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StumbleCensus confirms it: Our growth is done
Worn adage modified: If you aren’t building it, they won’t come
Part of the La Madre Mountains look down over the sprawling housing growth of Summerlin in this file photo from 2000.
Thursday, Dec. 24, 2009 | 2 a.m.
Sun Archives
- Census: Nevada growth rate down significantly (12-23-2009)
- New method to count population shows Clark County may still be growing (11-14-2009)
- Census Bureau releases data on U.S., Clark County (10-27-2009)
- North Las Vegas among nation’s fastest-growing cities (7-10-2009)
- Demographic changes in Clark County (5-26-2009)
- Nevada falls to No. 8 in population growth (12-22-2008)
- Vacant homes, fewer people. This is Vegas? (11-15-2008)
- Measuring population in moving boxes (8-4-2008)
- Local downturn a hiccup or augur of a bleak future? (7-20-2008)
For two decades Las Vegas boosters had a quick retort to all the nattering naysayers who pointed out the city’s less-than-stellar schools, hospitals and social services: If we’re so bad, why do people keep coming here?
It was never a completely convincing reply, but it contained a morsel of truthiness: Nevada was the country’s fastest growing state through most of the past two decades, more than doubling in size because tens of thousands of people picked up and came here, every year, year after year.
Now, they have stopped coming.
From 2007 to 2008, Nevada recorded its slowest rate of population growth — 1.8 percent — since 1967. From July 2008 to July this year, our growth was barely half that, according to a U.S. Census Bureau estimate released Wednesday.
As of July 1, there were 2.64 million Nevadans, 27,000 more than the year before, an increase of 1 percent, 17th in the nation.
The increase was almost entirely because of the birth rate outpacing the death rate.
Most significantly, Nevada experienced out-migration for the first time in memory — nearly 4,000 more people left Nevada for other states than came here.
Economists and policymakers have been eagerly awaiting the census estimate to determine whether new population would help ease a glut in residential and commercial real estate, and whether Nevadans are leaving the state to find work elsewhere, as now appears likely.
The new numbers contrast strikingly with the rest of this decade when an average of 45,000 people moved here every year from other states.
Analysts both here and nationally cited the weak economy of Nevada and other Sun Belt states, including Florida and Arizona, as the primary cause of the sudden halt in America’s 60-year move to the South and West.
John Restrepo, principal of an economic consulting firm and vice chairman of the Economic Forum, the official fiscal forecasting body for state government, said in an e-mail: “Certainly, the troubles plaguing the state’s job market, particularly in growth-related industries like construction, lodging and hospitality, trade and professional services were the primary contributors.”
He was blunter in a telephone interview: “Why would someone move here? There’s no jobs.”
The data suggest a new era for Nevada’s complicated relationship with its own growth and maturity.
Nevada’s self-image has been bound in the notion of being a vital, growing, booming state, historian Michael Green said. Nevada had become a place where the former denizens of the Rust Belt escaped.
Green said the refrain here has resembled, in slightly altered form, the mantra of Gordon Gekko, the character in the movie “Wall Street”: “Growth is good.”
Bo Bernhard, a UNLV sociologist, said Nevadans should not delude themselves with fanciful notions about why people came here in the first place: “The story of growth here has been the story of people chasing jobs. You don’t move because of a mythology” of a city.
The collapse of growth brings certain consequences.
It has had devastating effects on Nevada’s economy and the fiscal health of state and local governments.
Growth had become a self-perpetuating economic engine, as construction workers who moved here to work on Strip resorts bought new houses built by other construction workers, and so on.
This virtuous cycle has stopped and gone in reverse.
State government, meanwhile, had come to rely heavily on rapid growth and development. The tax structure assumed the boom would continue, delivering more and more money from tourists, gaming companies and construction activity.
Now, state government faces a $2.5 billion budget deficit by early 2011.
Some observers hope the reckoning will provide some hard-won wisdom.
“We built tax policy around the boom. That’s not very smart,” said former Republican state Sen. Warren Hardy, now a lobbyist. “I’m indicting myself because I was part of it — it was an easy thing to do.”
Restrepo said it is time for Nevadans to discover how to create a more sustainable growth pattern with a more diverse economy.
