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Sunday, July 10, 2011 | 2:03 a.m.
By far, the Great Recession is the worst I’ve experienced during my 72 years. Particularly sad is the ignorance of the general public about underscored reasons for the problems we face today and the next five to 10 years.
Much cable chatter and clutter commentaries in newspapers pin the blame for high unemployment and lack of progress of any recovery on President Barack Obama. The mess is not of his doing. John McCain would be facing the same predicament had he been elected president.
As a Republican, I am thoroughly ashamed of the party I largely supported for 35 years. Our terrible fiscal mess resulted from failed policies and inept leadership during the George W. Bush administration. Presidents George H.W. Bush and Bill Clinton left the country on a healthy course. Both set smart tax standards. Clinton balanced the federal budget and left a surplus.
George W. Bush left office as our economy plunged toward the brink of a depression. Bush spent money like a drunken sailor. He enacted a Medicare prescription drug program whose cost is approaching a trillion dollars without paying or budgeting for it. His Iraq adventure, a war of choice, passed the trillion-dollar mark and that tab still grows. The worst decision he made, however, was the $1.3 trillion tax cut.
The only Americans flourishing in our country are the very rich who continue to profit from the Bush tax cuts, which Republican legislators refuse to allow expire. They tell you that taxes kill job growth. If that were true, the $1.3 trillion tax cut should have generated more than 20 million jobs. History tells a different story.
What we citizens want is fairness. Clinton brought about a balanced budget and a surplus by balancing revenues with spending.
You can bash Bush all you want and get no argument from me, but don't tell me Obama has no blame. No budget in over 800 days. Unemployment going up, not down. Another war on a country that is not a threat to us.
Thank you Mr. Morales, everyday I hear from life long Republicans who ask what's happened to their party. It's about time those with reasonable thinking spoke up and reigned in the crazies.
jldour - "No budget in over 800 days. Unemployment going up, not down. Another war on a country that is not a threat to us."
When are you going to stop taking Fox News talking points as fact? Once again, Obama submitted a budget plan that was shot down by the GOP/Tea Party. As for unemployment raising, did it cross your mind that city, state and federal layoffs is exactly what happens, unemployment goes up. Duh? You can blame those layoffs on those newly elected governors trying to balance their budgets. They give huge tax breaks to the wealthy and laid off working class people, teachers, firemen, police, etc. When the previous job report was released, John Boehner and Eric Cantor took credit for creating jobs. They said the last elections allowed the House of Representatives to help create jobs. Why aren't they jumping on this last bandwagon?
I agree about another war, but it's a toss up. Do you help our allies or ignore them when they ask for aid?
Vernos, I just don't feel we are heading in the right direction. Do you?
A Republican? I don't think so. I expected to see this sort of thing - and here it is: A Democrat spouting the Democratic talking points and claiming to be a Republican. Funny how your piece was published just a few days after the unemployment rate moved up again to 9.2 percent. Democrats can continue to blame Bush all they want but Americans are not buying it anymore. American's know Obama owns this failed economy. My God man, it's been over two years since he took office!
Another 'half a loaf'. Criticizing the Bush administration is appropriate and valid. However, 9/11 demanded a response and the response was expensive. The problem is that the response wasn't paid for in higher taxes or cuts in other government spending. All the points William Morales makes are valid.
All the things the Bush administration and Congress refused to do are still there and still need to be done. President Obama and the Democrats asked for the job of doing the tough and unpopular work required and had the Presidency and a majority in both Houses for 2 years. Time and effort was wasted in fighting for a health care reform plan that should not have been priority one and in the end the President settles for a bad bill that adds more people but doesn't control costs. Next was a huge spending bill with no increase in taxes to pay for it, along with compromising with the people who wanted to extend the tax cuts. The 787 billion dollar stimulus did prevent many government worker layoffs and allowed most government salaries and benfits to remain unchanged. It did little to help the private sector and as the President admitted, shovel ready jobs were not shovel ready. Lastly, all the programs launched to help the housing sector have been failures.
I submit to you that this administration and Congress has exactly the same problem as the prior one. Wrong priorities and the inability to 'tell Americans the unpleasent truth and call for and enact the increased taxes and spending cuts' that are still required to cut the debt and deficit.
Can you imagine what would have happened after 9/11 and beyond had the former President and Congress raised taxes and cut spending in other areas necessary to balance the spending on the wars, DHS, and other new programs such as the prescription drug benefit? He and Congress would have been villified by the Democrats and the public. Should he and they have been 'leaders' and done it anyway? Yes! It's still there to be done, regardless of whose fault the problems were. This administration and this Congress are not 'leading' anymore than the one before them....AND THAT IS THE PROBLEM.
Whether Obama is re-elected or not, here is the message we need to send to Congress: We're ready to take the castor oil and won't punish you if you administer it. If you don't administer it however, we will throw everyone of you out of office, both Rs and Ds. It's time to take our medicine folks, if we want to survive as the nation we have been for over 300 years.
Michael
William R. Morales is lying about being a Republican and is lying about the Revenue and spending.
William R. Morales says "Bush spent money like a drunken sailor. He enacted a Medicare prescription drug program ... His Iraq adventure, a war of choice, .... The worst decision he made, however, was the $1.3 trillion tax cut.
The FY-2007 the Bush/Republican Congress Deficit was $161 billion and the deficit was $8.6 trillion;
The last Republican budget FY-2007 budget included all the "problems" that Morales, other Democrats and Obama complains that Obama inherited - the two wars, the tax rate cut, and Medicare drug entitlement, etc.
-----------
In FY-2008 the Bush / DEMOCRAT Congress Deficit was $455 billion;
Democrats cannot blame the lack of tax revenue - In 2008 the Bush tax rate revenue target met the Bill Clinton era 1999 CBO estimate for 2008.
