Barbara Buckley

By Richard N. Velotta

Friday, Feb. 6, 2009 | 10:57 a.m.

Gov. Jim Gibbons’ budget plan for the next biennium and how state government is going to manage in economic hard times have been the top headlines leading into this week’s opening of the Nevada Legislature in Carson City.

Gibbons’ plan has quickly been responded to by the Democratic Party leadership and delivered by Assembly Speaker Barbara Buckley.

Buckley, first elected to the Assembly in 1994, became the first woman to take the role of Assembly speaker after the 2006 election. The role has placed her in the position of speaking out against massive budget cuts to the university system and a 6 percent pay cut for teachers and state employees proposed in the governor’s budget.

Buckley talked with In Business Las Vegas about the major issues facing the Nevada Legislature, the Democratic plan to counter the governor’s budget proposals, the repercussions on Nevada business and her political future.

IBLV: You’ve been very active in sending the message that “we can do better” as a state instead of cutting programs as Gov. Jim Gibbons has proposed. But critics say you haven’t presented a plan. Do you have a plan and, if so, when will the public get to see it?

Buckley: Sen. (Steven) Horsford and I have been meeting with other legislative leaders and our legislative staff on putting together a framework to make these difficult decisions. What we’ve discussed is proposing that the budget committees — Ways and Means and Senate Finance — hear all the major budgets in the next six weeks: higher ed, K-12, health and human services, public safety. That’s where 93 percent of the state’s money goes. That we hear those major budgets over the next six weeks and begin to make some decisions. Examine those budgets and decide what we can cut. What can we do without? What can we reform? And, a way to provide either better services or save money. And what, from the governor’s proposal, can we not afford to do as a state. And then, by the week of March 23, have a vote on those items. Get some sense of where the entire committee thinks we need to go. And those would include votes on some of the major controversial planks: Decimation of our university system, cuts to UNR and UNLV of about 50 percent, the 6 percent salary cut for teachers and state employees, taking away the county moneys and cutting the children off health insurance, all those major items, and get a sense from the committee of can we do without them or not or would they set our state back?

Then, simultaneously, we’re going to have our revenue and tax committee start with an examination of tax fairness, uncollected taxes, tax breaks, property tax distribution, consolidation, you name it, kind of looking at the way we run things. And then, by the end of March, we’ll be able to give them a sense of what our needs are and they’ll be able to look at each of the weeks they’ve devoted to a topic and see what the gap is and then prepare a plan for that gap.

They’ll also be considering stimulus money. Now some people have some false hope about the stimulus money. It’s a one-shot. It may help fill in, bridge funding for the gap. That’s our plan. We are not going to throw something out without consultation, without open hearings. That’s why I think the governor is getting pummeled. He didn’t consult with anybody. So we’re going to do the opposite. We’re going to put some thought into this plan and see if it makes sense for us and for our state.

What did you learn from the town hall meetings you coordinated across the state?

I think the most important thing I found out is that people are anxious to talk right now because times are so tough. They want to be asked their opinion. And they have great ideas. I had a meeting with my discussion leaders. They informed me of what they learned and that might be a good piece for you because most of them are business leaders: Steve Hill, Don Snyder, Dick Morgan. I think it would be fascinating to interview them about what they learned in their meetings. One idea that came out of Reno, especially, was on the depreciation on homes. There’s such an inequity, they claim, because the older homes, some of which are the most valuable, pay the least amount of taxes and why wouldn’t that be level? So, great ideas from the big to the small.

With the state budget in such dire straits, we’re hearing all kinds of tax and revenue-generating proposals that once were considered outlandish: taxing brothels, legalizing and regulating prostitution, lowering the legal gambling age, negotiating terms to take nuclear waste at Yucca Mountain, legalizing and establishing toll roads and establishing a state lottery are among them. Which of these, if any, have any chance of passing?

Some of them have no chance of passing.

Like …

Prostitution, lowering the gambling age, Yucca Mountain … that won’t be happening.

Establishing toll roads and a lottery, those two — certainly toll roads is being pushed by Gov. Gibbons. I find that quite ironic because if you don’t think it’s a tax to pay a toll on your road, I don’t know what is. But don’t let me get carried away by inconsistency here. The lottery, of course, passed the Assembly the last legislative session, so certainly it may be considered again. It certainly came up at a lot of my town hall meetings. Whatever the merits of a lottery, it is not a solution to our budget problems. It would require a constitutional change. It couldn’t even be considered for five years.

Could you elaborate on whether the state needs new taxes or whether it’s just a matter of modifying the existing tax structure?

We need a methodical, deliberative approach. The economy is in way too much trouble to do anything rashly, and that includes throwing out new tax ideas. We need a deliberative process of our spending, our revenue, ways that we can improve our existing revenue structure, such as the uncollected taxes. Why do so many businesses kind of get away with not paying taxes? We see a disconnect between the time folks incorporate and some of them make it to the secretary of state’s office and incorporate and they never make it to the Department of Taxation. That’s not fair to existing businesses that are struggling right now. So we need to be smarter with what we have as well.

