DAILY MEMO: Gaming:

Lower blackjack minimum may not be deal for players

What might seem like a bargain often comes with rules that increase the house’s edge

TIFFANY BROWN / LAS VEGAS SUN FILE

In response to the recession, some casinos have lowered minimum bets for blackjack. But the cheaper games can have rules that boost the house edge, such as a 6-to-5 payout for blackjacks instead of the traditional 3-to-2. The change means a blackjack with a $10 bet wins only $12 instead of $15.

By Liz Benston (contact)

Monday, June 29, 2009 | 2 a.m.

Headlines from the Vegas gaming industry

With patrons as advisers, small casino thrives (6-10-09)

You’ve seen bargain-basement hotel rates and coupons for meals, show tickets and retail purchases — even volume discounts on bottle service in nightclubs and lounges.

But what are Strip casinos doing with their main attraction in the economic downturn?

Gambling games, priced in terms of how much players will lose over time, aren’t like products on a supermarket shelf. Or are they?

In fact, several Strip casinos have lowered table minimums on games in an apparent attempt to attract more customers during tough economic times. For example, Wynn Las Vegas offers some $25 double deck blackjack games on weekdays, down from a $50 per hand minimum. On the other end of the spectrum, and for a vastly different clientele, the Sahara is offering $1 blackjack.

Players view the moves as a retreat from the high minimums of years past, during the tourism boom. At the time, table minimums at many Strip properties rose sky-high, along with hotel room rates, mixed drink prices and restaurant checks.

Anthony Curtis, publisher of the Las Vegas Advisor newsletter, says many major casinos are lowering minimums to lure players. Curtis calls it a rare sign of player-friendliness by casinos loath to offer games that don’t make enough money to justify free drinks for gamblers and staff salaries.

High minimums “never made a lot of sense,” Curtis says, because they cause gamblers to burn through their bankrolls more quickly and leave.

Strip casinos in the downturn have become aggressive pitchmen for non-gambling discounts, plastering the Internet with offers for tourists as well as locals. Not so for gambling games.

Casinos — mindful of the competition, which can quickly adopt similar games or rules, unlike, say, shows, restaurants or other major attractions — are especially sensitive to details of their games.

For example, Curtis says the lower minimums have been reported everywhere, including at Harrah’s and MGM Mirage casinos.

But when Harrah’s Entertainment Western Region President Tom Jenkin is asked about any changes in limits, he says his company’s seven Las Vegas casinos “have not nor are we planning to lower table game limits.”

Caesars Palace, for example, which raised limits last year, offers “a wide range of betting limits, including the highest available in the city,” Jenkin adds.

So maybe when Jenkin says Harrah’s has not lowered game limits, he means it hasn’t lowered its maximums as opposed to the minimums.

And MGM Mirage spokeswoman Yvette Monet avoids using the word “lower” in her answer. “We adjust our table game limits based on daily visitor volume,” she says.

Another aspect of the games also comes into play — the rules. The more favorable the odds of a particular table game, the higher the minimum bet requirement — a strategy that limits the number of players who can take their shot against the casino. Lower limits almost always mean worse rules for players, says Al Rogers of Pi Yee Press, which publishes blackjack rules and odds by property in its Current Blackjack News newsletter.

Players may think they’re getting a better deal with a lower-minimum game when the opposite is typically true, he warns.

Rather than tempting players by reducing their house edge, Strip casinos, Rogers says, have continued a trend that began before the recession, to lower the odds for blackjack and related games by worsening rules.

Blackjack wagers on the Strip fell by nearly $1 billion for the 12 months ended April 30 after peaking the previous year, according to the Gaming Control Board. Strip casinos kept 10.9 percent of those wagers, a fraction of a percentage point less than in the previous period.

Rogers contends that casinos have sacrificed profit in their attempts to thwart card-counters, a small segment of players relative to the masses who are also turned off by games in which the odds are more favorable to the house.