In Bill Clinton's last budget year (FY-2001) total federal Revenue was $1.991 trillion. While the Bush FY-2007 Revenue was $2.568. So the tax rate cut had no impact it - was new spending.
In 2009 the Obama/Democrat Congress Deficit was $1,420 billion ($1.42 trillion).
Now the common denominator is not Bush or Obama it is Reid and Pelosi and Democrat control.
Appropriations the last 2 year of Bush was controlled by the DEMOCRATIC SENATE and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, Chris Dodd, and Kent Conrad; and by Madam Speaker Nancy Pelosi's DEMOCRATIC HOUSE, Charlie Rangel, and Barney Frank. The last Republican House FY-2007 actual budget deficit was $161 billion.
Eron went into bankruptcy the year Clinton left office 2001 when Bush investigated and took them down.
Enron evolved and grow in the late 90s under Clinton and employed approximately 22,000 staff and was one of the world's leading electricity, natural gas, communications, and pulp and paper companies, with claimed revenues of nearly $101 billion in 2000.
Under Bill Clinton's watch "Fortune" named Enron "America's Most Innovative Company" for six consecutive years.
Get with the Facts FS
We're in the ninth tax year of the Bush tax cuts. When they began the unemoployment rate was 6.2%. Now it is 9.2%. So where's the evidence that cutting taxes, especially for the wealthy, creates jobs? We all know the one thing it creates is DEFICITS.
If raising taxes is bad because it removes potential spending from the Economy, why is cutting Government spending good for the Economy - it also reduces spending in the Economy.
Michael is right in that there isn't much leadership in Congress. We have elected a bunch of followers who are reciting a mantra (no tax increases) based on emotional discomfort of voters rather than a well thought out plan to turn things around and create a real future for this country. We need to "raise all boats" not just the yachts.
The Bush tax cuts and Wars wrecked the economy and increased the deficit. Most polls show more people blame Bush more than Obama.
Dennis,
Please do not misrepresent what I said. I did not say that 9/11 was responsible for all Bush's mistakes. I said the response to it was expensive and it was. I also said the response wasn't paid for, and it wasn't. That's on Bush, plain and simple.
You seem to suscribe to the notion that Bush invaded Iraq to avenge his dad. I find that unlikely. Fear of Saddam, WMD's, and terrorists is a more plausable explanation. Again, that effort wasn't paid for and that's on Bush, plain and simple.
We all tend to read what we want to read into what other people write so it fits our prepackaged conclusions. I make an effort not to do that. I hope you'll join me.
Michael
Enjoyed your letter, Mr. Morales.
I guess everyone has their come-to-Jesus moment regarding Republican Party policies.
Mine came when I turned 18 years old. In Florida, they had just changed the laws just recently, changing the voting age from 21 to 18.
So, I was afforded an opportunity to be a voting member of America. An adult (well, looking back, not sure if I was in fact an adult, but work with me here, the U.S. told me I was). To participate in the next Presidential elections. I registered as a Democrat (still am).
That was the one and only time I ever voted for a Republican. ANY Republican.
I voted for Nixon.
History happened. Nixon clearly got his cronies active in order to steal information from the Democrats to give him an unfair advantage in the elections. Watergate burglars apprehended. Subsequent investigative journalism confirmed a paper trail of Republican Party complicity that went all the way up to the Nixon White House. It all ended with the classic footage of Nixon on the steps of the helicopter, turning, waving, turning back, getting in and leaving, out of power in abject disgrace.
THAT was my come-to-Jesus moment.
Never voted for any single Republican since then. I still don't. I don't care if the next Republican candidate for any office emulates Mother Theresa and buys me a new Corvette with no strings attached. No deal. Go away. The Republican Party simply corrupts and morphs politicians into money grubbing powermongers that care nothing for the American people, nor do they do a damn thing for the middle class of this country except tell them to turn around, bend over, take it, smile, say thank you, and, oh, be sure to vote for them again.
Still holds true today. I'll stick with President Obama and his administration. Even if he makes a mistake, I'll stick with him.
One distinction of all Third World, undeveloped nations is the presence of a super-rich class and everyone else, the very poor.
Prosperous, economically-sound nations, on the other hand, see a more even distribution of wealth.
Bottom line is that the trickle-down economic theory has been tried and tested. Results after ten years and $1.3 trillion tax cuts for the wealthy are in and the scheme failed as miserably as any other Bush-era policy.
FACT: Job growth was ZERO during Bush's eight years in office while Clinton's two terms brought us 23 million new jobs.
Oh yeah, and Clinton RAISED taxes on the wealthy.
Lady Gogo, tell us again how Crazy Angle is going to beat Harry Reid by ten percentage points. I never get tired of hearing that delusional fairy tale.
Lady Gogo, we Democrats always have a ace in the hole. No matter how well the Teabags do in any election it's a certainty they'll screw things up badly and find themselves on their familiar back bench again.
Guaranteed. Everytime.
By the way, Lady Gogo, you're making sh** up again as usual. I NEVER predicted Dems would hold the House. That's lie.
Gogo must be off his meds again. He's having delusions of adequacy.
Yeah. It's Obama's fault the GW Bush f*cked up the world.
How about we quit pointing fingers trying to figure out who broke it and get to the order of fixing it .Honestly I don't care who broke it . That fact is irrelevant .I want to know who is going to fix it and how they are going to fix it .
A "mugwump" was the late 19th century word for a citizen who sat on the fence with his mug on one side and his wump on the other. We have a Two Party System, for better or worse (and I believe it is the worse). What those of us who are truly independent in thought are faced with is a choice between the uncertain, halting, and somewhat ineffective policies of the current Administration and the proposals from those who apparently hold the Republican Party in an ideologically induced zombie-like trance and who fervently believe that making things much, much worse for all but the top 1/2 of 1% is the road that must be taken -- without compromise.
The choice is between muddling along or complete national disaster. It is an easy one to make -- since the 2 Party System allows us no other choice for our national path.
