ksand99's post which also said..."He signed a pledge to the taxpayers of the state of Nevada that he would veto ANY AND ALL tax increases." He, Gibbons, did promise the voters/taxpayers of NV no new taxes. But those same voters/taxpayers voted to increase the room tax and therefore Gibbons reluctantly went along with this tax increase.
Ksand99 also said in his post, the one I responded to, and I quoted earlier..."then introduced a budget which demanded tax increases."
...Unless you are a moron, edgewise, you know damned well that the Governor can NOT demand tax increases. The Governor proposes the budget and in this case he proposed going along with the voter mandated room tax increase, and the legislature has to approve the budget and send it back to the governor for final signing. As the article says, the Legislature raised taxes $1 billion instead of cutting spending $1 billion to balance the budget.
You have provided no citations/links to refute these facts. I await your reply, but if you do have something that refutes what I have said, then I suggest you contact the author of this article.
REAL SOLUTIONS FOR NEVADA:
Economic diversity through energy with Senate Majority Leader Reid and Governor Reid. Nevada is ripe climate for wind and solar in energy legislation over the next 18 months. Make alternative energy in Nevada US-owned, not China-owned.
Stronger PTA involvement by parents in local schools. If both parents are working different shifts, even so, one should make an effort to be around PTA and homework. Funding increases are not everything. Cuts are coming to some degree, but GOOD PEOPLE INVOLVEMENT makes BIG DIFFERENCE.
More professional people in small business involved making National Merit Scholarships achievable goals in CCISD. More CCISD seniors taking programs-courses at UNLV, CCSN to see future options, where they are going, or not going with their performance.
For ANY cuts-freezes to teacher salaries, make sure the raises the Governor gave to staff are rescinded, and then cut by the same cut-freeze.
Cut firefighter base salaries in CC. These wages are probably high to support cheaper property insurance for gaming, operating mega properties. Start putting the math house in order, even in micro budget decisions.
CCSD: This district is too big, for cost synergy reasons. But ISDs are not corporations, they are teaching-life lessons-role model factories. Enact a 10 year plan to cut the district in half, making things competitive for outcomes and residential property values.
Promote that public schools provide more diversity and larger work groups-programs than private schools, a key to being successful in today's corporate entity.
Promote smaller, local banking. Mega banks are not contributing to the tax structure in Nevada, as gaming's partners. Small banks with local stewardship-decision-making promote stronger, sustainable communities. Pare off some of the corporatist dependency.
The state and university system should work with Mayor Goodman (who is pro), Reid and Jim Rogers to bring Cleveland Clinic to Clark County with a hospital and referal clinic.
There are way too many retired people-doctors churning Medicare residing in a cheap tax structure. Their discretionary income may go to local's casinos, but this arrangement does not serve Nevada or healthcare outcomes. Cleveland Clinic will raise all provider boats, providing an excellent place of referal.
Cleveland Clinic will not enter a market with only low cost reimbursements and Medicare rates, which need to go up to support teaching hospitals. National healthcare reform is essential.
Grind and save, because there are no real quick fix solutions to the national or local economy.
When the rules and playing field are fair, the daily grinders win in the long run. It's time for Americans (particularly shareholders) to stop whinning because a few aren't getting real wealthy on passive investments at the expense of 41 percent of Americans being underwater on their mortgage, with no savings.
Every biennium, the Governor drafts an Executive Budget and submits it to the Legislature.
The Executive Budget is the Governor's recommended program for the coming biennium expressed in dollar terms. It is an overall plan of recommended expenditures necessary to execute his proposed program, together with an estimate of income expected to be available to support these expenditures.
It is, in essence his recommendations and demands for funding levels and taxation levels for the state government.
While a candidate for Governor, Jim Gibbons signed the Taxpayer Protection Pledge and trumpeted this as his leadership philosophy.
The pledge he signed reads, "I, Jim Gibbons, pledge to the taxpayers of the State of Nevada, that I will oppose and veto any and all efforts to increase taxes."
It was signed and had Grover Norquist as witness.
Now, seeing as then-Governor Gibbons submitted an Executive Budget recommending an increase in the room tax, this is a strict violation of the letter and spirit of the pledge he made to the taxpayers of the State of Nevada.
He, furthermore, informed Legislators and the media that he planned to sign the tax increase, violating the oath he made to the taxpayers of the State of Nevada.
Once the room tax increase passed the Legislature, Jim Gibbons failed to act on his pledge and chose not to veto the tax increase, violating the promise he made to the taxpayers of the State of Nevada.
These are not opinions. These are facts. Gibbons was criticized by the man who witnessed Gibbons' pledge as having violated it, Grover Norquist. Gibbons was asked to resign by conservative activist Chuck Muth over his "betrayal of trust" over the room tax increase.
http://muthstruths.blogivists.com/2009/0...