For example, many Strip casinos offer games paying 6-to-5 for blackjacks instead of the customary 3-to-2 and those where dealers hit “soft” 17s, meaning they must draw another card on hands containing an ace valued at 11, giving the house a chance to improve a relatively weak hand. Both strategies increase the house edge.

“They know they’re offering a worse product. Their own math will tell them that. But lower minimums make it look like the customer is getting a better value,” Rogers said.

Curtis is more accepting of cheap games with unfavorable rules, even the Sahara’s $1 blackjack, which pays only even money on minimum-bet blackjacks.

“It’s only a dollar,” Curtis said. “Players like the idea that they can retreat back to that point if they want. And it gets people in the door.”

Discussion: 37 comments so far…

By BorisR

6/29/09 at 2:38 a.m.

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Lower minimums do make sense, although not for the "professional" and serious gambler. There are players around that like to play b-j but can't afford going through 500 or 1000 in 1 single session. So then they would not play unless they find a fairly low buy-in game. This is obvious.
The casino can't make any profit by offering a 3 dollar b-j game with loose rules as it has to pay for the dealer, infra structure, cards, taxes, and such.
It is of course true that a player stands no chance on a 6:5 b-j game , even if the limits start at 3 dollars or so. Actually, it's a game for entertainment and that's it. Nobody can become rich on a game just mentioned, but it keeps a player in the game and makes the house win money from him.
There's another sort of games that haven't be mentioned: I am referring on the 25 dollar games recently found at Caesars Palace and many other casinos. That's the games with the hot female entertainer dealers and the loud music. These games can become quite dangerous and expensive for some, thus, very entertainment for others. A 25 dollar game with 6-5 on b-j is a tough game to beat. But the entertainment you get while playing may be cheaper than going and getting drunk at Cheetahs......I think the overall tendency is that players will refraim from playing in the pit and instead will go and play more videopoker, which, in fact, is a much better game when you have found a good machine with fullpay tables or high progressives.

From Switzerland
By gettocard

6/29/09 at 2:43 a.m.

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oooooh...what an interesting article !! Typical monday morning one. The guys at the Sun are still sleepy from the weekend I guess..

From Italy
By BorisR

6/29/09 at 2:46 a.m.

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Lower minimum black jack with 6-5 payouts and other restricted rules reminds me of these many low limit poker games available in town with a 10 per cent rake plus rake for the bad beat jackpot plus the mandatory dealer tip. Such games can't be beat no matter how hard you try as most players have at least a certain level of skill and this is quite close to each other. So, when the house cuts 10 per cent of all wagers during every single betting round up to a cap of 4 or sometimes even 5 dollars (!!!! recently seen at PH and Monte Carlo), then all the games with pots of 50 dollars and less become technically unplayable. There are only 2 parties that make money and some other that might perhaps win something by hitting the bad beat jackpot.
Dealers like the low limit games and take happily this 1 dollar tip they most of the times get even if the pot contains not even 20 dollars at times. I have seen the craziest stuff, such as a 1 dollar tip off a 5 dollar pot, etc. Fine with me to watch, but I would not do such things. The bigger the poker game, the better for the player as the rake is usually 4 dollars per hand. So, in the very big games the rake becomes more and more insignificant compared to the skill level and decisions being made during a hand.
Small limit poker games and low buy-in tournaments with 25 per cent "fee" plus extra fee for the dealers are just about the same like these 3 dollar b-j games with 6-5 on black jack. The losers are also the dealers as they might not get enough tips to make it worthwhile working anymore. If the players can't win it's tough for them to tip the dealer with their own money. That's how I see things.

From Switzerland
By judgesmales

6/29/09 at 6:11 a.m.

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As far as I'm concerned, there is no blackjack in Las Vegas. The casinos have ruined the game, making it unplayable, out of silly misplaced paranoia over card-counters.

Al Rogers has it correct. The casinos are so worried about the few proficient card-counters that they've made the rules oppressive for even recreational players. In the end, all the casinos have done is cost themselves a lot of profit, because most counters are too erratic to make it work in their favor.