Thank you, Mr. Morales for an honest letter to inform the NV citizens of that which is true.
Many traditional Republicans have left, or have been kicked out their party because it has been taken over by Fascists that are totalitarian, corrupt, and incompetent.
Bruce Bartlett, former adviser to Reagan and Bush Sr. stated:
"I honestly think the republicans have been gripped by insanity, and the people who have known this, have kept their mouth shut for years.He doubted there were any republican leaders in Congress who could articulate, traditional, sensible,conservative, Republican policy."
Mr. Morales,
Your title, "Don't blame Obama for bad economy" stopped me from reading further than your first line. When you make that your theorem, all else is pablum. A theorem based in facts is more proveable - one based in emotion and perception is impossible to prove. It is simply your imagination that Obama is being blamed for the bad economy.
It would seem somewhere in your 72 years that you should have learned to read and comprehend, lest you wouldn't be an Obama curmudgeon cheer leader.
Regards,
Purgatory
Comment removed by moderator. reductio ad Nazium
<<And we have this week's winner of the most inane, delusional and insispid remark of the week!!!!!
The winner is Leric Goodman for this post>>
No, Herr Schillmoeller, YOU ARE THE WINNER of the "most, inane, delusional and insipid remarks" not only for this week, but always.
Your posts are rambling thoughts of someone who has lost touch with reality (they have meds for that problem these days). You are nasty and full of yourself, and cannot post anything without calling someone a nasty name. Your "HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH" is scary to say the least. You must be sitting there at your computer thinking your are the most intelligent person that posts here.
There are many on here who are Republicans but their posts are intelligent and "nice" - no name calling and not having an attitude. You can use big words and coherent sentences but it's the stuff between the lines that everyone can see. You hate anyone who doesn't agree with your thinking and think you are so much smarter then they are.
Ah yes, Herr Schillmoeller, your ancestors from the Motherland must be proud of you.
PS You and the President share one quality - you are both White Sox fans.....
Will brain dead teabaggers such as lady gogo support crusading bible-thumper Michelle Bachmann if she's the GOP nominee? Bachmann has the distinction of being even more batsh*t crazy than Nevada's Sharron Angle which means she's probably a shoo-in for the bagger nomination.
There was a time warhawks believed surviving an all out nuclear exchange with the Soviet Union was possible.
There was a time people thought that lowering taxes for the wealthy would create jobs through trickle down economics.
There was a time polluting the environment by deregulating industry was acceptable.
There was a time when we economically hit rock bottom and brought the world economy to it's knees, the last Great Depression.
Handing control of the White House and Congress to the GOP will be self destructive, we've been down that road before.
What makes it possible for people to ignore the consequences of their actions and not speculate about the results? It doesn't take but a touch of foresight to realize certain conditions shouldn't be tampered with because of it's destructive effects. Yet people will ignore the outcome of those situations.
Prof. Robert Altemeyer designed roleplaying situations to rate the right wing authoritarian reaction, because authoritarians tend to seek dominance over others by being competitive and destructive, instead of cooperation. In this study by Altemeyer, 68 authoritarians played a three hour simulation of the Earth's future entitled the Global change game. Unlike a comparison game played by individuals with low Right Wing Authoritarian scores, which resulted in world peace and widespread international cooperation, the simulation by authoritarians became highly militarized and eventually entered the stage of nuclear war. By the end of the high RWA game, the entire population of the earth was declared dead.
This reaction could explain why these people reject the science of climate change.
I can't understand why people will vote against their own best interest. From much of what I gathered as data, right wing authoritarian conservatives are self destructive because of their inability to be flexible and accept others ideology.
Conservative Republican Representative Bob Inglis:
"Republican members of Congress know deep-down that they need to deliver conservative solutions. We're being driven as a herd by the hot microphones, which are like flamethrowers, that are causing people to run with fear and panic, and republican members of Congress are afraid of being run over by the stampeding crowd.
It's hard for the republican members of Congress to summon the courage to say no to Beck, Limbaugh, and the tea party wing.
When we start just delivering rhetoric and misinformation, we're failing the conservative movement, We're failing the country."
Munch...Germans like myself and Schillmoeller refer to Germany as the Fatherland. The English and Russians use the term Motherland.
A small correction.
David Frum, Bush speechwriter:
"At a minimum it is difficult to argue that there is a rigorous policy debate taking place in the right-of-center portion of the political spectrum at the moment. Rather, it seems to consist of a simplistic combination of -the Obama agenda is bad and tax cuts are good. A serious legislative agenda this does not make."
Hmmmmm..I see the little onion eater is up bright and early this morning doing what he does best......making silly and nonsensical statements that are basically FIXED NEWS talking points....
Yep, in the mind of the little Chicago blow-in, it's all Obama's fault. On the other hand, that clueless guy from Texas, according to the onion eater, was one GREAT president...
The clueless guy did such a great job that the little onion eater voted for him not once, but twice, and was very up-set when he was told that he would not be able to cast a third vote for his hero...
Yep, the little Chicago transplant continues to believe that the Bush tax cuts for the rich created millions and millions of jobs....
Yep, that "trickle down" stuff really works.....
If you don't believe me. just ask the onion eater....
The onion eater has decided that President Obama has already taken far too many vacation days since he took the oath of office in January of 2009.
He says that very thing time and time again, but refuses to admit that his two favorite president's, Ronnie Reagan, and Bush junior, actually hold the record for the number of vacation days taken by a president......
Reagan took over 800 vacation days in his 8 years, and George junior took almost 1000 days off during his tenure...
Oop's I;m sorry...all those days that Reagan & George junior took were "working vacation days."
The little onion eater told me that and I believe him....
Yep, according to the little onion eater, Obama has been playing way too much golf and spending far too many days meeting with world leaders.
He's also been raising money for his re-election campaign while on the job, something that the "gipper" and the "clueless one" never did...