It sounds like you haven’t completely ruled out proposing new or higher taxes. How do you justify new taxes in such an awful economy?

You know, that hasn’t been proposed yet because I think that in a dismal economy it’s the last thing that you suggest. The first thing is a thorough review of the budget and your priorities. It’s looking at our existing structure. It’s looking for efficiencies. And then, in the end, if you’re forced between a 50 percent cut to UNLV and UNR and taking our K-12 system from 47th to 50th, at some point, you’re hurting businesses more by taking those actions than at looking at other options. But I think it is premature for anyone to say we need to raise this amount by this because you have to consider the whole picture, including the economy.

Many observers are expecting this session to be a showdown between the governor’s no-new-taxes stance and his opponents’ feeling that taxes are necessary to fund the state’s many needs. Do you share that assessment?

I don’t. I think that it is very important for the legislators to work together — Republicans, Democrats, Assembly, Senate — to come up with an alternative to what’s been presented. If that’s going to happen, it has to be done in a bipartisan manner and that’s what I expect to happen.

So compromising is the way to go?

I am encouraged by the comments I have heard from my legislative colleagues throughout the state. There seems to be a sense that we need to roll up our sleeves and work together because the state needs us to.

Do you envision the Legislature having the votes to overturn a gubernatorial veto if it came to that?

Well, I think that if the legislators are convinced that their way is better, then the legislators will stand together. But again, it’s our hope that perhaps the governor will agree to the changes that are made to his budget. It was interesting, in my meeting with my discussion leaders, I had a very conservative Republican business leader say, “Has anybody in this room heard one person that supports the governor’s budget?” And they hadn’t been able to find that person yet. So I think he knows there has to be substantial modifications. You can’t close down the system of higher education, that’s just not realistic. So perhaps, in the end, he’ll support the budget.

The governor has proposed some commission and departmental mergers to save money, with the one with the highest profile being the ideas to merge the commissions on tourism and economic development. Are there other departments that, if merged, could produce some budget savings?

I’m open to consider all of the mergers suggested by the governor, and more. My initial thought is that they (tourism and economic development) go well together. I think they’re two completely separate missions and require different sets of expertise and opinions. But I’ll certainly listen to his presentation and examine his rationale. Another merger proposal involves the mortgage lending division and the division of financial institutions. That was suggested by the governor. Since that would eliminate the position of the mortgage lending division, which was one of the governor’s appointees, I have been very unimpressed with his performance and felt that the governor should not appoint the legal counsel for one of the largest failed subprime mortgage lenders in the state. Talk about the wrong message, that’s who’s going to regulate mortgage lending abuses, the attorney for one of the predatory lenders. Didn’t make a lot of sense to me.

Which of the prefiled bills or proposals that have been aired before the session are most likely to win approval?

The prefiled bills haven’t been aired yet, so I don’t have a sense of them. It’s hard to tell right now. We’ve just received the summary descriptions and the summary can differ a lot from the actual language of the bills. It’s a little too early on that.

Are there any black clouds on the horizon for the business community?

You know, not that I’ve heard of. I think that there’s a recognition that things are really tough for Nevada businesses and we don’t want to do anything to make it worse on them. Especially with the discussions about revenue and the budget, we want to make those decisions with the business community. We don’t want to do anything that’s going to either make it harder for them in the short term or the long term. We need their input. We all live here, we all work here.

Spending cuts in education seem to have garnered the most public response from the business community. What’s your take on the impact?

Gov. Gibbons’ proposed cuts are devastating and I’ve been encouraged by all the outreach I’ve received from the business community. The recent North Las Vegas Chamber of Commerce round-table meeting was a good example of that. And they said, “Don’t assume because we’re business owners we’re anti-tax and support the education cuts because they’re our kids, they’re our grandkids and they’re our employees.” We need a balance. I think that’s what I’ve heard the most from all our town hall meetings. We want reform. We want spending controls. But we know that if additional revenue is needed to avoid draconian cuts, that the business community supports that.

Many business leaders talk about the need for a well-educated workforce and a diversified economy, yet these same leaders oppose tax increases or fees that are needed to pay for them. How can that conflict be overcome?

I think we need to overcome it by having a deliberative process. What I found from conducting my Nevada 2020 overhaul is that when people see the facts and figures, they’re shocked, even those who are pretty well-informed. They’re shocked to see that we’re 47th in per-pupil funding. They’re shocked to see we’re No. 1 for elder suicide rates. So I think if we collectively share the information and discuss solutions that we will have a majority of support from the business community and from all Nevadans.