Any players with discipline quit blackjack long ago. The rules they've put in place have turned it into a house game and no disciplined gambler is going to play a house game on any sort of continuous money-making basis.

The casinos don't want smart blackjack players. They want dopes who think 6-5 for a blackjack is good enough. ("After all, you don't get that many blackjacks, so it really doesn't affect you.") Anyone who plays on a 6-5 table, or even a regular blackjack table with the typical lousy rules in Las Vegas, is a sap. And the casinos love it.

It's not only the 6-5 that's a killer. Even the two-deck games around town are awful, because the dealers are under strict orders not to deal too deeply. If you can get 60 percent of the two decks dealt before they shuffle up, you feel like the casinos are doing you a favor.

And don't even get me started on the automatic shufflers and continuous shufflers.

Congratulations, casinos. Blackjack used to be a game people thought they could beat, or at least get some play for their money. But that wasn't good enough for you. Now you've got all the rules in the house's favor, and you wonder why blackjack action is half of what it was 10 years ago.
By dave202

6/29/09 at 6:50 a.m.

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judgesmales is correct. The casinos have ruined the game because of irrational fears that one or two card counters will win some money when the fact is that all the wanna-be card counters would replace that money tenfold if they casinos liberalized the rules a little. But all the casinos want is carnival games with bright lights, "bonus" jackpots and a house edge that is so steep there is never any chance that they'll get beat, but there is also no chance that the educated player will consider staying at their casino resort.
By doubledown_deadender

6/29/09 at 7:05 a.m.

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What about the "Perpetual Shoe" ? The black machine that constantly deals the cards as the burnt cards get loaded back in...

This removes the "trend" factor and is terrible for the player...yet so many do not even pay attention.
By short_fat_hairy

6/29/09 at 7:29 a.m.

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How about discussing odds allowed behind the pass line in craps?
By gold1020

6/29/09 at 7:48 a.m.

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judgesmales is 100% correct. Anyone who plays 6/5 blackjack is a total idiot. And for every really good card counter-there are probably 150 so called counters who think they can count-but in reality can't. If the owners would simply leave the rules of blackjack alone and let the dealers deal out of a shoe and adjust the minimum bets-they would make more profits. Todays casino owners are such nickel and dimers and have such a condescending attitude of the intelligence of their customers-that they're sitting with empty Casinos-and they deserve it.
By lightfoot

6/29/09 at 8 a.m.

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Once again the lack of competition on the strip is destroying the city. Why play blackjack at 6:5 in Vegas when you can play at an Indian casino someplace else for 3:2? Can you imagine if there were no monopoly on the strip how long a 6:5 game would last at a single casino? The casino makes a few extra bucks, right? Oh, wait, what about when the visitors quit coming and eating at the restaurants, going to the shows and take the entertainment dollars elsewhere? The five extra dollars they made on "Joe" are now offset by lower rent prices for the less-full restaurants. Same for room rates and for the rent in the shops and stores in their casinos as customers who start to feel "taken" stop coming to the city. Save a penny and lose a pound. Do casion monopolies think that they can become "To big to fail" and expect a government bailout? Hmm, what are the odds of that?
By casinokid

6/29/09 at 8:17 a.m.

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I for one can not see how a casino can say they must have a higher min. to justify paying the dealer, When you can walk around and find $25. and $100. min. tables that no one is playing how can they pay that dealer?
OH! I just watched a blackjack game at harrahs at the cherokee Indian reservation, people if this comes to las vegas you will see the end to blackjack, It was called digital blackjack no cards are dealt computer only.
The casino's don't allow you to employ a computer while at the table for a good reason so why? would you allow the casino to employ one against you.
I am also certain they will tell you that they are not going to cheat we wont risk losing our lic. Just trust us with your money.
I believe the goal is to end blackjack and replace it with slot machines, but make it look like the customers no longer likes the game, which would be true if it were constructivly arranged.
By neiman1

6/29/09 at 8:57 a.m.

