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Friday, Feb. 26, 2010 | 7:26 a.m.
Sun Coverage
WASHINGTON — As Democrats consider a go-it-alone strategy for passing health care reform, polling out today shows a majority of Nevadans would support using the so-called reconciliation strategy to pass health legislation with a simple majority vote.
The poll conducted earlier this month shows 55 percent of Nevadans would have no objection to using the reconciliation strategy – with an even higher margin among independent voters, 64 percent.
Democrats have been weighing whether to push forward despite continued Republican opposition. Thursday’s health care summit convened by President Barack Obama with congressional leaders at Blair House illustrated the continued divide between the two parties.
Reconciliation is a strategy that requires just a simple majoirty, which is important in the Senate where 51 votes – rather than the typical 60 required – would advance the bill. Democrats no longer have a 60-seat majority after the election of Republican Sen. Scott Brown in Massachusetts.
Republicans have balked over using reconciliation, saying it would jam the bill through without minority party input. But Democrats, including Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, have argued that reconciliation has used more than 20 times since 1980, including to pass President George W. Bush’s tax cuts “for rich people.”
The polling was conducted Feb. 9-10 by Research 2000 for Progressive Change Campaign Committee, Credo Action and Democracy for America.
Support for using reconciliation was higher in several other states polled. The poll also shows modest support, 52 percent in Nevada, for Reid to push for the public option. In other states polled, support for using reconciliation to pass the public option was less.
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Not me. Stop the socialized crap!
In their web page the polling company says, "RESEARCH 2000 is a nonpartisan full service research firm"
Hmmm...then why it is run by people who come from the Democrat party and almost all the polls that they do are for libs groups or left of center newspapers.
Hmmm.....it is funny to see them lie in the 1st sentence.
You can either believe a koolaid lib poll and believe that Nevada is way out-of-step with the rest of nation or believe this:
"Yet a USA Today/Gallup survey released Thursday found Americans tilt 49-42 percent against Congress passing a health care bill similar to the ones proposed by Obama and Democrats in the House and Senate. Opposition was even stronger to the idea of Senate Democrats using the special budget rules, with 52 percent opposed and 39 percent in favor."
I don't believe this article! The MAJORITY of people don't want this health care. Why does the paper lie like this... Oh never mind, it's liberal..
Where did you do your polling? It must have been in a union hall. I say start all over again on health care and do it right this time!
Unbelievable.
Practically every person I've discussed this situation with is disgusted with Obama's intention to ram this legislation through no matter what.
And the Reconciliation they're talking about is just another end-run around established mandate, in order to get what you want (and to hell with what those stupid constituents want).
Using a poll from "Research 2000 for Progressive Change Campaign Committee, Credo Action and Democracy for America" is tantamount to using a poll from Pravda. It's so uber-Liberal as to be a joke.
Nice spin on the information, Sun. It's no wonder your paper is more suited to line the bottom of bird cages, or perhaps to wrap fish in, than to be a publication to be taken seriously.
I'm not sure if Lisa has put out a single decent article.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive...
This is the group that conducted the poll. Hmmm, might be a little biased. Also, they spoke only spoke to 600. Lisa, it's obvious what you want to accomplish with this article.
I don't know of anyone who wants this plan. Zero. Why aren't we being polled?
I am oh so proud to be in the 55% of Nevadans that are in their right mind!!!!
I am a small business owner that provides health insurance to his employees and their families. I have had United Health Care raise our rates 20% in 2008, 22% in 2009 and 28% in 2010. theses are true real life facts!!
Harry Reid knows what I'm up against and is fighting for me and my family and my business and my employees!!!
I am in the majority that wants something done and Harry Reid and President Obama know that!!!
Almost every other major and many smaller countries in the world have a system of medicine that works great, costs less and covers more than we have here. What's the problem??? You can do the name calling and try to scare people into thinking it's "Socialized Medicine", but the truth is we would be paying for it the EXACT same way we pay for the Military, Fire, Police, Education and the Library systems along with many other programs.
The new slogan of the tea-bagger movement: "We're proud to be Anti-Social!"
I am so glad to see all the cranky right wing people up early to criticize and pout.
When the Republicans had the majority, many Democrats on this "liberal" newspaper website were upset as well. It's amazing how quickly things turn when things are not going your way.
RSN's story isn't unique, it's happening everywhere! With many baby boomers now reaching the age of needing more medical assistance, premiums will keep going up if we don't provide SOME SORT of health insurance options for those who can't afford current rates. And we need to develop technologies that can enable doctors to better diagnose and leave this country much more healthier. This will be developed by businesses both BIG and SMALL!
Lisa - keep doing what you are doing and pissing these people off. =)
@RSN
I also run a small business and also have HPN/United. My rates did not increase that drastically AND this year, went down. Maybe you need to do some more homework or try a different broker.
What do you expect the government to do for us as business owners when it comes to insurance? Are you going to take the cheaper (maybe) government option for your employees you care so much for?
Please explain what this will do for you as a business owner and for your family.
Wow, what a biased group with a biased outcome on their 'poll'.
I say more power to them and more power to Lisa for writing this article.
Let 'them' think that they are doing a great job and let 'them' all be shocked when we all take part in the only poll that counts in November.
Sherry
My broker told me that 28% was standard across the board. I am telling the truth and can back it up with paperwork. The name of my company is Pioneer Overhead Door what is the name of yours?
My expectations of my government is to help me deal with the health insurance industry that makes a few billionaires each year while increasing profits and while shedding people that need access to healthcare. Help from my government that tells me the only place I can get access to healthcare is from corporate for profit america.
What health insurance reform will do is hold the insurance industry accountable. What health insurance reform will do is stop insurance companies from imposing lifetime caps. What health insurance reform will do is to stop insurance companies from denying me coverage for pre-existing conditions. What health insurance reform will do is slow the ever increasing cost of premiums.
Good people of Nevada! Please do the entire country a favor and vote Harry Reid out of office. Thank you.
I'm for ramming this through because of the inability for Repubs to get beyond their political blockade. This poll, however, is definitely suspect.
All politics aside, just answer this question. Why do we in the United States pay almost twice as much for health care than all the countries that have better health care? And there are lots of countries that have better health care than us.
Just by the measure of lowest infant mortality we rank 39th in the world. Is that what it's about for conservatives? It's Ok for a baby to die from poor medical care just as long as you don't have an abortion?