Hey Schillybagger.......how do you tell a "New" Republican from an "Old" Republican?
Surely you know the answer to that question....
The answer is that it's impossible to tell the difference between the two.... They're exactly the same in all respects......
There is nothing wrong with being a moderate Republican or a moderate Democrat. Many people such as Mr. Morales fall in that group. It is entirely correct for him to be honest in criticizing his own party, I only wish more rank and file would do so.
Unfortunately there are rarely any candidates who do so, at least publicly.
People like Morales need to become active in their party of choice and help bring rational thought back to the political process. Maybe then we can have leaders who will address conditions as they exist now and find solutions.
boftx, Good advice, very good advice. Thanks!
People keep saying that there has been a lack of progress in the recovery. I don't have a clue as to where these people get their information from. Stock markets around the world have roughly doubled adding $32 trillion to people's portfolios. The banking system has been stabilized and banks are now making money, tons of it. The auto industry has stabilized at all the car companies are back in the black. Top CEO bonuses are now back to 2007 levels. Corporate earnings are approaching record levels. I don't know the exact number to date but I believe earnings are up over 60% since 2008. Companies are sitting on their largest cash position in history.
When Obama took office 107 million people were employed in the United States. Currently 109 million people are employed in the United States. That number would be better if it were not for the 700,000 public-sector worker layoffs.
Even the balance sheet of Las Vegas hospitals has improved over the last couple years. Read the article published in yesterday's newspaper.
Many of the unemployed were in the construction business, especially in places like Las Vegas. That industry is coming off a 76 year bull market and I believe will take a decade or more to fully recover.
Since 1940 there've only been 11 years when the federal government has had a surplus. The budget surpluses that existed when Clinton was in office were a function of exploding stock and real estate markets. When markets are rapidly advancing this generates huge capital gains revenues as well as higher property tax revenues for state local and federal governments. Those surpluses had absolutely nothing to do with Republicans or Democrats. The combination of an aging society, the cost that goes along with taking care of those people, declining real estate values and very little capital gains revenue flowing into coffers is a big part of current account deficits. Unemployment is currently about 4 to 5% above the historical average. This also exacerbates the deficit problem.
The 911 response was made under false pretenses.
Thirty days before the final report was to be published on the extensive inspection by the UN team headed by Hans Blix, he appeared before the Security Council to give a preview of the findings that would appear in the final report.
I had a day off from work and was channel surfing, landing on CSPAN live coverage of the meeting. The preview included a report that no WMD's were found, nor was capacity to make them in them in the near future found. The Nigerian uranium rods was a hoax, and there was no evidence of an Al Quaeda connection to Saddam, or any significant training taking place in Iraq.
Everything was contrary to what we had been told by the Bush/Cheney Administration.
I told my husband that night that we would invade Iraq before that final report was published, because once it was, the reason for an invasion, WMD's and 911, would evaporate in mid air.
Two weeks before the report was due, and was known would be published, we invaded Iraq. The rest is history.
I searched and searched newspapers, the Internet, everywhere to find some accounting or record of the meeting. I couldn't even find it on CSPAN later, which might be my own failing. Nothing. The media missed the whole thing....or did they ignore it?
Sometime, after we had been there for a while, I found something on the UN website, still nothing in the media in retrospect.
We had a major failure of our media, which at the time was scared witless of the Bush/Cheney Administration, fearing lack of access for being uncooperative. How much also resulted from the corporate takeover of news media is unknown.
I would also like to point out that our invasion of Iraq and death of Saddam conveniently put a stop to the signed contractual agreement between Iraq, France, and Russian to build an oil pipeline that would have been a disadvantage to US interests. We fixed that problem. Was that the real goal, rather than the non-existent WMD's? No wonder France and Russian opposed blocked US efforts at the UN.
How easy it is to see the tangled webs woven in politics if we are given the information that leads to seeing the truth, rather than being deceived by special interests and corrupt politicians working hand in hand.
Ending a war is much more difficult than starting it, but we should all lend support to efforts to end the charade and help our own country rise from the destruction of our own economy that is in ruins thanks to the many ruinous policies of the Bush/Cheney Administration, including dismantling or tying the hands of needed oversight bodies, and giving almost free reign to business, including banks, brokerage firms, corporations, multinationals, governmental entities, and more.
That is the Republican philosophy, it is capitalism (one thing alone matters, profits regardless of effects), so I can't say anything other than it is one I left and never want to go back to.
What good are all the profits being made, all the increases in the business column, if they are held and not put into hiring employees to produce and make purchases, or loaning money to buy homes, etc.?
It all seems to be approaching something more like a capitalist corporate communism, with non members standing in bread lines. One end of the string joins with the other end and becomes one.
boftx - "There is nothing wrong with being a moderate Republican or a moderate Democrat. Many people such as Mr. Morales fall in that group."
Amen! Those on the far right call them RINO's as if they were traitors of some sort. Electing batcrap crazies like Michele Bachmann and Louie Gohmert is their answer because they dislike moderate Republicans.
If the bulk of our politicians functioned as modertates we wouldn't have this crazy crap going on. This great nation was built on compromise, yet we see very little evidence of it recently. I truly believe Mitch McConnell, John Boehner and Eric Cantor hope the economy further tanks so they can win back the White House and Congress.
What good would it do to use cash reserves, let alone take out loans, to hire more workers to produce goods that would only sit in warehouses because there is no demand for the products being produced?
This part of our current economic condition *can* be addressed by Obama but hasn't been yet.
The flight of jobs overseas, with the corresponding increase in foreign manufactured products, is *the* single most dominant factor for our lack of recovery today. No one in Washington, in either the White House or Congress, has done anything about this.
So while it is not appropriate to blame Obama for what he inherited, it is entirely appropriate to blame him for not taking action on the root cause.
Obama himself has said we do not need, or even want those jobs to come back. I think he is wrong in that opinion. Even jobs that pay only minimum wage would take people off the unemployment rolls.
