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September 30, 2014

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Letter to the editor:

U.S. headed down the wrong road

I wonder how some letter writers draw the conclusions they have by merely blaming Republicans and corporations for the demise now facing the working class in this country.

Where does the money come from that is used to pay decent wages and benefits? Is it not true that most of the union pension funds grow largely thanks to the earnings of the evil corporations that often employ those who will benefit?

One writer recently stated that Republicans refuse to allow a publicly funded jobs agenda. Obviously this person is too young to remember the Great Depression. As part of the New Deal, Democrat Franklin Delano Roosevelt was able to get a series of “alphabet soup” programs through Congress. When we entered World War II, virtually everyone went to work.

If Obama keeps the spending and manages to convince enough people to support to his measures, we are surely traveling down the path of Greece, Spain and other nations now facing economic failure.

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  1. You are right - when we entered WWII, everyone went to work.

    Defense spending is stimulus spending. The publicly funded jobs agenda of the Republicans is Defense spending and they embrace it with open arms, literally.

    Only the Government will be able to correct a broken economy. As in the Civilian Conservations Corps, only the Government can put people to work where the product cannot be sold on the shelf but only appreciated.

    During a time of economic collapse, wealth is stored in secret vaults. Grand Cayman and the Virgin Islands are swamped in cash waiting for the good times to return.

    If you are waiting for a Free Market Economy to restore America, look at Mexico. Their economy is nearly wide open but only benefits a fraction of the population.

  2. I agree with this letter. Until the failed policies of an immature and inexperienced Leftist president,who never met a payroll, or worked in business are replaced by policies that are business friendly, the economic performance of America will be anemic. Once Obama is replaced, and a new business investment friendly climate is created, the economy will take off in the right direction. The Left fears market based,private intiatives that stimulate the economy. They whine these policies have not worked in the past--which is another Leftist lie. The very thought of an experienced business executive taking charge in the Oval Office will remove the the lid on investments,job creation and venture capital infusions, as soon as Romney is announced the winner.

  3. Letter writer is right. It's not the party that is the problem. It's the policies of the party that are the problem. Roosevelt who had no understanding of economics, none, used keynesian economics during the 30's to bring the US out of the depression. Didn't work. Obama used the same old futile keynesian policies for the last 3 1/2 years. Hasn't worked. Like the 30's and FDR. Like Europe now. If he's elected, he'll do the same for the next 4 years. Governments can't spend their way out of recessions. It's a myth perpetrataed by keynesians like economist Paul Krugman who make a career of preaching and writing about them. The private sector is the engine that drives the economy at home and around the world.

    CarmineD

  4. "One writer recently stated that Republicans refuse to allow a publicly funded jobs agenda."

    Latchford -- not sure what your letter aimed for on this point. This part seemed to say FDR saved the country by putting everyone to work for government, then got us into WWII so everybody had jobs. That obviously isn't working today. Government workers are essentially parasites -- for the most part they are not self-supporting nor do they contribute to the GDP. Second, we have the world's mightiest military machine actively engaged in Afghanistan and roaming the rest of this planet looking for missions, so where's the jobs?

    "The private sector IS the wealth generator, not government which acts as a leech and a hinderance on the private sector."

    RedRocky -- so glad to see this basic economic truth from someone else!

    "...Socialist governments traditionally do make a financial mess. They [socialists] always run out of other people's money. It's quite a characteristic of them." -- Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, in a TV interview for Thames TV "This Week" on Feb. 5, 1976

  5. It's definitely relevant to blame some elements of business for the plight of the working class. Greedy Wall Street and Banking interests created the credit crisis in their race for profits. The unfortunate thing is they had to be rescued by the Government to prevent even more damage to the working class.

    Their actions have cost this country and it's present and future taxpayers many trillions of dollars in economic stimulus costs and property values. The fact that these business geniuses present themselves as the ones most capable of solving problems they could not see coming only six years ago leaves me suspicious, not only of their motives, but also whether they are nearly as qualified as they want us to believe.