Lisa Mascaro..Why dont you read some of these comments..And stop writing such trash!!!
Comment removed by moderator. Vulgar language and attacking another commenter.
How do you propose that the insurance companies will be able to keep costs down when they have to cover more people? American, as a business man, do you understand the difference between profit and profit margin? Are insurance companies supposed to have a zero profit margin? Do you have a zero profit margin? Highly unlikely.
Never has the government forced us to buy something. You do not have a choice... buy insurance or pay a penalty and possibly go to jail. I know, give me that well you have to have auto insurance line, but, if I don't drive, I don't have to have auto insurance. If I breath, I have to have health insurance.
Lisa Mascaro,
THANK YOU.
Great article.
sgt(hidingundera)rock and his Republican friends CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!
This will drive them NUTS!
The research is pretty clear: compared to other industrialized nations with nationalized health care, our for-profit system is more expensive and less effective (T.R. Reid's work, for instance). What I find most depressing, though, is when talking to those most vehemently against nationalized health care (the anti-tax, far-right teabaggers), you can't even broach the subject of the public good. If they don't see it as bettering them personally (the more-me-now mentality), they call it "socialism." A nationalized health care system would, of course, benefit them personally, but in what ways are apparently too complex for them to comprehend. If it's not black/white, good/evil they can't wrap their dittoheads around it. Sad.
They support it because they don't have the cognition to know what it is. Conversely, they don't want to acknowledge their incipient ignorance.
There's so many counterarguments to your post, cashinhand, it's hard to know where to begin. But let me just ask--do you also want to privatize the roads, clean water facilities, the military, the prisons, the sewer system, social security, education, the parks, etc? Imagine when there's a profit motif in locking people up. Imagine when China is able to pay more for our water than we can. Imagine when you can't afford to pay for your cancer treatment--oh wait, the last one's already the case for far too many Americans.
Oops--I meant "profit motive." Apologies.
Wow, just imagine if Social Security was privatized. That would mean the looters in Washington wouldn't be able to take the money that is put into it and give it to those who don't deserve it. When has not wanting a bigger government become not wanting any government? The federal government is supposed to provide for our defense so therefore the military argument about it being privatized is stupid. Why do we need a federal and state education department? Get rid of one of them. Clean water facilities, etc would probably be more efficient if they were ran by private sector than government. Do you think that a HOSPITAL will deny the treatment for someone who is dying? That is against the law already, and has nothing to do with insurance. Heck, there were stories in the last year about how UMC is providing dialysis to illegal aliens that are not paying for it. What do you have to say about that?
HST: which federal agency do you work for?
Someone should tell these people they can get the same thing in Cuba. Go for it.
True, there is a law requiring hospitals to admit anyone suffering catastrophic health issues (e.g. heart attack.) Indeed, this is one of the reasons health care costs are so high in this country, for it is far better and cheaper to work to prevent such catastrophes. But the smaller preventive steps (e.g. regular check-ups, blood pressure screenings) are denied to those without health care.
What a biased and misleading poill. The questions were misleading.
funny how the Sun has to get their news souce from a blog. Truly pathetic.
HST: which federal agency do you work for?
Really mikegino? An ad hominem? What a trenchant counterpoint.
Reconciliation is a process that has been used more than 20 times in 30 years... most recently by the Republicans during the Bush administration.
They chose to "cram legislation down the peoples' throat" four different times. Where was the Republican opposition to it, then?
There was none. These hypocrites revel in their double standard. Since Reid outmaneuvered and outsmarted them, all they can do is cry and whine.
"Twenty-two reconciliation bills were passed between 1980 and 2008, although three (written by Republican majorities in Congress) were vetoed by President Clinton and never became law."
Then they whine about public opinion?
Overwhelmingly, public opinion supports a public option. Republicans are against it.
Overwhelmingly, public opinion supports repealing the Bush tax cuts for those making more than $250k a year. Republicans are against it.
Overwhelmingly, public opinion supports Obama's proposed bank tax. Republicans are against it.
Overwhelmingly, public opinion supports more financial regulations on Wall Street. Republicans are against them.
Overwhelming, public opinion supports additional mortgage relief assistance. Senate Republicans voted against it, unanimously.
Republicans don't care about public opinion. They want to stall the Congress in the hopes it will help their election campaigns.
I got a tax cut from reconcilliation and i'm not RICH!
But for sure my premiums will go up if this bill passes.
This is almost laughable. The poll was conducted by Research 2000 for Progressive Change Campaign Committee, Credo Action and Democracy for America. And I no doubt can find a poll which disagrees.
I love how it is stated by edgewise that republicans don't care about public opinion when it's been Obama and the dems that have clearly demonstrated by their actions that the majority of Americans mean nothing to them.
Edgewise--by pointing out these hypocrisies, I think you are veering too close to logic and fact for the teabagging crowd. Better stick with hatred, fear, paranoia, and other base emotions if you want them to understand. Oh, and always try to frame it as a benefit to them, personally--if it has anything to do with the public good they will yelp "socialism."
Get R Done Harry!
Living in a country with universal healthcare, I do hope that America is able to reform their own healthcare in such a way that covers everyone.
However, having one party ram it through despite almost universal non-support from the other party, seems like a very poor strategy.
For various reasons, a large number of Americans adamantly do not want universal health care.
Perhaps because of the stupendous cost of universality, now is in fact not the time to make any major reforms.
America's financial situation right now is scary. Eventually, one hopes, that will change. You don't buy a new car when you can't pay the house mortgage.
Obama is a Socialist/Communist Dictator. Let him get by with ramming Healthcare down our throats and he will go on to finish destroying our economy and country.
Told ya!!!
Whatever credibility Lisa might have enjoyed in the past is now in the crapper.
Talk about one sided, whew !
"Obama is a Socialist/Communist Dictator." Yeah, Chuckles, and I hear from the right-wing radio bloviators that he also eats kittens for breakfast and pushes old ladies down the stairs. Good thing we have you around to save us.
The Poll I saw was 65% against.
Propaganda nonsense.
Democrats are bankrupting Vegas and the
country.
OBAMA HATES VEGAS
Steve Wynn said Vegas woes are Obamas fault.
Comment removed by moderator. Comment contained a personal attack.
"propaganda nonsense." That about sums it up from the right.
I TOLD YA!!!
Sergio - as always, you do not disappoint! Hilarious!!!! I love it!!