Det_Munch's comments about the illustrious gogowhitesox were spot on.
But, I have noticed he somehow loves to attack me. And I usually don't dignify it with a response, but what the hell, here goes.
gogowhitesox: "Yes, that's the spirit...I'll vote for the guy who is a complete boob and will drive this country into bankruptcy because 'Hey, I like him'..."
I make a comment and you treat it like a personal attack on you, your livelihood, your relatives and your dog and your cat. You need to get over yourself. You're nuts.
gogowhitesox: "I don't think there is anyone on this post who is more mentally unstable, has an inability to deal with reality and spews more unintelligible rhetoric than our friend Colin...."
This comment was apparently made while looking into a mirror in a moment of self-reflection. Another blatant personal attack on me. I guess gogowhitesox loves to be recognized...pretty much like a spoilt rotten kid who does things only for the attention.
gogowhitesox: "He is a poster child for why we do need to support mental health for all of our veterans because he has CLEARLY lost all ability to think clearly...."
Another personal attack on me. He knows I'm a veteran. And he knows I called him out before because he attacked another veteran who was guilty of doing nothing but speaking his mind. Something for which he has never apologized about. But don't worry, nobody wants an apology from you. Getting an apology for the hateful things said from gogowhitesox are about the same as getting an apology out of Charles Manson before he dies in prison. Quit trying to provoke people.
"You need help, Colin, you need help with your anger issues...."
No anger here. All I see is another attempt to provoke by the full of himself gogowhitesox. In order to elicit a response. Well, you got it.
My job here, gogowhitesox, in commenting is only to drive you nuts. It is my fervent wish that I get you worked up so much that you bust at least a few blood vessels. I am compelled to do my best to effect your well-being. We're talking myocardial infarction. Work with me here. I'm doing my damndest to damage your good health.
I've said this before to gogowhitesox. And I'll say it again: Go commit an unnatural sex act upon yourself.
jldour - "Vernos, I just don't feel we are heading in the right direction. Do you?"
I do not, but Obama wasn't the cause. He was handed a horrible situation, and if the GOP had let him do what he initially intended we would be in better shape. What ever happened to that Pledge to America written by the GOP/Tea Party?
Why does the middle class ALWAYS pay for the corruption and greed caused by the elites?
I don't think it was Obama:
who closed 40,000 plants and sent jobs overseas
give carte blanche to companies outsourcing American jobs
treated the world as if we were imperialists running roughshod over them when we want oil or natural resources
allowed banking to run amok ending with this monstrous downturn
handed the "farm" to the wealthiest while those "toiling the fields" are treated as slaves
We started down this road long ago and were warned, but no one listened. Welp, here we are and the same stupid bastages, with the same idiotic ideology are still running the show.
Conservative Professor Steven Bainbridge:
"These days...the most prominent so-called conservatives are increasingly fit only to be cast for the next "Dumb and Dumber' sequel. They're dumb and crazy."
It's getting to be embarrassing to be a conservative."
www.professorbainbridge.com
boftx said....
"There is nothing wrong with being a moderate Republican or a moderate Democrat."
That's very true. Matter of fact, neither party can hope to survive for any extended period of time unless they have moderates with in their ranks....
At this point in time, there are few, if any moderates, in the Republican Party.
Unfortunately, the Tea Party has gained control of the GOP and has driven the party over to the far right.
Any Republican who disagrees with what the Tea Party stands for is in great danger of being pushed out of the party come election time....
History tells us that political extremism is the death sentence for any political party in this country...
Extremism can be popular in the short term, but it's almost never popular in the long term...
Vern is correct.....this country was built on compromise. There's no way the Constitution could have been written, and later ratified, with out a massive amount of compromise taking place....
The compromise over slavery; the compromise over the tariff; and the compromise over representation in the national legislative body were all very important compromises that had to take place.
Other wise, there would have been no Constitution.
An attitude of "my way or the highway" has come to dominate politics on Capital Hill. Matter of fact, anyone who is willing to compromise, in hope of moving this country forward, is looked upon as a weak & ineffective leader.
That's sad because ALL of the great leaders that this country has had were people willing to compromise when "push came to shove."
Look at such leaders as Henry Clay, John C Calhoun, and Daniel Webster. Their wiliness to put the national good in front of regional or sectional desires prevented a civil war from taking place.
Once those three men were gone from the national scene, civil war became the order of the day.
Need I say more?
Thank you for your sincere words, Mr. Morales.
El_Lobo used interesting examples from history. :)
There can be no doubt that Clay, Calhoun and Webster often had to set aside personal differences, but eventually the issue of slavery became so great, and was seen as wrong by so many, that even these great men (two of whom were solid Whigs) felt that compromise was no longer possible.
It was that (rightful) refusal to compromise further on slavery that brought about the creation of the Republican Party by northern Whigs (including Lincoln) and others. Calhoun was a staunch supporter of slavery and more or less remained a Democrat though he had often sided with Whigs in the effort to compromise.
So yes, the ability to work together and compromise is valid and a vital part of our history and continued existence, it must be pointed out that some principles *must* be held above sacrifice.
The irony is that today's economic conditions absolutely demand not just compromise, but recognition by *all* elected leaders and representatives that the American people are more important than mere ideology.
I certainly do blame not only Obama, but all the leaders in Congress for failing to act in our best interests today. Fingers can be pointed *after* the problems are solved.
William is 100% CORRECT.......
THIS MESS IS NOT PRESIDENT OBAMA'S DOING.
THIS MESS WAS CAUSED BY GREEDY, RAT-BASTARD
REPUBLICANS.
REPUBLICANS ARE UN-FIT TO GOVERN, PERIOD.
This is why we booted the crazy republicans
OUT OF THE WHITE HOUSE.
All one has to do is read the crazy republican
comments, on this post, to know why we will
keep these republican lunatics out of the White
House in 2012.