“One of the benefits of the God-awful mess Nevada is in is that our most thoughtful residents now realize that we have to put away our cheerleader outfits and pom-poms, and look at our future realistically. In other words, what do we want to be when we grow up?”
The Census Bureau will conduct its official count of every American in 2010, as mandated by the U.S. Constitution. That count will in turn be used to determine how many congressional seats are awarded to each state.
Nevada had been on a clear trajectory to win another congressional seat, bringing the state’s total to four. David Damore, a UNLV political scientist, said the recent slow growth could put the seat in jeopardy, although Andrew A. Beveridge, a Queens College demographer who has analyzed the data, thinks Nevada is still on track to pick up a seat.
The New York Times contributed to this report.
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vegas will bust as fast as it boomed. we're seeing it in slow motion each day.
hotel towers closed, hotels going into foreclosure, increasing crime, bad water quality, and a high school graduation rate lower than mississippi.
the only thing this town has is tourism. even if people don't work AT a hotel, i bet they aren't more than 3 or 4 steps in the economic chain away from it.
instead of coming up with some real jobs, our mayor is focusing on what?
that's right...a sports stadium.
brilliant.
Invest in Uhall.
I loved Vegas back in the 80s and 90s when traffic was ok and the little casinos offered much more than the big casinos nowadays. I remember my first years when I stayed at the Super8Motel and walked across the big block through the Bally's to Ceasars and The Mirage. Food specials were unbelievable cheap there was poker at low rake and great videopoker easy to find.
The big greedy pigs swallowed it all up and what we see now is a big mess on the Strip. If Henderson was smart enough to make clear that low profit casinos can be more fun than greedy corporations, Henderson could become a new tourist destination. I would definetely work on that one and skip the strip....which I have been doing anyway for years already. And I come from 7000 miles away just to gamble and have fun. The Strip is no longer a point of interest. It's a big chaos and for photograph tourists.
From Switzerland
lol at the nutbag liberal there once again spouting out nonsense, but fails to provide any kind of link or proof to support his statements.
I'll just take it back to 1993, and say that if this story appeared then, Vegas would be in fine shape today. The problem is that you can never stop the freight train of greed and overdevelopment, then you add in the corporate criminals who destroyed this town, and you have what we got now..ZERO !
The economic recession is only temporary. There is a lot of pent-up demand just waiting to come back to Las Vegas.
Has nobody in government ever heard of the philosophy of planning for a bust during the boom?
god bless you STEVEM i was trying to tell people on these blog about our "fine" mayor he hasn't done s*** with this economy any can be a good mayor when thing are rosy a true real good mayor can right this wrong. we overdevelop this city. way to much. to much commercial building. way to much housing.
Let's face it. There are 2 separate issues here.
One is the fantasy world created by hucksters from New York and Massachusetts. They have overbuilt and overcharged everything here, slowly making our local economy become totally dependent on their Wall Street greed.
The other issue is our world. Just trying to make it day by day. S. Wynn can spend 30 million for a painting. We worry about child care and lousy schools. G. Loveman can make 17 million a year, and fly back to Mass. on a private jet weekly. We have minimum wage jobs and have to beg for tips. S. Adelson wants to build all over the world, but not here anymore. We are disposable inconveniences now.
But it all comes around:
S. Wynn is losing his sight.
G. Loveman is one cheeseburger away from a cardiac arrest.
S. Adelson is already on a Rascal scooter, and looks like he's ready for a gurney.
As they say, "what goes around, comes around". Thanks for the memories, guys. Your time is coming-soon.
People will keep coming here so they don't have to pay their fair share of taxes. The greed of mining and gaming is disgusting. An uneducated work force has been their plan all along and taking the profits out of state. The ghost town is coming and pinky is banking on health care. Pinky has sold out Nevada for his families financial security. No more Reids.
It's hard to believe that the so-called economic"experts", media and politicians thought this kind of insane growth would go on forever. Did it ever enter their minds that at some point this insanity had to come to an end and balance itself out? I am just surprised it lasted as long as it did. And I for one am ready for a break.
Good things from bad experiences. People learn from pain/error and generally do not commit such twice. Maybe LV and Nevada will be stronger and better for the copious errors scored by our citizens, our industries, and foremost, our governors.