Cashinhand--the VA is a government run health care system, so yet another form of socialism that I suspect you would like privatized?
Why would anyone who pays taxes not want health-care for themselves and their family in return? They've been so brainwashed by the corporations! LOL
Comment removed by moderator. Comment contained a personal attack.
Well played cashinhand I don't think there is anything else he will understand
*please note the sarcasm
Just as good of a poll as something out of the Lewin Group.
The teabags and dittoheads will be the first to sign-up for the exchange or public option. After all they are the ones whining the most about "Medicare Cuts."
They only managed to muster 20 people to protest Obama in Green Valley.
yeah right sergio, and you got a condo in lake las vegas you are willing to sell.
Sergio,
1 & 3
1- your math sucks. show your work.
3- you reference one doctor with an anti-establishment axe to grind and books to sell.
Anyone (you) who deems themselves infallible is suffering from narcissistic delusion.
My evidence?
http://sergio-the-prophet.blogspot.com/2...
Care to site your own personal references? Have you any education or professional experience in any of the these matters? Have you any research beyond your conspiracy websites?
You are a joke. That is why I look forward to your posts! It is comedy that never fails and it makes me happy. :)
Brush you have no idea what you are talking about all you demorons want is free handouts. You are the ones that arent working and want the working people to pay for everything you do. Why dont you go out and get a job so that you can pay for you own health care. What we need to do is get all the Mexicans out of this country and get back to the American people working. I cant even go to Popeye's chicken and order chicken in English. So all this other BS means nothing. Lets quit rebuilding a city that we have no business being in. Get all the Mexicans and people that arent paying taxes out of here and this country would be fine. And get the American people back to work. It makes me sick how many Mexicans are working out here and how many Americans are at home collecting unemployment.
Anybody read the poll questions?
It is like this:
Let's just say, in this instance, you believed that the Health Care Bill is the greatest thing on the planet and it would help your family and your dog would die if it did not pass then would you be OK if the Senate Democrats passed it via reconciliation?
Again, the Sun is trying to pass off crap as steak.
Sergio,
I know you're in CR, but for the purposes of this comment section, I believe the 5th Amendment still applies.
everyone keeps wrting about how "they" found cheap insurance and so should the rest of us. Please tell us the NAME and PHONE NUMBER of the cheap insurance company. Or, better still. have the "cheap insurance provider" send me a policy ALREADY signed for the low low rates. Oh yes, I'm not Ensign's relative, oh yeah I have "people" work for me. Oh yeah someone at the company has children [remember--childbirth is a pre-existing condition, but then so is adoption, or having no children.] So the mythical health policy vanishes.
Comment removed by moderator. Comment contained a personal attack.
You watch Greid/Obamination apologists, The forcing of the hated healthcare bill down American's throughts is going to get each and every member of government who participated in it's passing VOTED OUT OF OFFICE!!!!
That's throats.. sorry..
HST: please answer the question and I don't care about your trench mouth.
Comment removed by moderator. Comment contained a personal attack.
READ THE QUESTION:
"If the Senate passes a health care reform bill that you consider to be beneficial to your family, would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass that bill with a majority vote, or not?"
WHAT A LOAD PIECE OF CRAP OF A QUESTION FOR A POLL!!!
IF THE SENATE PASSES A HEALTH CARE REFORM BILL THAT YOU CONSIDER TO BE BENEFICIAL TO YOUR FAMILY...
They could have said:
"Would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass the existing Senate Health Care Bill with a majority vote, or not?"
The LV SUN is at it again....
So what are the poll results from LarryVegas' very scientific poll?
Do you remember when Larry quoted an internet poll to prove how much people loved Sarah Palin?
People could vote as many times as they liked in that poll. All it told me was that Sarah probably needs security 2/7 cause she has some really crazy stalkers.
But that poll? It was good enough for Larry. He quoted it.
When he disagrees with the result, suddenly his standards change.
So what about it, Larry? Internet polls are A-ok with you, but this one isn't? Why?
I meant security "24/7," of course, but my question stands:
Why is an unscientific internet poll ok, but this poll wrong, Larry?
Well, if ksand00 can't read or comprehend the question as I wrote it, there is no reason for me to explain it to you. One more time for our special elitist...
READ THE QUESTION slowly and for comprehension this time...
"If the Senate passes a health care reform bill that you consider to be beneficial to your family, would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass that bill with a majority vote, or not?"
WHAT A LOAD PIECE OF CRAP OF A QUESTION FOR A POLL!!!
IF THE SENATE PASSES A HEALTH CARE REFORM BILL THAT YOU CONSIDER TO BE BENEFICIAL TO YOUR FAMILY...
They could have said:
"Would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass the existing Senate Health Care Bill with a majority vote, or not?"
GET IT???
I'm asking why you care, since you obviously weren't concerned with the impartiality of a poll when it was to your benefit.
It's pretty obvious you don't like the result of this poll, so you instantly hike your standards.
When trolling for a poll which reinforces your beliefs, though, you'll pick anything... literally ANYTHING that helps you believe you're right.
As in: the Sarah Palin poll YOU cited that was FAR LESS SCIENTIFIC than this one.
Why the double standard, Larry?
I believe ksand99's comment contained a personal attack...
Well, if ksand00 still can't read or comprehend the question as I wrote it, maybe someone else can explain it to ksand00.
READ THE QUESTION a little more slowly and for comprehension this time...
"If the Senate passes a health care reform bill that you consider to be beneficial to your family, would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass that bill with a majority vote, or not?"
WHAT A LOAD PIECE OF CRAP OF A QUESTION FOR A POLL!!!
IF THE SENATE PASSES A HEALTH CARE REFORM BILL THAT YOU CONSIDER TO BE BENEFICIAL TO YOUR FAMILY...
They could and should have said:
"Would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass the existing Senate Health Care Bill with a majority vote, or not?"
Still need help???
I will reword this one so it doesn't get bonked...
Well, if ksand00 still can't read or comprehend the question as I wrote it, maybe someone else can explain it to ksand00.
READ THE QUESTION a little more slowly and for comprehension this time...
"If the Senate passes a health care reform bill that you consider to be beneficial to your family, would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass that bill with a majority vote, or not?"
WHAT A LOADED QUESTION FOR A POLL!!!
IF THE SENATE PASSES A HEALTH CARE REFORM BILL THAT YOU CONSIDER TO BE BENEFICIAL TO YOUR FAMILY...