"Nothing this governor says can be believed by anyone any more. If the governor declares the sun will rise in the east tomorrow, you'll be wanting a second opinion. And there's just no way to deal in good faith with someone like that."
Muth went on to use stronger language and called Gibbons a liar on his tax pledge.
This isn't criticism from liberals, it's criticism from his base. From the people who campaigned for him and who touted his fiscal credentials during the election. Even they can see what enteaser refuses to acknowledge.
Jim Gibbons is a liar and violated the trust of the taxpayers of the State of Nevada.
ksand99,
Nothing in your voluminous (I thought there was a word limit?) post addresses what I said...
"How does an increase of 3% in the existing room tax qualify as a new tax? I was responding to ksand99's post which also said..."He signed a pledge to the taxpayers of the state of Nevada that he would veto ANY AND ALL tax increases." He, Gibbons, did promise the voters/taxpayers of NV no new taxes. But those same voters/taxpayers voted to increase the room tax and therefore Gibbons reluctantly went along with this tax increase."
...there is a big difference between Gibbons allowing a new tas on the voters/taxpayers of NV, (which he did not do), and allowing a tax on tourists to be raised, which those same NV voters/taxpayers approved.
"I thought there was a word limit?"
Apparently enteaser hasn't seen sergio's rantings and ravings.
sergio is certainly off the rails today Like one of Ozzy's crazy trains.
The only place this guy is comfortable is in a deserted parking garage or a hate-talk radio station where softball interviews are served up daily.
Enteaser, my post directly addresses everything you've said. Gibbons pledged to veto any and all tax increases. He did not. He broke his pledge.
In fact, he supported raising taxes through the room tax increase that he demanded in his Executive Budget and his spokesperson acknowledged his support for the increase.
Those are the facts, no matter how you try to spin it.
To spin him as anti-tax does not square with his record. His record directly contradicts your dogma. Sorry.
"Now, calling someone a liar is a pretty strong accusation. But when it comes to Jim Gibbons and this whole tax issue, I don't know how else to put it."
"When he was running for governor, Gibbons made this promise, in writing: "I, Jim Gibbons, pledge to the taxpayers of Nevada and all the people of this state, that I will oppose and veto any and all efforts to increase taxes." Short. Plain. Simple."
"Two months ago the governor broke his pledge by proposing in his budget the third largest tax hike in Nevada's history. Proposing ain't opposing. Strike one."
"Then, instead of admitting he broke his campaign promise, the governor compounded the deception by claiming that a non-existent "vote of the people" loophole is found somewhere in the Taxpayer Protection Pledge he signed. Strike two."
"Pouring salt into the open wound, the governor then began claiming "the people" voted for the 3 percent room tax hike last November. Not."
"First, what appeared on the ballot last November was a non-specific advisory question in only three of Nevada's seventeen counties. And the wording of that question wasn't even close to the wording of the actual bill passed by the Legislature this week. So the actual room tax proposal the governor's talking about never, ever appeared on any ballot anywhere in the state at any time. Strike three."
"Secondly, even the advisory question wasn't approved "by the people." At least not if "by the people" you mean, like, you know, ALL of the people of Nevada, including those where the question never appeared on the ballot."
http://muthstruths.blogivists.com/2009/0...
"The governor knows this. And yet he continues to claim his tax hike was "the will of the people." It's simply not true. Strike four."
"On the campaign trail the governor promised to veto any and all efforts to raise taxes. Now he says he won't veto the room tax hike. Strike five."
"The governor also said he would sign the room tax bill if passed by the Legislature. Now he says he'll let it take effect without his signature. Strike six."
"Nothing this governor says can be believed by anyone any more. If the governor declares the sun will rise in the east tomorrow, you'll be wanting a second opinion. And there's just no way to deal in good faith with someone like that."
"Some people are now saying the governor is "irrelevant" to the legislative process for the remainder of this session. I disagree. He's toxic to it. And in the process he's doing irreparable harm to the Office of the Governor, the state of Nevada, the conservative movement and the Republican Party."
"Botched swearing-in ceremony, botched appointments, botched staffing, botched agenda, botched budget, botched media relations, scandals, a messy divorce, lawsuits and unending investigations. This administration is a Category 4 disaster."
"I voted for Jim Gibbons in 2006. Seemed like the right thing to do at the time. But he's betrayed our trust. So now it's time for him to resign. And that's no lie."
http://muthstruths.blogivists.com/2009/0...
Quite simply, enteaser, you've chosen to believe the word of a proven liar, contrary to the facts.
Your insistence to the contrary is not supported by a rational argument, nor by Gibbons' record.
Furthermore, your lazy and ill-considered distinction that the room tax increase is "not on Nevadans" is beside the point. Gibbons promised no more taxes, on anyone. He made no distinction, yet you cling to it like a liferaft in the face of the Titanic.