There is a saying "sheep will be shorn"...essentially they want to give up all they have, for nothing! Citizens chasing a fantasy easy buck, corporations simply being corporations, and officials being pompous dreamers and bad stewards simultaneously are norms until a harsh painful lesson is learned. It's now winter and as sheep we lost our wool coat(s)...as thinking beings, we hopefully grow stronger and brighter.
Consequence is for the survivors...us...we must check our ambitions against reality; control our corporate entities' natural evolution; and assuredly remember and aim to eliminate our governmental failures (men and their flawed mandates). The cycle will then become virtuous....until some new variant and confluence arrives down the road.
Good can come from bad.
Of course some people are leaving, and good luck to them, they'll need it.
The grass is always greener somewhere else.
People came to Las Vegas following a dream and for a while, it worked for them, but now Las Vegas has caught a cold and off they go, looking for the next promise of success.
Of course they won't find it.
When you are going through Hell - keep going.
Las vegas will be back on it's feet soon enough, economies are recovering and people will be spending the money they have been hanging on to.
There is only one Las Vegas, and all the exotic faraway places where the developers are trying to recreate it will find that out when the tourists flock back here and leave their third world casinos to rot.
You may see difficulties, and they are there, but there are also opportunities and bargains.
In a capitlist system things and ebb and flow.
Some people just don't have the taying power to play a hand all the way through, and there are always times when the best winning hands don't look that way.
Successful people look for ways to succeed, failures look for reasons to fail.
A success is not nearly as afraid of failure as a failure is afraid of success.
If there is excess housing that puts investors who bought homes in a bind. If they cannot manage to rent their investment to a working person, then they will not hesitate to rent under Section 9. It may turn out that a higher percentage of rentals are under Section 9 than other metropolitan locations. Although renters under Section 9 are not necessarily bad, I would think a neighborhood will bne much better off if the homes were occupied by homeowners. LV will have problems if a higher that average percentage of their reidents are on the dole. It might be better to let the homes to go fallow.
Man i think it is sweet all the yuppies that drive horribly are on the way out of here, to be transients somewhere else. being a third generation native it bummed me out to think i would never be able to afford a house in the city i was raised in, but thanks to those guys i can have any one and now at a decent price, maybe we could get small enough that we can get back to the days where you could sleep with your windows open and leave the keys in the car haha probably not. and why does every article commentary turn in to a political finger pointing party everyone is so busy pointing their fingers sitting on their @ss that stuff falls apart further good job Mr. Right or Mr. left or captain liberal
Unfortunately, we will not learn from this experience - AGAIN! Just like Gov't during the last oil crisis - we started developing wind power, solar and for what - 3 years until the price of oil came down. We refocused back on oil and dropped the other "best practices"/ Now look where we are with energy again..As soon as the economy picks up again, and it will, and people come back to town, and they will, we'll forget about finding other business's to support the town and we'll stay with tourism - until the next crunch.
I was watching one of those home shows on TV a few years back where a young couple ( from the beautiful people squad ) was touring a small starter home near LA with an asking price just short of a million dollars.
They were talking about how wonderful a home it was and reasonably priced to boot.
I knew right then the economy was gonna tank and soon.
losers quit when the going gets tough. what a bunch of losers..go back to where you came from. Im sure its much better.
The next Anasazi ruin.
Thanks Obama ...
tannsummers - No wonder people are leaving Vegas. With morons like you living I can see why. Obama has nothing to do with it. Vegas became a dump on its own. And while you are waiting for your moonshine read a book on Economics 101
Funny how somebody always seems to mention how there's no good video poker anymore no matter what the topic is.
I disagree.
I moved out here last year from Los Angeles. This city rocks. There are tons of high paying jobs that travel is required more than 50% of the time, which makes Vegas ideal because of Southwest (for example). The overall cost of living here is DIRT CHEAP. I bought a house in a great neighbourhood for the same as a deposit in the crappy LA County area. No traffic congestions, gangbanging crime rates, etc...
I travel frequently all over the country. You Vegas locals are simply spoiled and/or are in construction, in which case, your fubar, sorry. You got great weather, no hurricans/tornados/floods/earthquakes/overpopulation/polution compared to the majority of crappy US cities.