They could and should have said:
"Would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass the existing Senate Health Care Bill with a majority vote, or not?"
Still need help???
Larry,
I'm not seeing it, pal.
would it be better if they had asked;
"If the senate passes a health care reform bill that you consider NOT BENEFICIAL to your family"... I mean, what you would've liked is for the poll to come out differently, so you would like the question to have been worded differently; I don't think it's outrageous to ask folks from Nevada if they would like to see this darn bill finally passed IF IT IS BENEFICIAL TO THEIR FAMILY. It's only a "loaded" question because ya don't like the answer.
This is the same poll Lisa Mascaro cited in an earlier article on Health Care. This poll was weighted in favor of Democrats. Funny How Ms Mascro will ignore other polls that show an opposite result
Nope, it's pretty obvious Larry only cares about impartiality when the poll delivers an answer he disagrees with.
He proved this when he cited that horrible internet poll about Sarah Palin. It lacked any credibility, as it had tens of millions of responses and any person could just sit back and click with their mouse a hundred or a thousand times.
He thought that poll was valid. He cited it.
Now he's trying to discredit a poll which, in comparison, makes it look like Larry just has another double standard.
His standard for polls that he agrees with is horribly, horribly low.
His standard for polls that he hates is sky-high.
Yup, that's a double standard, as clear as day.
larry; yes i would vote for any legislation that improves the health of our great nation, cost be damned. spend it now before some bozo starts another war we dont need!
As a scientist I believe the opposition to helping ones fellow man is based on the addiction to endorphine release as a reward for cruelty. Cruelty has the same dopamine basis as many cravings and satisfactions and would seem to be the basis of the reward behavior by those in love with partisan attacks and the participation in cruel comment toward the other group. Otherization is the term in cruelty behavioral research. It seems obvious that health care for all is a good thing for humanity to endeavor towards. The worship of the golden calf is another matter. From a Darwinian perspective it is a survival advantage if a country is united. To divide the country and descend to endless cuelity towards ones fellow citizens is a weakness that will eventually be exploited by those wishing economic conquest, slavery, or internal disarray to the point of paralysis. This addiction to the casual cruelty of partisan destruction is a growing malignant cancer on the soul of America. Both sides, in their replete joy of hatred, are destroying the very fabric of America. There are better endorphine "rushes" availiable beyond the pathetic one of casual cruelty. This is a tired sport for the lazy. Go jump out of an airplane or climb a mountain and experience something beyond this banal addictions thrill.
... If BUSH/CHENEY can USE "reconciliation" as-a-WEAPON for TAX BREAKS for thee SUPER-RICH (their BASE), WEAKEN the US CONSTITUTION & declare an ILLEGAL WAR in IRAQ, then FULL-SPEED-AHEAD DEMS!!!
dippy...
I would be in favor of a health care reform bill that I consider to be beneficial to my family and the nation.
Unfortunately, the current health care bill would not be beneficial to my family or the nation.
The editorial is titled "Nevadans support Democrats' strategy on health care" and is insinuating that the Poll is talking about the current health care bill.
BUT, if you read the poll question, it does not state that they are talking about the current health care bill.
Based on the wording of the poll question, even I would probably agree with it.
BUT IT IS A GOTCHA TYPE QUESTION, and if you agree with it's wording, then you might be a Liberal...
Ah once again the BO Comedy show and Circus has found a way to tweek the true details of what the people say. I have not found one person that agrees with the Almighty BO and his cohorts in crime in the democratic party. Everyone I have talked to wants BO to toss it all out and start fresh with it all on tv. Most people understand that the only reason that the Almighty BO wants to cover 30 million people is so that the 20 million Illegals that he plans to make Legal citizens, will vote for the democratic party for life.
Is that what "conservative" hero Reagan thought when he gave amnesty to the illegal immigrants, Apex?
At least I could respect someone who is honest. It's the dishonest people who play partisan games that drive me bonkers.
Like people who accept and trumpet crazy internet polls but ignore polls that don't give them the answer they want. Those people are just dishonest.
Comment removed by moderator. Comment contained a personal attack.
Have you read his blog? As if his credibility doesn't suffer enough from his postings, take a look at his sidebar. It's a conspiracy theories greatest hits. Aliens, 9/11, the Freemasons, etc.
I mean, not like I was expecting much from a self-described "prophet," but still... it's worth a chuckle or two.
As for AM radio? All those empty heads make for one wicked echo chamber, huh?
Las Vegas Sun thanks for your reporting. It is unfortunate that an intelligent discussion is so rare in the forum. The decent posts are a good thing but it would be nice to have the background noise of hate based posts removed at a higher frequency. There are other places for the haters to rant and rave such as on craigslist. Anyway Las Vegas Sun I enjoy your paper and hope that the quality of the experience of the poster is meaningful to you. If posters have multiple removals for vulgarity would it not be in our best interest to 86 them for good? Perhaps then we could hear from more nice folks like the Canadians above. Thanks Canadians enjoyed your perspective please send more.
Below are SgtRock's Poll questions.
I polled 1,000 Nevadans. 800 Voted "yes" to each question. The 200 that voted "no" were either drunk, in a coma or using drugs.
Question 1:
"If the Senate passes a sewage bill that you consider to be beneficial to your family, would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass that bill with a majority vote, or not?"
Question 2:
"If the Senate passes a MegaBucks bill that you consider to be beneficial to your family, would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass that bill with a majority vote, or not?"
Question 3
"If the Senate passes a Do Away With All Taxes bill that you consider to be beneficial to your family, would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass that bill with a majority vote, or not?"
Question 4:
"If the Senate passes a This Poll Question Will Always Solict A Yes Answer bill that you consider to be beneficial to your family, would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass that bill with a majority vote, or not?"
Question 5:
"If the Senate passes a The Las Vegas Sun Is Not A Newspaper bill that you consider to be beneficial to your family, would you object to the Senate's use of "reconciliation" rules to pass that bill with a majority vote, or not?"
Hmmmm...I do declare if one "believes" a bill to be beneficial to their family then they should not object to a bill being passed.
bradgore,
Amen, amen, amen, AMEN!
NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Were did you poll? E.LA?
Your poll is definitely bogus. Please don't use
ACORN to run your polls.
From a scientific perspective, the referenced poll's viability can not be ascertained.