YES, WE ARE KEEPING PRESIDENT OBAMA IN 2012.
PRESIDENT OBAMA IS THE MAN.
REPUBLICANS ARE UN-FIT TO GOVERN.
LIVE BETTER/WORK UNION.
TEAMSTERS FOREVER.
boftx.....
What kind of la la land are you living in?
President Obama has been working for our best
interests since the day he took office.
The crazy republicans have been fighting against
President Obama and our best interests since the
day he took office.
President Obama saved our country from a huge
depression.
Do you want to privatize Social Security?
Do you want to privatize Medicare?
Do you want to kill off all labor unions?
That's what these greedy, crazy republicans want
to do.
Democrats are the only party working for our own
best interests.
It can't be any clearer than that.
Dubya! I can't believe that moron was our Prez for 8 friggin' years! Keep in mind his laissez-faire, no regulation-free market ( let the Wall Street crooks run rampant!) bs is what destroyed this country!
teamster,
How many teamsters won't get loads now that the NAFTA super-highway has been created? Does this help your union, or any other driver? Who was behind it?
Here's a hint: http://www.ltltraffic.com/2011/07/obama-...
What rock has Morales been under, the recession took a turn for the worst in 2009, the moment Obama took office and it went down hill from there. $5 trillion in bailout, TARP, stimulus and other failed legislation took the nation were we are today. The nation would had been in a better position to let the economy take its course like we have done in the past. Its clear your liberal views are lump sided. 49% of Americans did not pay income tax in 2010, there is no way the nation could count on 51% to carry the load. The nations have the highest corporate tax in the world the same corporations that we count on for jobs. You cannot say that the situation would be the same with John McCain, you don't know. At least McCain would not have rammed Healthcare reform down our throat, and stimulus would of help more Americans than just those who participate in unions. Morales, you need to have a more open mind on the economy and recession and its solutions. Its takes every American to resolve our nations problems.
boftx said:
"El_Lobo used interesting examples from history. :)
There can be no doubt that Clay, Calhoun and Webster often had to set aside personal differences, but eventually the issue of slavery became so great, and was seen as wrong by so many, that even these great men (two of whom were solid Whigs) felt that compromise was no longer possible."
Not sure what your talking about with your statement saying ""El_Lobo used interesting examples from history."
The many, many compromises made by the three leaders (Clay, Calhoun, & Webster) that I mentioned are among the best examples of that type of thing in our entire history..
Matter of fact, Clay is known in history as the "Great Compromiser."
Webster's speech on the Senate floor, talking about the importance of preserving the union is a classic.
Yes, Calhoun backed slavery (he called slavery a positive good..) but even Calhoun was a man who saw the necessity of compromise.
The 1832-33 tariff law which lowered tariff rates over a period of time, and probably prevented the start of a civil war in South Carolina, was made possible by Calhoun's wiliness to compromise...
The "fire-eaters" and extremists in both North and South took this nation down the road to war. That came about after the retirement and death of Clay, Calhoun, & Webster...
An argument can and should be made that it was extremism and a refusal to compromise that caused the Civil War.....
The rise of the abolitionist movement in the North and the take over of the Southern legislatures by the "fire-eater's" in the South was at the root of the problem....
Lincoln was actually a moderate on the question of slavery.... That's one reason he got the GOP nomination for president.
The "fire-eater's" convinced most southerner's that Lincoln was an abolitionists.......that was simply not true.
My whole point is that extremism has been a bad thing for this country most of the time. Compromise is what our whole system is all about....
Some historians say that slavery was the main cause of the Civil War. Other historians don't totally agree....they believe that several issues, including slavery, brought on the war.
They all pretty much agree, however, that once compromise was thrown out of the mix, war became unavoidable...
Peacelily: Repeat after me: every Democrat of any stature at the time is ON TAPE stating that Saddam had WMD's and had to be taken out. Nothing like the selective memory of a liberal to give you a jump-start for the day.
El_Lobo,
I was just thinking that given my beliefs (that you are well aware of) I found it interesting, and somewhat amusing, that you mentioned two of the greatest Whigs to illustrate your point (which I agree with) while at the same time the straw that broke the camel's back (so to speak) was an issue so important to our concept of liberty and justice that it almost defies belief that Jefferson and others could allow it to continue as long as it did.
That said, it could be argued that had the Civil War been fought sooner than it was our nation would not have survived. So in that sense the compromises made on slavery did indeed keep us going to when we could "afford" to address the matter once and for all.
"A conservative is someone who makes no changes and consults his grandmother when in doubt."
(Woodrow Wilson)
The 1920 and 1945 recessions were caused by a shift from a war based to peace based economy. Nothing like what is going on currently.
There have been nearly 50 recessions over the last couple hundred years. One every few years.
Clinton left bush jr. with a $68,000,000,0000 surplus.
bush jr. left Obama $1,300,000,000,000 debt
The Dow decreased to 8,000 by the time bush jr. left office.
The stock market wealth decreased by $4,600,000,000,000.
Because of the radical extremist so-called republicans narrow minded ideology of un-regulated capitalism, the Wall St. Fraudsters, and other business entities, the financial markets almost collapsed and created the "Great Recession that has cost America over 25% of it's wealth that took over 200 years to create and will take 40 years to recover.
You apparently haven't been reading my posts...at least not those that go way, way back.
I have said time and time again that the Whig Party that Lincoln became part in during the late 1830's & early 1840's did many wonderful things for this country.....
Their policies moved this country forward and the birth of the Republican Party in 1854 was greatly influenced by Whig beliefs...
Lincoln was more Whig that he was Republican. The same might be said about Teddy Roosevelt who came much, much later...
The present day Republican Party is nothing like the Whig Party of the 1840's.
Matter of fact, the present GOP isn't anything like the Republican Party that put Eisenhower in the White House in 1952...
Eisenhower was a moderate. There's NO moderates in today's GOP...