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Lowering the players odds as the bet drops is akin to the payday loan spots that prey on the poor. It is flat out taking advantage and should not be allowed. Madoff on the strip.
By goingbust

6/29/09 at 11:33 a.m.

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Players understand this edge. The casinos are just shooting themselves in the foot again. They need to bring back value, not runarounds.
By formervegas76

6/29/09 at 12:14 p.m.

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to me, put a few tables in with regular old rules, $5 minimum, $15 max. alot of tourists want to play but getting crushed at $10 a hand just make them go play slots, but of course isn't that their plan.
By frankie2

6/29/09 at 12:15 p.m.

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What a bunch nonsense in the comments here. If casinos wants to pay people 6:5 or even money on $1 or $5 blackjack, I'm fine with that. How the hell else are they going to make money? For higher stakes players, especially $25 and up, the world is your oyster in Vegas. No competition? I can name 20 different pits in Vegas with a house edge game better or as good as every other blackjack table in the country except for about 10. That's right, there are about 10 tables -- a few in San Diego at Barona and a few in the South that offer better games than you'll find in Vegas. MGM properties offer double deck, S17, 3:2, DAS games everywhere -- that is a .19% house advantage. You can't beat that many places. 6D & 8D shoes are S17, Surrender, RSA, you name it. House advantage is .26%. Try finding that in Atlantic City! Ha. Atlantic City has zero competition, they all just conspire to set the same crap rules through the Gaming Commission.

Good games may be dead for low rollers, but for medium and high rollers Vegas has fantastic games, promos, etc.

When the high limit games at mom-and-pop Indian Casinos are better than Vegas, it will be the end of Las Vegas blackjack. But that day is still very far away, if it ever comes.
By goingbust

6/29/09 at 1:01 p.m.

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frankie2,

I played 3:2 $5 limit blackjack at an Indian casino recently. I am assuming they were making money there. I reject that the casinos can't make money on this. But you are right, they can do what they want. It's either going to be a smart business move or not. Time will tell.
By kenodave

6/29/09 at 2:06 p.m.

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To say that the casinos can't make any money for any reason is an excuse because casinos will make money, regardless. They are not losing money on the games, they are paying too much in salary and benefits for those at the top. Loveman, Fertittas and the like are making far too much for their worth to the company. Examine their wages versus the financial crisis they have brought upon their companies. I could have done the same and gladly accept a mere $1,000,000 per year in salary.
By random_las_vegas

6/29/09 at 2:10 p.m.

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There are still good games to be had here, even at low limits. One just needs to know what to look for and then go out searching.

The reason rules suck for the most part on the strip is the "average tourist" knows very little about gambling, Of course they'd like to win but they tend to think they just have to "get a lucky break". To a great extent you do, but if one chooses a bad game (or a good game with poor rules or a good game played badly) you greatly decrease your chances of profiting from a lucky break.

To Joe Blow from Iowa whose only knowledge of Blackjack is playing 21 as a childhood game all Blackjack tables pretty much seem the same. The only way to stop the bad rules from existing is to get people to stop playing them. This won't happen if people don't know what they are looking at to begin with. There is still a house edge on the good games so the casinos still make money. Dealers aren't paid very much by the casino directly and make their money off tips (so of course they like dealing to freely tipping tourists).

The best thing to do is leave the uninformed to play the crappy games, and make sure the educated always play good games. If more and more people consistently keep playing the good games we will see them stick around.

There is still even 3:2 single deck BJ in this town with a .26 house edge if you look for it.

We can't convince random tourists they are playing a crappy game, but we can nicely talk to our family and friends when they visit and nudge them in the right direction.
By LongIsland

6/29/09 at 2:33 p.m.

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Have to agree with judgesmales. I was always a very disciplined player and haven't played in years. It happened little by little until it was not worth it. I still look at the rules and the tables and can't believe how they ruined this game.
I guess some people can't help it though. I have a friend that plays, complains, and plays some more. You can't fight the tide, but he tries while I'm playing the horses.
By travislv86

6/29/09 at 2:49 p.m.