  6. "Where does the money come from?" Says it all. If we keep discouraging and attacking workers / taxpayers and their employers, how much longer can we go on? Print more money? Can't. We've printed it all. What happens when the inflation hits for the artificially low interest rates? Something has to give--for forcing interest rates down. Right now, we're offsetting that inflation with the deflation from the economic stall.

  7. RefNV,
    Print your sources so people can judge whether what you are asserting is anything other than propaganda.

  8. Trickle down economics and the financialization of the economy is squarely the reason for the this economic collapse. The way out is clearly the way of Franklin Roosevelt.

  9. The obfuscators and paper shufflers are clearly conservative democrats,Ron Paul supporters and Republicans.

  10. "Of course, their knowledge of history (are you listening Carmine?) is no more than a 2 on a 10 point scale...'

    Based on the liberal rewriting of American history BUT not on actual historical facts and circumstances. Read more than the liberal school textbooks if you want to really know history.

    CarmineD

  11. Existing government spending will bankrupt this country...and quite soon. That's not a political problem. It's a mathematical certainty.

  12. WRT the CCC, it was a make work project. Term and temp employment at best. After his one year service, my father, a CCC supervisor, was back on the unemployment line in 1933. Not until 1941, when Japan bombed Pearl Harbor did he have another Government job at the Kearny Shipyard in NJ as a machinist balancing propellers on subs for WW2. That lasted until the yard closed in 46 after the war ended. He went into business for himself. Something he could do because the economy, thanks to the war, was back on the mend.

    He told me many of the men were too old and weak to stand the outdoor southern to put out forest fires and rebuild roads. He would tell them to find some shade under a tree and back up the front line workers, who were doing the actual work, with food, water and supplies. For fear they would die from heat stroke and exhaustion.

    CarmineD

  13. When the CCC concept was revised in the early 90's under President Clinton by General Don Scott as the National Civilian Community Corps [NCCC], it put an age requirement on the members. 19-26 years old. Why? Among other reasons, many of the projects and tasks of the NCCC then and still now simulate the CCC from the 30's and the physical standards had to be higher.

    CarmineD

  14. @VidiVeritas,

    Your link to that Bruce Bartlett conversation is extremely informative. I'm fascinated with pundits and politicians who speak with sanity and common sense but are ignored or denounced by their party. Several of these conservatives have spoken, such as Jeb Bush, and had to walk back comments because the loonies went off their nut. Meghan McCain often makes more sense than her elders but is immediately attacked by "catty women" reffering to her weight. That is the state of the GOP/Tea Party, zero tolerance.

    I'm still waiting to see the FEMA re-education camps and Presidents Obama's private army brought up in conversations by politicians elected to Congress. Oh, did I forget the communists within Congress Allen West refused to give us the names of? Is he conspiring with commies? Joe McCarthy would have a field day with West's knowledge. Why isn't Darrell Issa on top of this?

    We are not heading in a wrong direction. This country will survive all of the present day insanity as it has in the past. This right wing explosion sending some off the deep end is nothing new. Hopefully this cycle of paranoia will end soon and we can get back to taking care of our hard working citizens, not the "economic vampires" sucking the wealth out of the country.

  15. The new French Prime Minister, Jean-Marc Ayrault gave a speech to the National Assembly on Tuesday and announced the plans for the new Socialist government. Next year the French need to cut spending by about $43 Billion to meet the goals of 3% deficit of GDP. Their solution is to hire 150,000 additional government workers and tax all income over 1 million Euros at a rate of 75%.

    Personally, I think this is insanity but many posters here have advocated he similar things in the past. It will be interesting to see how this works out!!!!!

  16. Is it possible to use US military to build all these new roads and bridges in the grand infrastructure spending plan? This way the military could be expanded, men trained and housed military style and work would get done, people would have jobs and skills when the time is right for them to go into private sector jobs.