The editorial is titled "Nevadans support Democrats' strategy on health care" and is insinuating that the Poll is talking about the current health care bill.
BUT, if you read the poll question, it does not state that they are talking about the current health care bill.
Therefore and in conclusion, I have reached the scientific extrapolation that this poll is a bunch of CRAP...
SgtRock, thanks for your reporting. It is unfortunate that an intelligent discussion is so rare with Liberals in the forum. The decent Conservative posts are a good thing but it would be nice to have the constant whining of demonizing Liberals moved to a higher frequency with mr ed. There are other places for the Liberal haters to rant and rave such as on the huffington post. Anyway SgtRock, I enjoy your sincere expertise and hope that the quality of the experience of your posting is as meaningful to you as it has been for us. If Liberal posters have multiple episodes of demonizing would it not be in their best interest to eliminate them for good? Perhaps then we could hear from more nice folks like Sergio the Prophet. Thanks SgtRock, I enjoyed your perspective please post more.
Arguing with LarryVegas is like ramming your head against the wall, Ksand. He hasn't the capacity to grasp abstract concepts.
We both know Larry and SgtRock sit in front of their computers ALL DAY EVERY DAY regurgitating the same ole Glenn Hannity rhetoric on every single comment section for any story regardless of topic.
I'm pretty sure if the Repubs knew you were arguing for them fellas, you would be disowned.
Sergio, please stop. My stomach is killing me.
Enjoy this while you can before they flag it. Into the censorship are you boys?
LarryRock...
It's alllmost in sync...EASY! nice, and, easy...
merging now in progress...
commence countdown... 3 2 1 zeeero! we have MELD!
Houston, That's a MELD! Congratulations, everyone, another win for the space program!
What about SgtVegas?
Does briant have a lot of experience ramming his head against a wall? Maybe so, but briant still has enough good sense to figure out that this poll is as phony as ksand00's attempt to deflect this discussion to something more palatable for kevin to spin...
sgtvegas is tougher;
we're going with an infinite regress, Houston, DO YOU COPY? That's an infinite REGRESS, EVERYONE... We need the interferometer, NOW!
Going in 3-2-1..... OH My GOD! What have we DONE!
"We came upon a man o' war anchored off the coast. There wasn't so much as a shed there yet she was shelling the bush. In the empty imensity of Earth,sky,and water there she stood...firing into a continent. Pop would go one of the three inch guns, a projectle would give a feeble screech, a small puff of smoke would appear and vanish. And nothing happened. Nothing could happen. There was more than a touch of insanity in the proceeding and it was not at all dissipated by a fellow passenger on board assuring me earnestly there was a camp of Americans (he called them Libs or Conservatives I forget which) hidden out of sight somewhere in the bush".- Modification of J. Conrad. Heart of Darkness.
Nope, I think you're underestimating our friend Hurricane Larry.
He knows he referenced an unscientific internet poll when defending his idol Sarah Palin. Now he wants to whine about the wording of a question.
He knows, just as the rest of us know, that his shameless double standard is exposed bare for all to see... that why he won't address it.
He's hoping that if he plays some more, the signal to noise ratio will drown out the criticism.
It's just not working.
As for SgtRock, he's another hypocrite.
He has also referenced an unscientific internet poll... from the Huffington Post, no less... while trying to defend his positions.
He'll cite a Huffington Post internet poll, but this one is somehow out of bounds?
Another double standard!
Thanks Lisa, The TRUTH IS OUT THERE.
The only people against health care reform are
greedy, selfish republicans.
The majority of Americans want and need health
care reform.
Thank you, President Obama, Harry Reid and
Nancy Pelosi. Let's get it done.
Signal to noise ratio? Well put. Larry's stuck using cassette tapes, eh? Join the present Larry. Go digital. The clarity will enlighten you.
" to free a nation from error is to enlighten the individual and only to the degree that the individual will be receptive of truth can a nation be free from that vanity which ends in national ruin"----------homer lea 1909.
If Nevadans support the Democrat Healtcare bill, then they slso must support higher unemployment, because that is what this bill will bring.
I would be in favor of a health care reform bill that I consider to be beneficial to my family and the nation.
Unfortunately, the current health care bill would not be beneficial to my family or the nation.
The editorial is titled "Nevadans support Democrats' strategy on health care" and is insinuating that the Poll is talking about the current health care bill.
BUT, if you read the poll question, it does not state that they are talking about the current health care bill.
Based on the wording of the poll question, even I would probably agree with it.
BUT IT IS A GOTCHA TYPE QUESTION, and if you agree with it's wording, then you might be a Liberal...
I apologize for citing a poll from the Huffington Post.
I know better for the Huffington Post has tons of crap in it everyday but like this "newspaper". Like for instance this artice is a 10 on the crap scale (1 small crap to 10 super-size crap).
I am so sorry.
I do better in the future.
The Dems will call the Republicans bluff and push healthcare thru. Once the bill is passed and the world doesn't end, there will be 30 million more citizens voting for the Democrats!
The Republicans are not the ones bluffing. It's the Democraps who are threatening to use the nuclear option if the Republicans do not fall in line.
I say,LET THEM TRY...
Hey, Harry, you are my guy. Get it done - the Repukes will never support any reasonable deal!
If this has such broad based support, you would think that the approval rating for congress would be higher than 14%.
"Research 2000 for Progressive Change Campaign Committee, Credo Action and Democracy for America."
I believe in the old communist USSR they also had many equally impressive sounding names.
Harry and Barry are similar to used car salesmen who show you only one car, and try to make you buy it, even if you want something better...
I am not sure why we are pointing out the obvious that his poll is worthless.
Don't we want the libs to drink this koolaid and continue to driving their party over the cliff?
Yeah, I remember the "koolaid" jabs during the election. How'd that work out for ya? You betcha!
HEALTH CARE REFORM WILL BE DONE.
Quit crying, larry and the rest of you greedy
right-wingers.
Democrats will save the day and our country.
Yes sir, there teamster. Democrats have sure saved the day. They can't even pass that there health care bill of Obama's, even with total control of both houses of Congress and the White House.