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I love reading this, the average gambler from oklahoma that comes here wouldn't have a clue what any of you are saying right now. 6/5, 3/2... are you guys serious? Lowering the limits means more drunk people will play and lose their money. The disciplined and skilled players didn't build this city, the people who iritate us for hitting on 16 with the dealer showing a five did. Get over yourselves.
By doubledown_deadender

6/29/09 at 3:40 p.m.

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Uh Oh!...seems the nightshift- zombie- dealers are waking up (in their underwater ARM/HELOC mortgaged homes and condos) and getting a little cranky at some of the comments. Get over yourselves! The house tweaks the odds to be greedy and I simply do not play 6/5 or anything delt by auto/stack or autoshuffle.

Excess capacity will make the house kiss ass all over again.
By davidwayneosedach

6/29/09 at 3:51 p.m.

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All of the big hotels have penny slots. It stands to reason they should (also have) some low limit tables.
By acesbet

6/29/09 at 4:13 p.m.

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I hope the players in the smaller games tip accordingly. I would start with quarters. That would offset the "Edge"
By acesbet

6/29/09 at 4:26 p.m.

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Digital BJ-Poker-Craps-Roulette is a death knell for Casino gambling. Vegas would loose out tremendously. I defy any casino to go strictly digital just to see the outcome.
By muddapucker

6/29/09 at 5:02 p.m.

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I could care less whether or not a casino offers 6:5 vs. 3:2 Blackjack. I will never play 6:5 but if some fool does that's their business. Hope they don't expect to get a beer comped at that table.

I believe in the marketplace. When the games start to favor the house to the point that the player feels like they are getting a raw deal they shouldn't play.

For example, the last time I was in Caesar's (about 2 years ago) I tried doubling down on a soft 18 against a dealers break card (5 or 6) and was told I could only double on 9, 10 or 11. I wasn't even in the bimbo dealers pits. I was outside of Nero's.

The dealer broke. I won my $50 bet, but didn't get $100 because of the double rule. By the way, the rule was never stated on the table, but the pit boss said that was the rule.

Last hand I ever played at Caesar's.

That is the only weapon the player has... patronage. Be loyal to the houses that play a fair game.
By muddapucker

6/29/09 at 5:34 p.m.

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Oh yeah...

I am sure, somewhere in Caesar's they were playing a game that didn't have that stupid double rule, but I am not running around Caesar's trying to figure out which tables have which rules. The place is too darn big.

My rule now is that I now stay away from Caesar's/Harrah's properties cause of their 6:5 play as well as other rules that favor the house.

I have never been in the Wynn or Encore and only in the Venetian once. That's because I don't belong in there. My average bet is probably $35-50. My point is find the casino that fits your style. I can't afford to bet $100 bucks a hand so I stay out.

But there are plenty of places to play in Las Vegas with "old rules" and $10-25 minimums. Not many on the Strip, though. Got all that overhead, I guess, but that's not my problem. Too much traffic and congestion around there anyway, not to mention the increasing numbers of scumbags.
By BorisR

6/30/09 at 2:40 a.m.