So to anyone moving or looking to move here, WELCOME. It's a great place to live and bring up family, just make sure you move to either Summerlin/Anthem/Seven hills. lol :)
Will the last people left in the Las Vegas Valley please shut out the lights before you go..this will be forever.
In a few hundred years from now when someone in the future will dig up this site called the strip and they gonna say what the F****?????
... also, it seems to me that the majority of complainers are either unemployed, poor, or low income folks are the ones always complaining.
It's the same crying I see on Craigslist as well.
Stop complaining!
I agree with everything seven hills just said. It is the same 10 people spewing negativity over and over again. There is still no place on earth even close to Vegas (and if you say Indian casino you're a moron). It will be fine. Things are already getting better. And for most people, nothing ever changed.
The fact that the growth stopped is a good thing, it is time to manage the resources that we have.
Interestingly the builder of my home in Summerlin is now residing (we think) in Costa Rica. He absconded with escrow deposit money (how?) and, no doubt, some spare cash from nearly exhausted construction loan advances. His license was revoked by the State. Meanwhile, those remaining at Howard Hughes Corp barely remember him since leaving an albatross to be sorted/finished by....someone else.
This "reach for the sky" character was certainly amongst his brethren in the good old days of LV's "fastest growing...". The problem of a "gold rush" mentality, insane credit terms, TV shows presenting easily discovered lies as truth (Flip This House), a planning and zoning board which must have been "zoned", local and state governors who saw endless golden days for Nevada, our principal industry being gambling with its baggage on the front and backside, and, yes, the press who cheered until the tent fell.
Pray a few lessons have been learned...and some old standards unlearned.
things are getting better already?
hahahahaha!
give me one FACTUAL link to something that shows things are getting better in vegas.
lol!
stevem you are a troll sir. Every news article on here you have something negative to say.
Move somewhere else, I'm sure you'll do the same there.
Maybe the State Government will come to our assistance.
Maybe the Federal Government will borrow more money from China to assist us.
Maybe things will get better?
Glen Beck and Limpbaugh said Obama was going to have "killing fields" like in Cambodia, how do we know people aren't disappearing into secret internment camps?
After all we have a major radio station in town that contends that "Mexican radical groups started California forest fires and WMD was found in Iraq."
I agree with some of the comments here... Positive, success minded people will find a way to succeed and prosper in Las Vegas....and you can't beat the weather!
once again mred is posting more nonsense.
show us a FACTUAL link or source where glen beck or limbaugh said that.
and once again, sevenhills...lol...you CAN'T give any factual info, so you call me a "troll".
thanks for proving my point.
Steve,
The point sevenhills is trying to make is you are always negative no matter what-- Calling you a troll is too nice. I would say have a Merry Christmas, but I imagine you are incapable of being merry. It seems that you actually want things to get worse here so the lives of people are more like yours, sad and lonely. So have a merry tomorrow. I hope there is news of a murder you can mock, or lay offs that you can say you saw coming. And I agree with 9ball, positive people make positive things happen, people like you are mired in your own negativity.
I wish the old people who cut me off and proceed to drive 10 mph under the speed limit would leave. That would make me happy.
Sorry for the random comment. It happened three times last week. Kind of annoyed with it. Maybe I'll buy a huge gas guzzling SUV and ram them off the road AND make the greenies angry. Killing two birds with one stone.
i just want someone that says "things are getting better" to provide me with some kind of evidence that it is.
and for the 2nd time on this posting alone, they can't do it, so they say i am negative and a "troll".
again, thanks for proving my point.
Okay,
1. Unemployment has stopped going up (you said 25 percent several times)
2. Houses are selling
3. Home prices have basically stabilized
4. The last few times I have been on the strip it has been crazy busy
5. A person earning a modest salary can afford a home, unlike three years ago
6. Myself and other people I know got a raise this year and will get one next year
7. And the news just reported there was a farming accident involving a guy named stevem and he has lost the use of his hands and will no longer be able to type
These all point to things getting better, especially #7.
And finally, if I say something and no one challenges it, that proves nothing.
things are getting better huh?
see, unlike you, here's a LINK to back up my statement that they really aren't.
http://www.wfmj.com/Global/story.asp?S=1...