  17. X FACTOR:
    Government spending/creating jobs DID NOT end 0Depresseion.
    Government spending on WWII DID NOT end the depression..
    What ended the Depression was "Disposable Goods (blowing stuff up/replacing said stuff) and REDUCING POPULATION...fewer workers..
    It has been cynically suggested that the Viet Nam war was a government spending/population reduction measure to cure a stubborn minirecession in the 1950's. Too many babyboomers coming of age..
    The US cannot cure unemployment when a new worker enters this country every 11 seconds..
    And Obama welcomes them with a "work permit"..

  18. Vidi?
    Was Eisenhower a Democrat?

  19. Viddi
    Those are regulatory agencies.
    I want all of them eliminated or reformed..
    For Instance..Social Security..I know people who worked and paid into SS..and get about $800 a month while people who never worked or who have autistic children make $900+..
    I am blind..I went blind in November suddenly. I have trouble spell checking..so bear with me.
    I also have become acquainted with all the "social programs" for disabled people. There aren't any..not for working folks..

  20. JahReb
    You are confused..
    The "TeaBaggers" are liberal who watch CNN
    The "Tea Party" are conservaties who watch Fox
    The Tea Party wants the Banks to be regulated as Public Utilites
    The Tea Baggers want more stimulus loans to Solyandra

  21. If Obama is reelected it will be the end of the United States as we know it...

  22. Kepi:
    Living in Hawaii..His grandmother was a bank president? Some middle class..
    Obama lied in his autobiography. He has been called a liar by Hilary Clinton, Joe Wilson, One of the Supreme Court Justices...and the Washington Post..He has 4 pinnochios for his new ads about Bain..
    When a person lies..I quit listening..
    BTW..did anyone notice Obama intoning that the "Supreme Court has spoken, Lets move on."
    Was he talking about "Citizens United?"

  23. Mr. Malone I am sorry to hear about your blindness. I think I understand what you mean about Social Security. When I went to the SS office to sigh up I was amazed at the fact that I was the oldest one there by a lot. When it was my turn I asked the SS worker why that was and was told that they are applying for disability. I was also told that the amount of disability applications has increased dramatically in recent years.

  24. jrtsr:
    I mentioned the blindness only because I have trouble proofreading my posts..
    I cannot work..but I have always had an unwavering faith in God..and God provides..
    He maketh me to lie in green pastures, he leadeth me besides the cool water..surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life and I shall dwell in the house of the Lord forever.

    And the government is not providing one dime :)

  25. It wasn't spending that ended the Depression. It was jobs. On December 6, 1941 there were 10 million men unemployed. Hard core unemployed for years. On Dec 7, and after, they joined the military to fight WW11. FDR had a peacetime draft with a cap of less than several hundred thousand soldiers. He swore he would never send American boys to fight on foreign soil. That all changed after Pearl Harbor was bombed.

    And the wifes and women who stayed behind found jobs in companies supporting the war effort. It was WW11 that broke the back of the Depression. Not the New Deal programs.

    Small businesses in the US create over 70 percent of all the new jobs created in the economy. They're not. Why? They are sitting on the sidelines afraid and watching and waiting. They lack confidence in the president and his policies to right the course of the ship of state.

    CarmineD

  26. Mr. Malone the point I was making about SS that so many seem to overlook the "freeloaders" that want something for nothing. My boys and I have a few friends that are local bartenders. People will use their EBT? cards to pay their bar bills. They will tell a bartender things that they would probable not tell anyone else. Many of them admit to scamming the system. They admit that it is easy to get assistance and do it for "pocket money". Yet when conservatives want to reduce the amount spent then they are called greedy.

    I have helped many people in my life. I have given away automobiles, good furniture, a lot of food and of coarse money. The difference is that I knew the need of the person and the conditions of their problems. None of us would hand out money to anyone that has a story without being aware of the circumstances. Yet it is ok for the government to continue to do just that.