Former National Review Editor, David Klinghoffer stated:
"The right is losing it's way. Now, under the influence of the "potty mouthed' Andrew Breitbart, the right is more concerned with trashing the left than in defending the best values of civilization. Now , observe the rule of the crazy cons."
Red States, Erick Erickson: Stop lying and admit you're the party of no."
Republican Senator Chuck Hagel: "I do not see the republicans presenting any alternatives, any new options, or any new thinking. It's just no, no,no...."
LastThroes asked, "Will brain dead teabaggers such as lady gogo support crusading bible-thumper Michelle Bachmann if she's the GOP nominee?"
I believe they would because of the hate they carry in their hearts. To hell with the country as long as one of those liberal Dems don't win.
We've had a history of industry destroying our environment with pollution, GOP answer, deregulate industry by phasing out the EPA. Industry is honest enough to regulate themselves. Really?
We've had a history of banking destroying the economy and holding average American citizens in the process, GOP answer, deregulate banking even more.
The greatest cry from the GOP is about country first and "our freedom!" How was that answered? The Patriot Act which allows the government to have warrantless wiretaps, warrantless searching of a persons property, and possibly holding them as prisoner without habeus corpus. One of my biggest beefs against Obama for continuing that law.
Let's sum up. Are we better today than we were 2+ years ago? If u think yes vote BO. If not vote Republican . It's very simple.
The real problem is lack of jobs.
GREEDY REPUBLICANS SENT ALL OF OUR JOBS TO
COMMUNIST CHINA.
THAT'S THE PROBLEM!!!!!!!
WE NEED MANUFACTURING JOBS TO BRING BACK OUR
ECONOMY.
Millions of Americans are sitting at home, with
their thumbs in their butts because greedy
republicans ARE STILL SENDING JOBS TO CHINA.
WE NEED THOSE JOBS BACK.
Americans should be making TVS, CELL PHONES,
COMPUTERS, FURNITURE, POWER TOOLS ETC.
COMMUNIST SLAVES ARE MAKING THESE THINGS.
HOW COULD WE BE THIS STUPID?
I dropped out of the Republican Party after witnessing the evilness of "King Richard" and his henchmen. The Party has been going downhill since, except for some saneness during the Reagan years. The callousness of the current bunch is hard to believe. There can't be a true Christian among them.
I'm not real big on Democrats either but I'm glad we no longer have a dunce in the White House.
PALIN / BACHMAN 2012
Comedians need work too!
"The GOP is intellectually and morally bankrupt"
"GOP set to repeal light bulb standard that saves billions"
http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/arti...
boftx, I tend to agree with you. Business took the cheap labor jump for profits and sold us down the drain as far as having something worthwhile to market. Try making even a simple radio with all parts manufactured in the US. We don't have anything to market but war.
As a result we have ourselves in a non-competitive state, and if another country, or more, ever blockaded us, we would be in big trouble. We exist on imports. It is pitiful.
Businesses that have big profits don't need loans to hire people, btw. That was my point. Maybe they don't make the profits they do now, but jobs could be brought back here and given to Americans who desperately want them.
We are in a heck of a mess, and it will take more than Obama to straighten it out, and more than 3 years in a recession. There are no instant fixes on what has taken decades to destroy us. However, all our political leaders must join in an effort to get us back on track, and close the partisan video game. They can resume playing after they straighten out the mess.
One of the threats to all of us is the status of the dollar as the world reserve currency. We could easily lose that, and if we do, we are in a disaster.
Europe wants more status for the Euro, and the World Bank is working on a completely different form of "currency" to jump in when the opportunity appears.
Deficits, trade, jobs, and everything will make this recession look like Christmas morning.
We cannot look at only the US any longer. We are players on a global game board, and we need to wise up fast.
I'm afraid that is the biggest error that is being made by some others, the error of thinking the US calls the shots
as it did in the past. Time to learn and become part of the human race instead of limited & narrow group membership.
The national debt is getting WAY too much air time. The only period in which we haven't had a huge debt is the period...1840-1860.
Living within your means sounds good but isn't really viable in a huge economy with a large population.
Fraud---Willy, you are not a Republican, you are a political hack trying to deceive.
The "almost" collapse of the financial markets created the "Great Recession that has cost America 25% of it's wealth that took 200 years to create and will take 40 years to recover.
This was because of the narrow minded ideology of the radical extremist republicans un-regulated capitalism, the Wall St. Fraudsters, and other criminal business cronies.
REPUBLICAN GREED CREATED THIS MESS AND REPUBLICANS
ARE THE LAST PEOPLE, ON EARTH, TO LISTEN TO.
These crazy republicans want to take us back to
the Bush years, ON STEROIDS.
NO THANKS.
THE RADICAL REPUBLICANS ARE INSANE.
President Obama is driving us out of the
republican ditch.
The republican ditch is deep and will take years
to fix.
We are very lucky to have President Obama, Vice
President Biden, Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi at
the wheel.
LIVE BETTER/WORK UNION.
@VidiVeritas...
Conservative Professor Steven Bainbridge:
"These days...the most prominent so-called conservatives are increasingly fit only to be cast for the next "Dumb and Dumber' sequel. They're dumb and crazy."
It's getting to be embarrassing to be a conservative."
www.professorbainbridge.com
AMEN TO THAT!
Vernos points out the incredible chutzpah of the TeaNuts to demand the unfettered ability to ONCE AGAIN be free to rape & pillage the land, our economy & our freedoms...
"Get the Government out of our way so we can, um, 'grow the economy' & get America moving again!"
Translation:
What ARE you Democrat's doing?
We could give a rats a$$ about Grandma, your bratty kids, the sick, the "less fortunate", the planet, the future OR causing another economic meltdown.
We need to feed the MONEY MONKEY!
Money, money & MO' MONEY.
That's all that matters!
Now. Let's get things started with a prayer!