Vegas is OK, like sevenhills said. Once you learn to ignore the stupid right wing ravers, you realize that:
The schools are atrocious, the teachers are underpaid.
We're overrun with illegals.
The cops and fireloafers are way overpaid.
There are few jobs here, and any company would be crazy to relocate here due to an undereducated, racist population of Rednecks.
But I'm retired, my property taxes are low and I don't have to work for minimum wage, begging for tips. Don't care about the sales tax, I buy online. Take money out of an IRA once a year-Hey, no income tax!
So basically, Nevada is a great place if you're retired, and saved a lot of money. The weather is great, too.
Other than that, it totally sucks. I wouldn't raise a duck here. Let alone a child....
Steve, thanks for the link about how things are in cleveland............ what an idiot
WOW!!!! Its amazing to me how everyone feels Las Vegas has lost its luster!!! The economy has slowed here; yes, has it done a dive yes. But look at the numbers people..... The resorts have lost about plus or minus 15% of the normal tourest that usually comes to vegas. But you all are not looking at the bigger picture. Every industry in the Nation some in the world is down. Some of the largest corporations in the world have went bankrupt. And we lost 15% of our industry, Thats what I would call amazing!!!!! Yes our growth isn't there, at this time, but don't call it out!!! Once the economy stabilizes in a year or two you will see Las Vegas build again, it can only build thats our resource people come here to see whats new. We are the adult DisneyLand, and just like Disneyland has to introduce a new ride or two or a new theme we too have to build, rebuild, and remodel. This is a great opportunity for all of us to go thru. We have things given to us, We can go buy a car with no money down and pay 4-12% interest and not think about it. We could go to any store no matter what size it was and get a merchant card and max it out in a hour.
Stevem has checked in, Dover is here, Boris is on board, so is mred...........Has anyone seen Sinatra?
LOL at bdovers comments. Right on bud, cept ya gotta ignore the wingers on both sides.
Have to agree with "Planetearthcalling" regarding both sides of the left/right wingers debate. Went to a Democratic party assembly last week, to make phone calls and such, and found the attendees were mostly female gas bags who had already driven their old man into the grave complaining about whatever. At least the right wingers have "real men" who simply beat the old lady into submission, and blame her for living in a trailer park. What a great place we live in...
mr,
Does your computer have a space bar?
Sevenhills, you mention that the people that are complaining are either unemployed or are poor. Are you retarded, thats the whole city of Las Vegas, dumbass. I don't know what ghetto you lived in L.A, or what crap suburb of Miami or wherever you lived, the bottom line is this. Only people from California think that this place is great because, your just don't know any better. Let me ask you this. Vegas has some of the worst education, worst schools, a pathetic college, and crime that actually outranks larger cities like L.A, New York, Chicago, Houston. Where are the perks? You must not have any college education cause my experience, this town shuns upon that. Unless you want a house in the ghetto, boring weather, this city is a congregation of all the countries losers rolled up into one little tiny city. Move here at your own risk, and good luck getting a job here, 13% unemployment, ha!
When I worked in LV in the 1990's, I remember being in a meeting with representatives from a large home builder on a project we were working on in NLV. There was discussion about a catchy marketing slogan to promote the project. You know, the usual "Building your dreams" or "Come Home to (name of development)" and such. One of the builders loudly joked to the other "Let's be honest, how about "Building tomorrow's slums today"". We all laughed at the time and of course they ended up taking a slogan used by a developer in another state and using it as their own. Their houses were on the lower end, I imagine the joke slogan would have been appropriate.
I'm not sure if it was discussed here by any of the commentors, but did any one stop to think that this article is solely based on an "estimate" from the census bureau?
I checked the methodology section of the census website and how they determine the numbers is not clear to me and seems very random and subjective. It also appears that these census bureau estimates are often challenged by the local goverments.
As this article said, the actual number will not be known until the official count is done in 2010. I don't get why the media/LV Sun blows this out of proportion stating "its official-Census confirms" in their headlines. At this point, I don't see how they have confirmed anything. Nothing is official or confirmed until 2010.