  27. jrtsr:
    I agree with you. You do realize that most of the money for SSI, welfare and other programs is paid to the people who administer those programs..ie. social workers and clerks who can't or won't check every story. Around truck stops, the beggars are sent to the Trucker Chaplin on site for vetting..
    I also agree that getting a government handout is easier than having faith and trusting in God. I was intrigued by the long hard road:

    Lets Sing:
    This highway she's harder than nine kinds of hell
    The rides are as scarce as the rain
    When you're down to your last shuck with nothing to sell
    And too far away from the train.

    Ride me down easy Lord, ride me on down
    Leave word in the dust where I lay
    Say I'm easy, come easy go
    And easy to love when I stay
    (Billy Joe Shaver)

  28. How can anyone know if we are headed down the wrong road if they haven't a clue what the right road is?

    I'm not so sure that medical advances that will allow people in my generation (the baby-boomers) to live significantly longer are such a good thing anymore.

  29. Vidi
    You can wait wait wait..because you refuse to read read read..
    Eisenhower
    Eisenhower
    Eisenhower..
    add in Lincoln..Grant..Teddy Roosevelt and some other radical extremists..even Richard Nixon ended the Vietnam War that was started by Democrat

  30. Vidi:
    Teddy Roosevelt was a Republican
    Nixon ended the VietNam War
    "The signing of the Paris Agreement in 1973"

  31. El Lobo
    Yunno..the reason I am considering voting for Romney is because he is not a bully pulpit party hack with an agenda and a vision..
    I am heartily sick of agendas and visions from on high..I have my own..
    I elect representatives who are take my vision and agenda to Washington and enact it into law.
    The President is Chief Executive Officer..He is to faithfully execute the laws of Congress..elected by me..
    Obama has had ONE cabinet meeting in six months..He meets with his campaign advisors every two weeks..He campaigns endlessly...
    Obama cirumvents Congress..He has a vision..He executes his own agenda and the law and congress be damned..
    Romney is an executive..I think he will execute the Constitution and the laws of Congress ..I think I prefer that for a change..

  32. I would like to present a fairly simplistic view of political history, but I don't think my main points are far off the mark.

    No rational person will deny that the Republican Party of today has strayed far from its roots. The party, when first formed, had a significant number of Whigs at its core. The Whigs of the early 1800s were formed as a response to what was seen as heavy handed actions by Andrew Jackson, who is responsible for most of the core beliefs of the Democrats, even til this day.

    It is my belief that although there is no longer any gunfire (for the most part) the Civil is still being fought today. One should bear in mind that it was the Democrats of the day that wanted to punish the South, and the Republicans wanted to bring them back in as fully equal members of the Union.

    It seems to me that today's Democrats have taken Jackson's view of having a government to protect the people to a new level, while the Republicans have lost sight of their Whigish roots and have allowed religion to overshadow their true Liberalism. (I blame Reagan for this.) Like others, I would present Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt and Ike and exemplars of the best of what the Republican Party stands for.

    Classical Liberalism, as expressed in our Declaration of Independence and the Bill of Rights, is something that almost no one today has heard of, let alone learned about in school or understands. It will be very difficult, if not impossible, to find the right road again until our people have relearned, and embraced once again, those principles.

  33. botfx:
    I will repeat.. I am so far left, I am right
    I will also point out
    The Tea Party (fox conservatives) want the banks regulated as public utilites
    The teabaggers (cnn liberals) want stimulus loans to solyandra..
    Old Hickory (Jackson) is the hero of the Republican Party..because he fought against a british model cental bank...stuff like income tax and federal reserve are not Jacksonian..Now just look at the scandal of the libbor
    Get Ready For a Surprise in November!
    Lets Sing:
    Old Hickory said we could take 'em by surprise,
    If we didn1t fire our muskets till we looked 'em in the eyes.
    We held our fire till we seen their faces well,
    Then we opened up our squirrel guns and gave 'em a little...Well....we...
    (Johnny Horton, Battle of New Orleans)

  34. M. Malone,
    Careful where you point that gun...given your claim to functional blindness you are far more likely to shoot yourself or family or friends. Perhaps less hyperbole and more thought would help?