If your dogma is anti-tax, then you should, if intellectually honest, admit that he supported, demanded and chose not to veto a tax increase. Any Nevadan who travels to Lake Tahoe to stay in a resort, or travels to Carson City to visit the Nevada State Museum is forced to pay more in taxes, thanks to the Governor.
In short, you've made a distinction without a difference, all in the service of trying to keep your fantasy of Gibbons alive.
Quite simply, I've chosen to believe what I read in the papers, including this article above and the 2 articles that edgewise linked in his posts above....here are the relevant passages...
Mar. 12, 2009
Copyright Las Vegas Review-Journal
Senators decry Gibbons' refusal to sign room tax
"Raggio said Gibbons "proposed" the room tax, which was supported by voters in the Las Vegas and Reno areas in November, in the state spending plan he outlined in January, adding inclusion of the plan in the budget was "one of the reasons I supported it."
"As for both Horsford and Raggio, Gibbons said they expressed reluctance about supporting the room tax plan and he chose to do the same by letting the tax plan become law without his signature."
Jan. 16, 2009
Copyright Las Vegas Review-Journal
"Thus, Gibbons' budget includes a tax increase that would raise an estimated $292 million over the biennium. The 3-point increase in the hotel room tax was approved in November by Clark and Washoe county voters."
,,,I have no fantasy about Gibbons. He said and the SUN reported...
"The balanced budget I submitted imposed no new taxes and allowed no expansion of state government. The Nevada Legislature disregarded my solution. They raised taxes $1 billion, and they made government bigger. They made the wrong call."
...so the 3% increase in the room tax was estimated to raise $292 million in new taxes...where does the other $708 million come from? My point was that Gibbons wanted to balance the budget by reducing spending and the Democrats in the Legislature wanted to raise taxes.
Finally you've accepted that your use of the word "demand" was incorrect as you've now said "propose" instead. The Governor can NOT demand anything from the Legislature, especially a Democratic controlled one...we're making progress here, ksand99, you're learning.
The Governor demands things from the Legislature whenever he wishes to do so. His impotence is not an issue. Maybe you're unclear as to the definition of "demand?"
True, the Legislature has the power and authority to say no. However, since the State of Nevada has a balanced budget amendment, and the budget that Gibbons gave the to Legislature was predicated on increasing taxes, to paint Gibbons as anti taxes is, well, a lie.
You keep glossing over the salient points: that Gibbons gave his public approval to the tax increase, that he did not veto the tax increase, contrary to the promise he signed to the taxpayers of the state of Nevada.
You may be too stubborn to admit you were wrong, but that fact has been proven here, enteaser.
You're obviously of the 11% who still think Gibbons has done a great job and approves of him. That's more proof of stubbornness and a reluctance to admit the truth than anything, enteaser.
edgewise,
You have proven nothing here except that you don't know the meaning of the word "demand". Even ksand admitted that he proposed rather than demanded the room tax hike...
"Two months ago the governor broke his pledge by proposing in his budget the third largest tax hike in Nevada's history. Proposing ain't opposing."
...and why did Gibbons propose the 3% room tax? I've already said it here 3 times but let me say it again for you Gibbons haters to ignore again. He went along with the 3% room tax increase because the voters of this state approved it on the ballot in Nov 2008. The voters feel like this tax is a tax primarily on the out of state tourists rather than on them. I don't agree with them and didn't vote for it myself but the Governor went along with it, reluctantly, as he says, because the voters approved it on the ballot.
Ksand99 and edgewise have created a straw man argument here. No one, not the governor or myself, is trying to say that we don't need taxes. We most certainly do! But the Governor is trying to balance the budget by cutting spending rather than increasing taxes on the voters/residents of this state. That is the issue and if you asked ksand and edgewise they would be against any and all spending cuts by the Governor. Like I said, they have created this straw man argument about Gibbons breaking his promise to not raise taxes. Gibbons only allowed this 3% room tax increase because the voters approved it. This is a tax that the voters/residents of this state asked for. Now take this estimated $292 million in increased tax revenues and use it to balance the budget. But the rest of the budget deficit should come from spending cuts.
enteaser, you're needlessly complicating a simple issue.
Gibbons signed an oath to veto any and all tax increases. He did not veto the room tax increase. He broke his oath to the citizens of Nevada.
No Gibbons apologist can deny the facts.
Now would be a good time to cut local, county, and state government by 50%, all across the board. Give the governor another 4 years and he might have the recession as a tool to rid us of government. Pass the tea bags, please!
Look at this guy! he's obviously had a stroke and didn't tell anyone. His right side of his face is a lil distorted , his right eye is lazy, He' just not right in the head, this man is out in lala land. Put him in a rest home and shoot him full of thorzine,slap some diapers on him and call it good. Pfffffffffbblllllt.