I imagine this is the medias constant way of trying to spread doom & gloom and try to cause friction and conflict in an already fragile society. Until either the media or society stops buying into this garbage reporting, we will never work together on solving issues, think more positively and move forward.
.. by the way.. Merry Christmas everyone and happy 2010!
I worked there in the seventies at the Stardust and Now when I sit in my office and look at my 25 cent Stardust slot mach that was given to me by Frank R. ,I can almost cry and believe me I was one of the guys that loved Las Vegas the way it was So for everybody that reads this letter and can remember those days Thanks for the good times, and thanks u Frank for this gift from the Stardust that brings so many good memories to mind,(and alot of ruff memories but good ones)
As a construction worker I am going to miss the work. For many a year pulling in 100,000. to 120,000. per year with OT was great. For a man that works with his hands the money was great.
But I have been through this before, maybe not this bad but everything goes in cycles. Many of the Strip construction workers were from other places and were only here for the money anyway. It will be nice to have many of them clear out and go back to their home states.
There is only one Las Vegas and I love it here and I will never go. Everything that goes up must come down but things will get better. Maybe not back to where they were but Las Vegas and Nevada will find a way back. Hell it is going to force many to get off their ass and become creative.
I kind of like that the brakes were put on before they destroyed the place. Many people live here but that does not mean that you are a Las Vegan. The Las Vegans will stay and the others will clear out and to me that is not such a bad thing.
Merry Christmas everyone! Even you environprotector! :)
S711
The only thing I got given to me was a mad money key chain and three sets (of red-green-blue color) of used casino dice from the Lady Luck....Not as kewl as Lefty giving away a 25 cent Stardust slot machine, although I am very happy with the items I still have.
It sucks to be poor and in debt, period...especially at a world resort destination such as Las Vegas.
You Rightwing cry babies are always gripeing. Go to Rush Bimbo for consoleing.
Nothing is done after recession.
I think Vegas is a great place. I have work , i just work for a little less. My wife works, in fact everyone I know has a job. My brother who hardly speaks English has a good job at the venetian. The houses are getting cheap, which is good for us Mexicans we can afford to live here! The yard sales are great as people are leaving and selling everything. My whole family now has coming soon free health care at any hospital or doctor, where before we just went to quick-care and university hospital for free when we get a cold. I am sure there will be ways around paying for medical insurance, i know pay for auto insurance and drive everywhere. Feliz Navedad
Vegas is a great place to visit and is only seeing the effects of corperate greed.The Casino giants here in Las Vegas must create a volumn of visitors that will supply the need of jobs.
The construction boom is over for awhile,probably 5 to 7 years.
That has impacted the construction job market severely and that is why there are more people moving away from Las Vegas.
What is happening now is we must rely on the corperate giants for income and they are not doing anything drastic to improve travel to las Vegas and are cutting jobs left and right to survive.Where they goofed up is they were to greedy 3 years ago to see that when fuel costs sky rocketed they did not realize that the rise in fuel started eating up the disposable cash that would go towards travel and recreation.
In the meantime the Big Corperate casinos steadily kept raising their prices instead of creating value travel packages to keep the travelers comming to Las Vegas.If you really look at the Strip Resorts & Casinos they haven't
marketed properly.They continue to compete with each other in the High End market which their is not enough to go around.
Poor forcasting and forsight into the rise in everyday living and cost is what hammered the gamming and hotel industry here in Las Vegas.
Now they have laid off workers to the point that people are leaving to find work.
I am a firm believer that volumn is better than margin but you can not tell that to an accountant working for these guys.
If the casinos here in Vegas were smart they would see that people are looking for geat values and are not going to spend their money until they find it.
I grew up around marketing and if they want some good ideas I will gladley help
Merry Christmas everyone! And I hope you find reasons to be thankful for living in Vegas!
If the growth is done, then it's up to US to find ways to sustain what we have and improve the city. We have a voice ever time someone is up for election. Use it!!
merry xmas, you poor bastards. peegee; the only idea mayor goldman has to improve vegas is to build another city hall, like that makes a lot of sense. with leadership like that its easy to see the direction vegas is going; reality is a hard thing to face folks, but vegas is toast and wont improve for 3 to 4 years.
"My brother who hardly speaks English has a good job at the venetian."