Ksand,, did you make enough Koolaid for everyone on this page. I was against Reagans amnesty for Illegals. I am against more Illegals being given amnesty. I am also against All anchor babies being given citizenship. The 14th admendment does not grant them citizenship. If you read it the way it was written not with Politically correct liberal speak and meanings. Just think if all Illegals could be made to pay up on all of thier back taxes and for all of the state and federal govenment sources and funds that they have used. Also pay for all of the damage they have done to the priviate citizens of this country by stealing thier Social Security #. Illegals in this country get better care then American citizens that have to live on the streets. And when it comes to Polls I had the domeocratic party call me and ask if i would answer some questions. I said that I was a Republican, they hung up. Guess you only want to hear from your side.
Rumor has it that Obama plans to only serve one term and back Rory Reid for President in 2012. This.is.a.no.bullcrapper.
A typical liberals way of thinking is that they are the only ones that know whats right. I did not like all that Bush did but I was damn glad that He was in office. The Choices from the democratic side would have had us under the bus long before now. We would have been reading in one or more foriegn languages and our flag would be some other shape and color.
"The editorial is titled "Nevadans support Democrats' strategy on health care" and is insinuating that the Poll is talking about the current health care bill."
Not to those who passed reading comprehension in 8th grade.
The key word in that title is "strategy," and the article goes to great lengths to describe that strategy as reconciliation.
The poll did not measure whether Nevadans favor the health care bill itself. It was about strategy.
I don't know why it's so hard to get you to understand something so simple.
The editorial is titled "Nevadans support Democrats' strategy on health care" and is insinuating that the Poll is talking about the current health care bill.
BUT, if you read the poll question, it does not state that they are talking about the current health care bill.
Based on the wording of the poll question, even I would probably agree with it.
BUT IT IS A GOTCHA TYPE QUESTION, and if you agree with it's wording, then you might be a Liberal...
I am alright with the change in health care. Here is why. Right now, my health coverage is $375.00 a month for 2 adults and 2 children. Another $80.00 a month for my child's PT and an additional $180.00 a month for my wife's asthma medication. This totals $635.00 a month. I took my child to a UMC one day, the one that we always go to. I overheard the women behind the counter tell two illegals, the woman was pregnant(because they told her they were illegal)that they could not afford the $180.00 for the visit.She said no problem, you have a 50% discount because of your status and then she said and I swear you only pay $45.00 and you are covered.I was dumbfounded at this. The man then took out a wad of $100.00 bills out of his pocket. (there must have been about $600.00 or $700.00 bills)and paid. After that,an old American veteran, who was very sick went to the counter and was told in no uncertain terms that you must pay the full $180.00 or you will not be seen!!!!!!!!!!WTF is going on here. This is why I want a universal coverage to cover all Americans, not just illegals.If people on this topic think that having no health care reform is the way to stay are indeed idiotic. If illegals can get it like that, the veterans need that too!!!!!!! Why am I paying $635.00 a month and they get it at a discount? This is not right!!!!!!BTW my tax dollars are paying for that type of crap too, so I am getting double dipped!!!!!!!!Wake up people.
WOW...POLLING DONE BY PROGRESSIVE LIBERAL GROUP...That is something to believe. This is total nonsense. I do not know one person who is buying into this continued manipulative push for health care.
skycat--
You need to start talking to people who have no
health care, not just your greedy republican
friends who do.
Harry F'n Reid is a liar and is desperately trying to hold on to his seat.
VOTE HARRY OUT. I don't think I have ever witnessed such a corrupt politician in my life...and I'm old.
Oooooohhh! It's a GOTCHA question.
Someone's been listening to too much Sarah Palin.
Look at the crazy republicans, trying to make a mountain out of a molehill. The title says "strategy," the article is about reconciliation... the STRATEGY the Democrats are taking. The question is about the STRATEGY the Democrats may take.
Only the truly dense wouldn't realize that! Maybe one of those Palinistas?
Here's the solution to covering illegals with free medical care:
FORCE HARRY REID AND ALL SENATORS (SENATE OR HOUSE) AND REPRESENTATIVES (CONGRESS) TO CHANGE OUR Laws.
First, change the law to state that illegals get NO free medical - or subsidized - care. Take away ALL benefits - food stamps, housing, energy assistance, medical benefits, special programs, tuition, public education, college tuition. When they STOP getting all of this - they will go home.
Secondly - change the immigration law to limit the number of legal immigrants and to make it a felony to trespass into our country...fund ICE (who enforces immigration laws), and then enforce the laws.
Thirdly - our Constitution has been wrongly interpreted...we DO NOT have to offer American citizenship to a child born in the U.S. - when parents are illegals. This simply needs clarification legislation.
WE WOULD HAVE LOTS OF MONEY TO COVER OUR HEALTH INSURANCE IF WE DID THIS.
IF WE DON'T - THEN WE ARE GOING BROKE...You'll have trouble feeding your families if this health scam goes through. It will solve nothing...and accumulate so much cost and debt...well, you'll have to research that yourself.
Two things. First, I do not believe that this poll reflects the majority opinion of Nevadans; I think that it should be viewed with a great deal of skepticism. Second, it is not a question of whether we need to improve the country's health care system, of course we do. The question is whether we want a government run health care plan. It amazes me that people do not see the danger in allowing the government to control more and more of our lives. It is a bit like the battle between good and evil as depicted in the Bible (I realize that the simple mention of the Bible necessarily poisons my argument in the eyes of the progressive, liberal atheists who would relish the prospect of handing over our freedoms to big government--but still I will use the reference).
The plan for good, as described in the Bible, grants people the free agency to choose their way through life. The plan for bad, as described in the Bible, would have forced, constrained and compelled our actions, just like Big Government does. Our founding fathers were inspired men who framed the Constitution (remember this document) explicitly to insure limited government and more personal freedom and independent action. The more power and control we give government over the functions and activities of the country, the more power the government has over us personally and individually. We will lose our free agency (freedoms) and will be compelled to live as the government specifies, thus living in a manner consistent with the plan for bad, as described in the Bible.
All of us should recognize that our government is on the path to socialism. Remember that in addition to being hell on their citizens, socialist and communist countries have failed in almost every instance. Remember also that government run plans do not work, just look at Social Security, Medicare-Medicaid, the Post Office, Amtrak, etc. Don't give control of the health care plan to the government as another program they screw up and use to finish us off financially. Good hell, wake up people.
DefendUrRights....
You'll have trouble feeding your family if
health care reform DOESN'T pass.
You need to do more research.
tickedoff....
Jesus was a Liberal.
He said we should help the sick and feed the
poor.