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To add my little experience on black jack to the kind reader: My only time I went to play b-j on the Strip last May was when I had these match play coupons from Imperial Palace. Bet 10, but if you win, the house pays you 20. Sounds like a super coupon to me, and I had not less than 4 coupons in total to play ....
Anyway, when I entered Imperial Palace it was quite busy on that evening, despite the fact that all but ALL of the b-j games were 6/5 !!!! Even though I only had in mind to play the coupons and then walk again (win or lose, never mind), I was still looking for the best possible game available. Imperial Palace has even something that they call "High Limit", but what I found there was a bunch of empty tables with no dealer and a few slot machines with no players in front. So I walked back to the main pit but could only see these 6/5 b-j games and some other stuff that doesn't fit my expectations. So then I had no choice but to go and play the coupons on the 6/5 tables. I got lucky, I won both of my matchplays and collected 40 dollars (20 each for the 10 dollar bet). And my buddy played the other 2 coupons I gave him so it wasn't too obvious. I think he lost one and won one, giving him a net 10 dollars profit. We left the place a winner because of the coupons but knew that we would never play there under normal conditions (that is, without match play coupons). Still, the place was quite busy and even the Bimbo Pit has quite some action and great music and entertainment. For the tourists who like to be entertained, Vegas is a great city, but don't expect to get the serious and loaded gamblers for such crappy tables. It turns out that Vegas, especially the Strip, turned out to a place where gambling is no longer a good idea unless you're a high limit player. Playing for big money at the Wynn and being comped for everything you want , this might be gambler's heaven. I don't know about Monte Carlo's B-J. Years ago they had pretty good rules , even for the low limit players (shoe game, but surrender, etc). Probably they have "adjusted" their house rules, as well.

From Switzerland
By formervegas76

6/30/09 at 3:43 a.m.

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what's next for these corporate whiz kids, dealer busts on 23 but player busts on 22. how about a roulette wheel with 3 zero's. how about you have to make your point twice before a 7 and you can't play the don't. jee, if i was on staff i'd have probably gotten a raise by now. casino gambling has been ruined... better off reading up on handicapping horses, putting your money in race and sports book. at least any kind of sports game takes a couple of hours action.
By lightfoot

6/30/09 at 9:32 a.m.

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I'm a big fan of Vegas fun. Just because a few folks don't know the difference between a 6:5 blackjack and a 3:2 blackjack doesn't mean that everybody is ignorant of those things. Folks are finding alternatives. Not all folks, but some folks. A guy at GM decides that he can save the company $8 each by using cheaper power window drives or $5 each using cheaper "x" parts. Management give the guy an award for saving the company $8 million dollars a year. The customer eventually sees junk and being taken as a customer. In this case it won't matter what management decides. It will matter what customers decide. This by itself isn't a tragedy. But a whole bunch of these little things is what is destroying the Vegas experience. Customers are speaking and we tell them they are wrong. Good move.
By FleaStiff

6/30/09 at 1:38 p.m.

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Casino management tends to view the phrase "educated player" with the same disdain it would have for the phrase "educated whore". Just as a whore's education is irrelevant to the transaction, so too is the player's knowledge of 6:5 versus 3:2. The casino wants to take money from the players. If some players want to bet at the dollar level they will be paid even money for blackjacks; if some players want to bet at the five dollar level they will be paid 6:5 for blackjacks; if some knowing soul in the high-limit room wants to play some real money then and only then will the casino offer him some old-style blackjack with its far more favorable rules. Why? Because despite recent headlines about declining tourism there are still hordes of gamblers who are both willing enough and stupid enough to play under the adverse conditions established by the greedy casinos.
Management scalps the players who have come for "the Las Vegas experience" instead of a good gamble and then management goes on to scalp the stockholders who are also short term oriented and don't know that a truly successful parasite never kills its host. Left behind is an empty corporate-shell of a casino for the bankruptcy lawyers to feast on.
By castle

6/30/09 at 9:36 p.m.

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Last time I visited I found the old $5 min tables had mutated into $10 and $15 min tables. I am by no means an expert in blackjack or roulette or craps but I can figure that I can go broke a lot faster at $15 per hand than I probably will at $5. At the lower limit I might even be able to last long enough to make some money if my luck is bad at the start.

I can drive 10 miles to Winstar in Oklahoma so Vegas needs to offer a good time at a reasonable price to get me and my neighbors to come.
By AKsilvereagle

7/1/09 at 1:33 a.m.

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I was never a card player when it comes to wagering...I never trust cards and blackjack to me is boring as hell...although I would enjoy playing bacarrat if any place offered $1 minimums.

I only wager on craps, plus NFL and NBA sports betting (as in wagering on two legged creatures, not four legged ones) which is actually the bread and butter for me with my perfect money management and disipline ..... and once in a great while I will wager on roulette too as I studied the game years ago ...while looking for a biased wheel/dealer with a very quick hit and run philosophy.