  35. mschaffer:
    Honest! Contrary to what Vidi wrote..Teddy Roosevelt was a Republican..
    I have always preferred "hyperbole" to lies and ignoarnce..
    But the last time someone accused me of hyperbole, Navistar w asverging on bankrupt...while paying a 10 million dollar penalty or is it a tax?
    Do you want to know what the difference between a tax and a penalty is? The penalty "Poofs" disappears into the discretionary funds of the regulatory agency levying said "penalty"..A tax goes into the general fund..Do you think a regulatory agency might be making and enforcing onorous and burdensome regulations with an eye to collecting all that dough?
    I leanred the information about the fine/penalty/tax..oh, it is a "penalty" because Catepillar is paying "penalties"to the State of California EPA...
    Then again..California just nulllied Federal Law..also not Jacksonian

  36. xtra,

    You have to admit it would be interesting to hear what Jackson would say about SB1070 and the Dream Act. :)

  37. "If Obama keeps the spending and manages to convince enough people to support to his measures, we are surely traveling down the path of Greece, Spain and other nations now facing economic failure."

    Interesting statement in light of the fact the EU went totally into austerity, cutting benefits, pensions, raising taxes, and more. They didn't follow what the U.S. did, and when faced with the lack of growth, zero now in many economies, they finally agreed that growth is a necessary part of the way out of the crisis, and part of the salvation of the EU...or the future U.S of Europe. Now they are doing more to bail out banks, and increasing their funds for sharing the responsibility to each other. Their is also some efforts to lighten up on the austerity demands.

    The Great Recession/Depression and following problems are the result of banks and financial institutions high risk gambling, outsourcing of jobs to other countries, fewer jobs in the U.S., minimal growth in wages over the last 30 years, the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, refusal to raise taxes, obstructionism by multiple parties on job creation, the encouragement to indebtedness of Americans beyond what they could afford to support consumerism, and the lack of savings by Americans. There are probably more reasons, but that is sufficient for now.

    It isn't over yet and isn't likely to be over for at least another 5+ more years no matter who is President.

    Taking an isolationist position is not going to help the U.S. in a time when there is increased effort to get ours and other trading partners to move to other agreements with China, and end trading in dollars.

    The global economics are complex. We are part of a global community that is increasingly competing for what we have had for a long time, including access to resources.

    Now, comes the TPP.

    Another brick in the wall!

  38. El_Lobo,

    I must disagree with you as well. *After* the Civil War it was the Republicans, and in particular the "Radical Republicans," that wanted to have the freed slaves have equal status in every way. It was conservative Democrats in the South that tried to block their actions in Congress. I think that we are arguing at cross purposes for no good reason if we were to properly define our terms and premises.

    My main point is that both parties have evolved in interesting ways from their founding. I would argue that the Democrats have taken Jackson's ideas to an extreme, while the Republicans have lost sight of the reason they came into existence and have exchanged their principles for dogma.

    In both cases, neither party today has any idea of what the word "Liberalism" means in its true sense.

  39. "Carmine said:

    "He (FDR) swore he would never send American boys to fight on foreign soil. That all changed after Pearl Harbor was bombed."

    Actually that wasn't what FDR said.

    He said he would not send American boys off to fight in a foreign war.

    El Robo Lobo:

    After all these years, the memory isn't what it use to be. BUT the point was spot on. Some, in fact more with time, say FDR knew, or should have known, the Japanese were planning an attack. Why? Their ministers walked out of talks with the US just weeks before the bombing. This incident after a long and strained foreign relationship with Japan. They teach you that in your liberal rewriting of history textbooks?