Hotel room taxes are a tempting target to pay for some of the many proposals under consideration. Yet the tourism industry says it needs the money for marketing to stay ahead of ever-increasing competition. In addition, critics say a 3 percentage point increase in room taxes could greatly affect the Las Vegas convention industry. Are room taxes fair game as a “new” revenue source?

Room taxes are fair game as a revenue source and most of the tourism leaders have indicated that because of other rates in other cities it would not put us at a competitive disadvantage. I think that the concern I’ve heard that is even more legitimate is the concern of are we relying again on the tourism industry. We have seen from our recent downturn that that can be a dangerous proposition and I think they’re right, and if all we did was look at the tourism industry to solve all of our problems, that that would be the wrong approach.

Give some of your assessments of upcoming issues. What can we see on the education front?

I would expect many hearings and, in the end, support for not implementing the governor’s proposals.

Would there still be cuts to education?

I would expect yes. But of a manageable level. We’ll ask everybody to do more with less. But you can’t cut 50 percent. Is the number 8? I don’t know what that number is. Again, that has to be developed with consultation with the community. But I would suspect, yes, there will be some cuts.

Transportation and infrastructure needs and toll roads or (high-occupancy vehicle) lanes?

We have a proposal approved by the Washoe County voters with regard to construction. I would expect that would be enacted. Toll roads, I think, will have a rocky road. I think in the end the governor’s proposing public-private partnerships and isn’t being very transparent that what he’s talking about are toll roads. I’d say there’s definite opposition to having toll roads on any of our existing roads. Might there be some wiggle room for new lanes where people still have options? Maybe. I think it’s going to be a tough sell. Anybody who comes from a state where there was toll roads, they don’t like them too much. And, as a Pennsylvania native, I hate toll roads.

You mentioned that President Barack Obama’s economic stimulus proposal would be a one-shot help, but how do you think Nevada’s share would be compared with other states?

Well, we’re hoping that there's going to be some provision that would allow Nevada to get a bigger share of it, whether it’s looking at our foreclosure rate or our unemployment rate. No matter what factor you look at, it would make us receive a greater share. So we’re hopeful that they’re going to use some sort of multiplier that would enable us to get more money since we’re one of the states hardest hit by this recession.

How about state employees’ retirement programs?

My sense is that there’s going to be some reforms. Some of the reforms that are suggested are too extreme. You can’t take retired teachers who relied on the program, taught for 45 years, who are now on health insurance and give them a letter saying, “You’re going to have to pay 50 percent of the premium” — $400 more a month starting this month and another $400 on top of that next year. Some of those reforms just won’t work. Can there be reforms? There can be. I think times are different and we need to look strategically at everything. There’s going to have to be some shared pain, some shared sacrifice. But it has to be reasonable.

Energy policy?

There are many items on our legislative agenda in the Assembly that our members are proposing and I know the Senate has some as well. Everything from urging Congress to deed (Bureau of Land Management) land directly to the state for some renewable energy pilot projects to changing the renewable energy portfolio standard to increase it. There will be a “green” jobs agenda. We’re going to see a lot in the renewable energy field this session.

Health care?

We’re going to see some hearings on the hepatitis C crisis and ways to prevent that tragedy from ever happening again and we’re going to see many efforts to keep the public health system from being dismantled through some of the recommended budget cuts.

Do you expect the Legislature will be able to complete its work within its mandated time frame?

Well, I always say yes, because that’s always my goal. However, it depends on the cooperation of others.

If we end up with another patchwork compromise this year — some combination of a higher modified business tax, increased sales and/or gaming taxes, boosted fees and big spending cuts — without systemic tax and spending changes, would you consider the session to be a failure?

Since I’m a lawyer, I’ll say, “Objection, assumes facts not in evidence.” What do you think is systemic change? I believe that systemic change looks at spending and creating priorities. You know, in good times we spend a little bit of money on a lot of things and get good at nothing and then in bad times, we destroy everything we just built. That’s what needs to change. We need to have priorities and a sustained way to improve. We need a budget stabilization fund so we don’t have a boom-and-bust cycle that prevents us from moving forward as a state. And then, we need to be sure our revenue structure matches our spending priorities. If we achieve that, then I think we will have succeeded.

You’re considered a likely candidate for governor in 2010. Is that what’s next for you politically?

You know, I have no idea. Right now, I’m focusing on the important challenges facing the state, and I’m working very hard on initiatives that I think are going to help us in this very tough time. That’s where all my focus is.

Your focus is on that, but you’re at least considering a run.

Yeah, certainly I am, but that’s not where I’m focusing my attention right now.

Would you still run if Clark County Commissioner Rory Reid decides to run?

Again, right now I’m focusing on what I think is important and that’s serving the state in my role right now. My decision will not be based on who else is running. It will be based on whether it’s the right decision for me.

So I have to get back to you after the session?

That’s right, you do.