Where do you fit in with that?
teamster,
I don't believe for one minute that Jesus was a Liberal. His plan granted us our free agency.
Do I believe we should help the sick and feed the poor? Absolutely! Do I think that it should be left up to the government to do that? No! We as individuals, private organizations, charitable groups, faith based charities could do a much better job--and would do if the government would get out of the way.
50 million Americans have no health care.
A public option is needed.
Yes, Jesus was a Liberal.
Government cant even administer the "public option" it already has MEDICARE. It admits there is 30% pure fraud, let alone waste in the program, and they blew through the supposed 'trust fund' to pay for whats already been promised.
Why would we even think they could mess with whats left of health care in the private sector and make THAT better?
Take a look at Social Security, the biggest ponzi scheme ever, which has promised to current recipients what the future recipients will pay later. Isnt that a ponzi scheme? Madoff went to jail for it, but congress gets away with it.
And they want to EXPAND government into health care MORE?
No thanks.
This editorial is titled "Nevadans support Democrats' strategy on health care" and is insinuating that the Poll is talking about the current health care bill.
BUT, if you read the poll question, it does not state that they are talking about the current health care bill.
Based on the wording of the poll question, even I would probably agree with it.
BUT IT IS A GOTCHA TYPE QUESTION, and if you agree with it's wording, then you might be a Liberal...
"This editorial is titled "Nevadans support Democrats' strategy on health care" and is insinuating that the Poll is talking about the current health care bill."
Only to those who failed 8th grade reading.
"BUT, if you read the poll question, it does not state that they are talking about the current health care bill."
CORRECT!
"Based on the wording of the poll question, even I would probably agree with it."
So you support recociliation, the Democrats' strategy on health care.
"BUT IT IS A GOTCHA TYPE QUESTION, and if you agree with it's wording, then you might be a Liberal..."
Oh go back to Wasilla, Larry!
The fact is: you cite internet polls which have zero validity and then come here and attack this one because you don't like the answer. You said Sarah got millions of votes when she didn't.
Your faux outrage about the wording of a poll question is transparent. You're fighting a battle you lost the day you cited that ridiculous poll.
When will ksand00 ever stick to the topic at hand without all of his deflection spinning?
THE POLLING DONE BY PROGRESSIVE LIBERAL GROUP and THIS IS A GOTCHA TYPE QUESTION...
Go figure, you betcha...
I hope and pray that the Democrats believe polls like this.
Go for it!!!!
Shove the damn ObamaCrapCare down America's throat via reconciliation.
Why can't Larry admit he cited a crazy internet poll when it agreed with him, but doesn't like this one because he disagrees with it?
What a flaming double standard that Larry has...
He thinks people are too dumb to realize it. That kind of elitist thought got him caught, though.
He wants to cry about the credibility of this poll, but he cited a poll in which ANYBODY, including non-US citizens, could vote an unlimited amount of times!
He thought that poll was just fine!
Now he's suddenly concerned about the question being asked?
Nope, it's a classic Hurricane Larry spin!
Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi has an incredible message for her Democratic colleagues:
"Support health care even if it costs them their seat in Congress."
All Right... Now we are talking, but talk is cheap and when the big vote is at hand, many Democratic House members will be absence and not vote.
It will be Pelosi and Reid who will be sacrificed to the lions...
A Newsweek poll asked whether Obama or republicans have a better approach to dealing with the 9 most-contentious issues facing America.
Obama won on:
Creating jobs (almost 2-to-1 margin)
Afghanistan (19% more favor Obama)
The economy (16% more favor Obama)
Iraq (15% more favor Obama)
Tax policy (10% more favor Obama)
Debt & Deficit (9% more favor Obama)
Iran (10% more favor Obama)
Climate change (12% more favor Obama)
The sole victory for the republicans came under "terrorism trials," which they only won by 4%.
It is clear Americans don't want to go in the direction the republicans are proposing.
I think that K Sandoval is talking to himself today.
Sorry there Kevin, I don't think anyone's buying today.
You might as well close up shop and go home...
Yup, more proof that the people who keep shouting about a poll in their favor want to ignore any poll that disagrees with them!
Thanks for proving my point, Larry!
Kevin, the only point you have is on top of your head...
Delay health care reform until you get it right.
Poll after poll shows the American people don't trust the direction the republicans want to take the nation.
I wonder if those people suspicious of the republicans are tea partiers?
Hmmm... why can't Larry admit he cited a crazy internet poll when it agreed with him, but doesn't like this one because he disagrees with it?
What a flaming double standard that Larry has...
He thinks people are too dumb to realize it. That kind of elitist thought got him caught, though.
He wants to cry about the credibility of this poll, but he cited a poll in which ANYBODY, including non-US citizens, could vote an unlimited amount of times!
He thought that poll was just fine!
Now he's suddenly concerned about the question being asked?
Nope, it's a classic Hurricane Larry spin!
I am so happy.
The lib koolaid drinkers are ignoring the vast amount of pool data and just soaking up some push polls from lib groups.
Like I said......I hope the Dems go full steam ahead....push the petal to the metal......and just shove ObamaCrapCare down America's throat.
SgtRock, didn't you hear?
LarryVegas told us that the healthcare bill has made great strides. Now, there's only a 7% difference in support for it. If you understand what a MoE is, it could be more like a 1% difference.
The American people are seeing through the lies and falsehoods the republicans have been pushing for the last year. You should be afraid.
Yes, yes, yes......keeping drinking the koolaid!
Please, please, please......shove that ObamaCare down America's throat.
It will be real tasty especially considering that the taxes and cuts start almost on day one the "benefits" start years later.
Good game plan.....don't pay attention to me.
Just drink the koolaid.
"It will be real tasty especially considering that the taxes and cuts start almost on day one the "benefits" start years later."
Wow, the republicans are lying through their teeth!
When the health care bill passes, insurance companies will no longer be able to drop you when you file a claim.
When the health care bill passes, insurance companies will no longer be able to discriminate against you for a pre-existing condition.
These benefits start almost immediately.
Why are the republicans lying about the benefits?
Oh man, it seems Sgt James F Nance Jr Rock has been listening to too much hate radio!
Rush Limbaugh repeated this false claim and got hammered for his lies!
Immediate benefits of health care passage:
1) Eliminating lifetime limits, and cap annual limits, on health-care benefits. In other words, if you get an aggressive cancer and your treatment costs an extraordinary amount, your insurer can't suddenly remind you that subparagraph 15 limited your yearly expenses to $30,000, and they're not responsible for anything above that.