    CarmineD

  40. botfx:
    My favorite President is Harry S. Truman.so he must be a Republican, right?
    I didn't like Raygun..Must be the only Republican who doesn't but..he did advance our civilian communications with his star wars..satelites and such.
    All that aside..We can look back through history, see alarger picture, realize that all our presidents were flawed men searching for a new truth..a Constitutional Republic..
    That transcends party line..I salute and honor all of our presidents who are in the last analyis..public servants..and reflections of the public (republic) they served

  41. BTW
    I was wrong..at least partially in stating that the EPA "penalties" do not go to the Treasury. The penalties do..except some portion of the funds that are spent on internal programs..and some deals concerning "environmental justice" through the DOJ where the violator funds a project for the DOJ..
    You can figure it out..
    Justice Roberts stated that it was a tax on a legal choice..like cigarettes..only was a tax on not choosing..but the government cal..ls it a penalty

  42. xtra: Sorry to hear that you've learned about Nevada social welfare systems. We do NOTHING for workers and former workers (other than pay a social security part B premium.) Yet we have endless programs for children, custodial parents, handicapped kids, people who get their kids labelled handicapped when they are not..... Thankfully SSDI is there for you, such as it is. I keep saying, with little support probably because others are not aware, that we do nothing for workers. Many posters seem to not realize how tough it is once your kids are grown or you are single--we are just ignoring the millions of long-term unemployed singles who are not old enough to "retire." And then when you retire, you might get about $1K a month SS. See how far that goes. ps for the "compassionate" whiners: I am not retired, not on SS and will probably never qualify for any social welfare program--I'm living off investments, living modestly to moderately--cause I had it so rough as a kid that I've saved. And I have a high IQ and have made some good investment decisions. Can't afford to support too many others but I can get by.

  43. Roslenda:
    I got lucky..or God smiled on me ..because there were various programs and investment opportunities over the years that were offered at my job..little things I had forgotten about..but when I suddenly didn't have an income..I dug it all out, added it up..and I have a fairly good income..enough to get by..enough for a roof over my head and food on the table..
    I applied of the "free cheese" years ago..and the lady looked at me and said, "you don't qualify."
    So I learned..and I got lucky..I don't need the government checks..but I did apply before I realized what all the little things added up to and the government won't give a dime. My treatments are paid for by a private charity until I can qualify for Medicare..

  44. Roselende:
    When the government cut off welefare..all the welfare moms were put on SSI. I know one woman who would scream at her kid if he showed any interest in reading..She would reward him if she heard he had caused a ruckus at school..He was labeled "attention deficit" and she was paid for "diabled" child.
    Another one.. a relative of mine.. I found him on the internet..another..attention deficit kid..on ritlan all of his life..encouraged to "display his symptoms" and given attention for bad behavior...He is grown up now..I found his mug shot. He is a skin head covered in tattoos whose only job skills are physical intimidation. He is self employed as a drug dealer..and spends quite a bit of time in various prisons..but hey, mom got paid..never worked a day in her lazy life..

  45. Xtra: Would like to see your 5:20 post or similar on some other articles--so many dependent people accuse us of lacking the "compassion" that they have, while they collect and collect from government programs. Like K-12 teachers crying for ever more funding 'cause they have to "focus" on all the needs of deprived kids (illegals who get free breakfast and lunch--teachers take time out from teaching to have food drives.) Told them that any number of teachers have told me about seemingly normal kids with parents who pursued getting them labelled with ADD or Autism. And now the State is falling for it and gearing up legislation and funding while depriving the long-term unemployed adults who have paid in for years. Makes no sense to keep encouraging those who won't and those who can't while discouraging those who have worked and paid and paid and paid. Almost funny. Like the illegal high school students who are going into social work--they seem to think they can authorize more funding for illegal kids "cause their needs are not being met."

  46. "Actually, the Sunday that the attack at Pearl Harbor took place (December 7th) the Japanese ministers were meetingt with our Secretary of State, Cordell Hull. They were meeting with Hull when Hull received the news of the Japanese attack at Pearl Harbor..."

    That was a subterfuge El Lobo Robo to catch the US with their pants down so the Japanese could bomb Pearl Harbor on a Sunday while the US troops were asleep in their bunks.