Every comment made here on this subject can be summed up with this lone quote from juansanchez
unbelievable!
peace out
And off topic i admit
BUT
Does anybody that visits las vegas anymore have blond hair?
just saying,,sheesh
went to aria last night with parents who are visiting from chicago,and my dad looked at me,and said "is there a communication gap in this town?"
9/10 people on the strip last night had cameras hanging around their neck,,hint wink
and that is no exaggeration,and NO im not prejudice,just stating the obvious
merry xmas to all!
When a Man starts treating strangers better than his own family, thats the end of the family! When Corporate America starts treating foreiners better than their fellow citizens, thats the end of the country.
Las Vegas will be back. We have gone through ups and downs before. We eventually prospered after 911 and we will eventually prosper after this recession is over. There is a pent up demand for people to come to Las Vegas. When people feel that they are secure in having a job and they start to see home prices stabilize, a lot of folks will want to come to Vegas for a vacation. People still want to have fun and no matter what you say, Las Vegas is still an entertainment bargain. Like Warren Buffet said, the time to buy is when there is blood running in the street. If you wait to see the robin, spring will be over. In other words, people who are willing to invest in Las Vegas now, will reap a lot of rewards in a few years.
Dipstick,
If you don't like the politics. FIX THEM. Quit pointing fingers at everyone else. If you don't think the mayor's doing a good job, vote someone in. If no one votes with you (i.e., doesn't vote a majority with you) then run yourself.
Quit making excuses and address the issues. I see absolutely no point to whining or complaining. Identify the problems then fix them!
And have a merry christmas :-D
If Nevada really wants to destroy itself economically, drive residents and workers from the State, they need only STUPDIDY invoke a State Income Tax. There has been speculation that Nevada Government employees, worried about keeping their jobs, want to see a personal NV State Income Tax. The view of many that make money, is that if Nevada has a State Income Tax, they are leaving the state; why pay a State Income Tax to Nevada when there are so many nicer places to live that have culture, diversity of things to do, better schools, etc?
The Nevada economy will be dragged down for years because of Obama huge deficit spending, increased income taxes, debt expansion and additional billions owed in interests for un-funded programs. Nevada to save its infra structure will need to attract non tourists industries that employ Nevadans year-round and reduce its dependence on gambling for tax revenues. Nevada needs to consider what affect Obama's planned income tax increases will have on tourist and consumer discretionary income spent in Nevada. For example, Obama Forced Health Insurance Costs for many Americans could equal their Paid Income Tax. Obama can't pay for his planned public programs including government health care without greatly raising income taxes on real estate, stock share gains, inheritance and profits made on business transactions. Most of that money taken from Citizens by government in higher and new taxes will support federal government, not States.
"...(I'm a real estate agent), no jobs, decrease in gaming revenue and tourism, Las Vegas is on course to become a ghost town at some point......I moved out of town to the DC area for work;...at least the govt. won't be going out of business anytime soon. Moving out of the area may be a last resort for some...."
Just another shining example of exactly how REAL ESTATE BROKERS, MORTGAGE BROKERS, BANKING INSTITUTIONS, CONSTRUCTION COMPANIES, AND DEVELOPERS took BIG COMMI$$ION AND FEE$ MONEY AND THEN
PIMPED
YOU.
So now YOU are left holding the Real Estate (trash) bag.
THERE IS AND WAS NEVER, NEARLY ABSOLUTELY NO GOVERNMENT OVERSITE OF THESE PEOPLE.
NONE.
THEY PAID "DONATIONS" TO THEIR PALS IN GOVERNMENT (many of whom are still elected here) THEN TOOK THE MONEY....AND RAN.
Here's an official link for you to see who donated to whom (that will tell the sorry tale, it always does...)
http://www.accessclarkcounty.com/depts/e...
"Thanks Obama."? uhm, no. This collapse occurred under the watch of George. W. Crackhead.
All we heard during his destruction of America was "Iraq this and Iraq that"... more of our tax dollars were spent repairing Iraqi roads than roads right here in America.
And now you don't hear a word about Iraq.
Was the $1,000,000,000,000.00 George W. Crackhead spent of our money on Iraq worth it?