2) No more rescissions.
3) Some interim help for people who have preexisting conditions, though the bill does not instantly ban discrimination on preexisting conditions.
4) Requiring insurers to cover preventive care and immunizations.
5) Allowing young adults to stay on their parent's insurance plan until age 26.
6) Developing uniform coverage documents so people can compare different insurance policies in an apples-to-apples fashion.
7) Forcing insurers to spend 80 percent of all premium dollars on medical care (75 percent in the individual market), thus capping the money that can go toward administration, profits, etc.
8) Creating an appeals process and consumer advocate for insurance customers.
9) Developing a temporary re-insurance program to help early retirees (folks over 55) afford coverage.
10) Creating an internet portal to help people shop for and compare coverage.
11) Miscellaneous administrative simplification stuff. (reduces costs!)
12) Banning discrimination based on salary (i.e., where a company that's not self-insured makes only some full-time workers eligible for coverage.
Don't believe the republicans' desperate lies!
ksand00 just doesn't get it..
The great majority of Americans do not like or want this piece of crap of a health care bill!!!
Just an hour ago, you told us that there was only a 7% difference between people who wanted to see it passed and who didn't.
And, again, you confuse plurality with majority. A majority is more than half. The last number you quoted, 49%, is less than half.
But Sgt James F Nance Jr Rock shouldn't lie about the benefits of the bill which go into effect within the first year. That's disgusting and dishonest, right Larry?
Thanks for pointing all that out.
Many of those things will pump up cost of
insurance and not reduce it.
Actually, the CBO says that the average family will see a double-digit drop in their health insurance premiums under the reforms in the Senate bill, SgtRock.
Try citing some facts rather than your debunked lies.
Let this be a lesson to you: never believe Rush Limbaugh.
So, Obamacare will cause the cost of private insurance to go up very soon.
It will cut billions in Medicare very soon.
It will raise taxes on various things very soon and make the cost of insurance go up even more.
Many of the benefits will take years to come into effect.
Excellent plan.....yes....believe your phony polls and drink the koolaid and shove ObamaCare down America's throat.
Oh man, Sgt James F Nance Jr Rock has completely spun his position.
First he said that there were NO BENEFITS when the bill passes.
Now he's saying EVERYTHING GOES INTO EFFECT when the bill passes.
Sgt jfNance32, you are making me dizzy with all your loopy rhetoric! You're so mad you got caught swilling the Limbaugh kool aid!
The CBO proves you wrong, Sgt James F Nance Jr Rock.
I support Free health care ! I live here with all my 15 relatives and we all support it? Don't we count ?? Thank You Senior Reid for making America a great place to visit long term !
The President and the CBO is playing a shell game with the Senate bill.
Start taxing immediately but wait 3 - 5 years before giving any benefits...
But it just doesn't matter,
Obama, Reid and Pelosi will posture for a reconciliation, but will drop it at the last minute because they know they do not have and will not get the votes.
Meanwhile, back at the ranch, Liberal posters will be name calling and demonizing everyone possible.
Reid and Pelosi = Please pass the bill by any means necessary.. We will then only have the Dems to thank for this POS of a bill come election time :)
Obama/Biden/Reid/Pelosi.. is this the best the Dems can do?
We can't afford a new health plan until we pay for Medicare, our current plan. On Oct. 11, 2009 Former Fed Chair Greenspan said that 50% of Medicare is taken from borrowed funds and there's a limit to how much people will loan the US treasury. Greenspan: "We have a huge fiscal hole out there: Medicare's benefits are only 50 percent funded". And "that implies is a " significant issuance of Treasury securities to meet the ever-growing and "indeterminately large federal deficit. You cannot continue to increase the federal debt. ..." http://abcnews.go.com/ThisWeek/Politics/....
In the healthcare summit last week, a middle-of-the-road House Democrat pointed out that the 50% unfunded Medicare mandate had caused a $37 Trillion dollar deficit in the past 9 years. Divided by the 135 Million tax filers is $247,000 per taxfiler. The IRS reports that they've never collected more than an than $5,000 a tax filer, which includes welfare mothers and teenagers.
The Heritage Foundation says that the Obama's new entitlements will cost an extra $1.1 Trillion a year for the next ten years http://www.heritage.org/Research/Welfare.... That's $8,666 extra tax per taxpayer, which suggests that taxes may triple to pay for the entitlements due to income erosion and fewer people working. What a bargain! We get universal insurance for only an additional $8600 a year per taxfiler!
The current political leaders will probably add this price to our national debt Overspending often causes hyperinflation. If unpaid, the national debt will double every 7 years according to the rule of 67, until the debt become too large to pay. Spending without collecting taxes will eventually cause either bankruptcy or hyperinflation. If the government repudiates its debt, many pensions will be destroyed, and it will be unable to borrow for emergencies such as war or natural disasters. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflat...
If there's no medium of exchange, paper money is worthless. Businesses close because they can't function without a way to collect income and bank it. Even viable companies close because the banks close due to the economic stresses and the lack of value of the money that their loans are made of. Unable to find work, People barter. Joblessness causes many to starve. There's no way to get loans except in foreign currency. Governments have difficulty supplying even essential services such as highway construction and maintenance, and as paying their police, fire and schools.
An actual Cases of Hyperinflation: In 1923 hyperinflation occurred when the Weimar Republic printed money to pay its employees. Due to a diminished tax base, They experienced a hyperinflation that impoverished the middle class by destroying their savings. The general population also suffered greatly, radicalizing them to the point where a large percentage joined the Nazi or Communist parties.
ksand, I asked over a 100 democrats if they were in favor of this health care option and actually 134 of them, well any way 115 said no. That's just the ones I knew. So not ever liberal democrat is in favor of it and teamster Jesus was not a liberal or conservative and he did not belong to the carpenters union. He did not belong to political party or ideas, so there.
Larry and ksand, stop with the insults towards each other looks like i'm watching a WWE match without the picture
Burritobandit, I asked 100 people if you ever had a point in one of your comments and 238 said no.
Americans do not support Democrats' strategy on health care.
Wise up Democrats, before it is too late...
Kevin: his comments are beyond the limits of your liberal intellect.
Thats funny I don't know one person in Nevada that wants this crap, wonder who they were polling?