Another of those leftnuts who traded their vote for a spot in the cheese giveaway must not of received their block of cheese this week. Gotta love 'em though... like the rest of America, he is still waiting for the dems to propose a budget since prior to the 10 elections.
Pretty funny when the liberal Obama worshippers can only respond to arguments by ad hominem attacks. I guess when all your "facts" don't fit with the Obama-is-the-greatest-President-ever mindset/brainwash that's all you have left.
The fact remains that the wealthiest 10% of Americans fund 98% of the federal government already. As per usual the liberal mantra "tax the rich" is code for "tax the other guy". I would have no problem paying a bit more in taxes if I could have assurances my hard earned money would be used efficiently and without waste. The Federal government has proven, time and time again, they are simply unable to use funds efficiently, which isn't surprising because there is no incentive to do so. Three billion dollars a year to Pakistan is just one example that comes to mind. An Obama official stated that the American taxpayer is COMMITTED to giving Pakistan this money. Really? Says who?
I am hopeful that Boehner will hold the line and refuse the "deal" that the Dear Leader is offering. My only reservation is that Boehner didn't hold out for more spending cuts...
Dumbocrats as usual cannot connect the dots.
"At a time when millions of Americans are without work, when millions of others with jobs are struggling to make ends meet, President Barack Obama has chosen to ignore their needs to pursue his vendetta against the coal industry."
http://www.theintelligencer.net/page/con...
International and domestic outsourcing of jobs previously held by American citizens is whats killing this country, not tax codes.
Obama administration has failed on this issue and we will continue to lose our jobs to foreigners and illegal immigrants for years to come.
Well known American companies such as Apple gets all their products manufactured in Asia. American consulting firms such as Deloitte are outsourcing not only tech support jobs to India, but also bookkeeping and clerical jobs. Illigal immigrants already dominate construction and service industries and will continue to grow.
How do you create jobs by increasing the tax on corporations and the wealthy? Times are bad and even if the times were good, the jobs would still go somewhere else and Obama administration is not willing to really tackle the problem we have at hand.
Well Morales, all that I can say why you thought the Republicans would look out for you, shows your elevator may not rise to the first floor
Mr Boston, why not tax heavily on outsourced work/services and decrease taxes on those made in the US? Make it not worth outsourcing jobs. Outsourcing kills jobs and manufacturing here, and makes us dependent on other countries.
The option is to be dependent and have an ever increasing low income populous that cannot afford to buy even the outsourced products.
I recognize that some companies could leave. Such a plan would have to be phased in, and lots of planning and steps to bring us back from deep dependence to greater independence. This includes serious dialogue with companies..
In a way, it is like rebuilding the country after destruction. Back to the drawing board with goals, finding a way to reach the goals. A huge challenge, hard work, and I wonder if the American people are up for that, or if they prefer to make little effort and have cheap goods that break long before the quality goods we use to make here decades ago.
We could keep things as it is and follow in the path of Greece and Portugal, for starters, or just wait for new rules to be set for us by China....
The reality is that community organizer Obama never contributed to the economy as a private citizen and now he's pretending to be Mr. Knowitall.
An interesting article about Norway's economic road.
'Thriving Norway Provides an Economics Lesson'
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/14/busine...
China is certainly on the other end of size/populous scale, but is galloping ahead.
mikegino said......
"The reality is that community organizer Obama never contributed to the economy as a private citizen and now he's pretending to be Mr. Knowitall."
Obama's contribution to the economy as a private citizen reminds me of several other past president's who had similar experiences.....
Mainly Dwight D Eisenhower, Richard Nixon, George HW Bush and Calvin Coolidge....
None of those gentlemen ever ran a business in the private sector....
Of course, George W Bush was a big time "oil man."
He sunk numerous wells but never found any oil. I guess his failure as an oil man made him a prime prospect for president.....
Of course, he did one heck of a job as president. Took us to two wars that we could not afford, greatly increased the size of government, never carried a balanced budget in 8 years and borrowed trillions of dollars from anyone and everyone....
Yep, that experience in the private sector is an absolute guarantee that once a candidate becomes president, they will be able to run this country like a "fine oiled machine."
Obama administration only cares about winning the 2012 election and that means creating this perception that our current administration is fighting for the middle class vs the republicans who are taking care of the rich.
Making promises of middle class tax cuts and job creation by government "stimiulus", these are just short term solutions to win votes.
Eliminating Bush tax cuts or eliminating tax deductions for big oil companies will not create jobs for American people.
Why isn't Obama looking to bring jobs back to America to increase tax revenues? Should we continue to live jobless, but be glad unemployment benefit extended another 5 weeks thanks to increasing taxes on the rich? Trillion dollar cut in our national debt is not gonna put my uncle and sister-in-law back in the work force, will it? Or how is that extra $500 in my tax refunds next year help my unemployed son who has $80k in student loans?
lovinglife; Don't call me a Willy, OR A REPUBLICAN!!!!!!!
Willie Tanner
First 2 years Obama and all the dems had complete control and they never even had a budget!!!! Unbelievable!!! Nothing is ever Obama fault. Everything is president Bush fault! Dems have never or will ever take any blame, they love to blame others. I use to be a dem years ago and I never will vote dem again! I believe that party has changed drastically through the years. Watch msnbc and watch how agree they all are. Libralism is an illness!
El_Lobo-tomy: I didn't support or vote for George W. Bush. Do you seriously believe that Obama could even clean up the men's room after the presidents you cited? Obama is a total accident of history. By the way, can you look into your crystal ball and let me know where Tony Rezko is and why he hasn't been sentenced?
Any average American worker who would vote
republican, after what these republican crooks
have done to our economy, would have to be
mentally ill.
No normal person could be that stupid.
After reading 105 'comments' on this site I believe that the biggest problem facing isn't the democratic or the republican parties it's the silly party hacks on this [and other political party comment sections] that vote for them.
No small wonder that America is dumbing down!