    I read history. And I comprehend it. I know a subterfuge by a foreign power in a strained relationship with the US for decades before bombing the US. The Japanese were and still are notorious for this kind of behavior. Where have you been all your life? Watching MTV?

    CarmineD

  47. Here you go El Robo Lobo:

    http://www.apfn.org/apfn/pearl_harbor.ht...

    Connect the dots together.

    CarmineD

  48. Roselenda:
    There is nothing new under the sun..In Charles Dickens time, people would cripple children and put them out on the street to beg.
    Americans, no matter how poor, used to have pride.
    I don't know what the answer is..
    I guess you get what you pay for..

  49. It appears Mr. Latchford is a psychic too.

  50. El Lobo Robo:

    Your historical naivete is matched only by your blind acceptance of high school text book history.

    CarmineD

  51. Here is an excerpt from a review of Prange's book by Gaddis Smith, a teacher at Yale for American Diplomatic and Maritime History.

    Sounds like the Yale instructor supports my posts to you about Japan's subterfuge by meeting with US during the Pearl Harbor bombing and catching the US with their pants down. And the long strained relationship between Japan and the US for decades prior to the attack. All dismissed at the highest levels of the US gov't, inlcuding FDR.

    ''At Dawn We Slept'' adds some details to what was previously known about the American side and includes a useful if anticlimactic appraisal of the many American investigations into what happened, but here the main outlines of a familiar story remain unchanged. Failures of imagination, excessive adherence to routine, bad coordination and communication between Washington and Pearl Harbor and between Army and Navy, and bad luck contributed to the debacle. Almost everyone involved must share some of the blame, though almost all were hardworking men doing their best within their own limitations and the limitations of the system.

    Prange is sympathetic in his criticism, but his conclusion is clear, if not comforting. In a summary chapter called ''The Verdict of History,'' Prange analyzes carefully what the American military commanders knew at the time of the attack and how they misunderstood what they knew. These failures to realize ''at all levels'' what their intelligence information really might have meant ''have a common denominator - the gap between knowledge of possible danger and belief in its existence,'' he writes, ''... yet it would be a mistake of the first magnitude to credit the success of the Pearl Harbor operation solely to American errors. We have seen how meticulously the Japanese perfected their planning; how diligently they trained their pilots and bombadiers; how they modified weapons to achieve maximum damage; how persistently they dredged up and utilized information about the U.S. Pacific Fleet. They balked at no hazard, ready to risk a wild leap to achieve their immediate ends.'' In other words, when Americans argue about placing blame for Pearl Harbor they should recognize that the enemy was real, and, in Prange's view, first class. "

    CarmineD

  52. FYI on Mr. Stinnett

    "Robert B. Stinnett is a Research Fellow at The Independent Institute and the author of Day of Deceit: The Truth about FDR and Pearl Harbor (Free Press). He served in the U.S. Navy from 1942 to 1946, where he earned ten battle stars and a Presidential Unit Citation.

    He has worked as a journalist and photographer for the Oakland Tribune, and he is a consultant on the Pacific War for the BBC and for Asahi and NHK Television in Japan. In 1986, he resigned his position at the Tribune to devote himself full-time to the extensive and painstaking research through the Freedom of Information Act that was necessary to produce his book, Day of Deceit, and other work. He is also the author of the book, George Bush: His World War II Years."

    CarmineD

  53. Note Robo Lobo Stinnett's book post dates Prange's. Stinnett's is more current. Time reveals truth.

    CarmineD

  54. xtra: That's part of the reasoning behind my insistence that I pick my charities, you pick yours. If the dependents want more handouts, let them give to each other. My support varies but I tend to prefer talented individuals with limited opportunities, seniors who have worked and supported our way of life, people who give back / don't expect me to do for them. As in yesterday, I went out of my way to give an adjustable cane to a women who says hers was stolen. I didn't quibble or ask anything. Actually, I offered her several other items.