If I ever do wager on anything along the strip corrodor should I somehow appear there, it would only be at Excalibur, Casino Royale(with their 100x odds maximums), or the Sahara as they are really customer friendly like always and let you wager on any typical off the layout bets, however I do love H(.)^(.)TERS too with the gorgeous girls to drool at in their trademark outfits as they have old rules with $3 minimums, but every table is always overcrowded and have to be lucky to find a spot to play.

My usual hangouts to wager on craps are mainly the cheap places in Henderson, East Vegas, Laughlin, and Downtown only at Main Street,Four Queens or El Cortez... and at any Coast Casino....

Old rules, low minimums, friendly atmosphere like it should be.....The strip megaresorts done phased out any player advantages for the $5 off the sidewalk type players, while squeezing most of the $25-up smart players.

These strip establishments have now set the standard for the higher income clientele while going after the no disipline players.
By dipstick

7/1/09 at 5:37 a.m.

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this all sounds like some chapter out of a stephen king novel. the best place to gamble and have a slight chance to win is NOT vegas; if your desire to get some profit in gambling is that important go to a indian casino or get out of state and visit a casino that has some local competion.
By Cincy_Kid

7/1/09 at 7:52 a.m.

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I used to visit Las Vegas quite often, several times a year. But in the last couple of years, I've been coming less and less. The biggest reason is the deterioration of the quality of the games being offered here. 6:5 blackjack is the one that broke the camel's back, but it's not only blackjack. They've reduced the odds on craps and it has become very difficult to find decent video poker games in Las Vegas, especially on the Strip.

I can shop at home. I can get great entertainment locally. I go to Las Vegas to gamble and they don't offer the great gambling that they used to. I can do just as well or better on the riverboats in Indiana or the casinos in Mississippi and I don't have to buy a plane ticket to get there and it isn't 110 degrees when I walk out the door. If Las Vegas wants to keep its place as the number one tourist destination, it ought to get back to basics. Those basics include good games with good odds. Otherwise, why go?
By muddapucker

7/1/09 at 12:08 p.m.

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The Las Vegas Strip paradox is that it has raised the house advantage on its games to the point that only suckers and problem gamblers play.

And it is true there are still "hordes" playing but not enough to pay the bills. They need their bread and butter gamblers too, but the bread and butter gamblers have deserted the strip for more favorable card games.

So if they reduce the house advantage, the bread and butter gamblers may come back but they still can't generate the cash necessary to pay the bills and if they keep the games as they are, they lose the bread and butter gamblers, get a higher return from the suckers and tourists but still not enough to pay the overhead.

The Strip Casinos have screwed themselves with all of their debt and "theme" extravagance. Too much overhead.

This whole emphasis on Vegas "theme" has turned out to be a disaster. Gamblers could care less about half the stuff they have spent millions on. And Vegas family vacations are usually once in a lifetime and they return to Yosemite and Disney World, in part cause Dad lost is butt on the 6:5 games and tight slots.

Someone has to pay for all this debt and overhead. There is a glut of hotel rooms so they are not going to get it there, restaurants are already highly priced and very competitive so that is not the answer. The tables and slots is all they have left... And thus the paradox.

Strip casinos have killed the goose that laid the golden egg.
By 911conspiracytheory

7/2/09 at 9:36 a.m.

Comment removed by staff.
By mcstix

7/6/09 at 10:41 p.m.

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I was in Harrah's on the Strip in May, and they had at least two BJ tables with 3:2, and no "constant shuffling." The "Party Pit" however is 6:5 I believe.
By BorisR

7/7/09 at 2:50 a.m.

Suggest removal

i noticed that at Bellagio they are offering decent blackjack. Under 25 usd limit, they're using the continous shuffle machines, if you play higher than that, the dealer shuffles. I think Bellagio has most games with 3-2 on the b-j, but I don't know how deep they penetrate on the double-deck tables....

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