You tell me.
haha.
i'm an idiot, huh?
ohhh...you're such a tough guy hiding behind a computer. that's sooooo macho.
haha...i just posted a link that shows things are not getting better, regardless of geography. i could have easily posted just as many links to stories here in vegas.
but once again, i provided a factual link. none of you that criticize me have...or know how to "cut and paste" i guess.
Might I suggest to posters here on the LV Sun site: Please use spell check and learn to use punctuation and grammar...your comments will be recognized as well intentioned by those of us reading them. PS: All you need is a dictionary and or your computer's spell check. Be proud of what you have to say by making it literate. I say this with humility and all the grace I can muster...it is Christmas.
From Travislv86:
Okay,
3. Home prices have basically stabilized
----------------
That comment made me chuckle. Home price have not stabilized; they have just crashed through the $200,000 average price level and continue to fall.
First of all, I'd like to welcome Bouvier back to our message board. I was afraid he'd been found frozen dead on his balcony at Lake Las Vegas, fighting off the hoards of people wanting to buy his condo.
Second, I'd like to comment on the posts that say that our public union loafers want an income tax imposed on our populace to support their ridiculous wages and benefits. I hope it happens. As I used to say "I always wanted to work for the government, but I can't sleep standing up". So being retired and self sufficient, I would be gone tomorrow. Take the house, so what-it's worthless. Take Bouvier's condo, too. Between the 2 of us, we might have 100G max equity. So what? Off to Texas-no income tax, filled with redneck dopes, just like being in Vegas.
Gosh, did you know our schools stink? Turning out tip dependent dumbbells?
Do you really think any decent company would relocate here? Really, it's not the taxes or the weather, it's the people. Or as most of them write, the "peeple". Who think that all liberals are "loosers". This town is going to hell, and is going to become a giant ghetto. And then, who's going to pay for Pat Mulroy's 3 Bil water sucker delusion?
Ah, life is good...
If Clark County really wants to restore growth it needs to make a few changes -- may the following be suggested?
1. Offer property tax exemptions to senior citizen residences 55 and over.
2. Focus upon building the best, state-of-the-art healthcare infrastructures and services in the world, which will create long-term professional jobs.
3. Expand electrical energy production, solar, wind and nuclear, more jobs, lower energy costs, while utilizing an already built spent fuel facility.
4. Offer painless death options to the terminally ill, which will aid in maintaining reasonable healthcare costs.
In short, cater to those with money, the aging senior citizen population in America -- a growing segment that will spend their remaining dollars on gambling, entertainment and healthcare services. The area has huge potential in becoming the nation's leading retirement/healthcare services spot -- a lot of sunshine, plenty of vacant builds, homes and few mosquitoes -- not to mention a plathora of hotel accommodations for visiting family members.
Make America's senior citizen population an offer they can't refuse by providing them with not only what they want but what they need.
"Vegas a great place to die".
"We cannot solve today's problems with the same level of thinking that created them". -- A. Einstein
: {
"When the day they start building a McDonalds within your neighborhood.....you know it's time to move". -- My Grandfather
People are not coming to LAS anymore --that's the bottom line... Casinos are greedy! It used to be fun to play/gamble and it's not any more. It's NOT just economy, (UN)employment numbers, housing, mortgages, development, CityCenter, etc.
Why is it that casinos in Monte Carlo, Monaco, all over Europe, and elsewhere in the World make enough money with just a single "0" roulette; while Vegas casinos have a need for second "00", practically doubling their odds? That's not fun -- and I simply don't play roulette here.
Double Zeros, tightening slots %, 5/6 Black Jack odds [or even!], server based slots, etc. is a factor too why gambling revenues go down in Vegas month after month... 22 months in a row.
[Watch, there will be one month with an increase and it will be a BIG news... and then it will go down again :)
Vegas needs to re-invent itself, not just take money from tourist, they catch on eventually -- numbers show that.
Gambling has to be fun, otherwise people don't come. Tr ue or true? See I told you. Period.
"Those that are leaving are the ones that didn't belong here".
What an assinine thing to say. Those that moved here BELIEVED in what Las vegas had to offer - reasonable priced housing, good jobs, great weather and an exciting place to live. Believed in Las Vegas. They chose Las Vegas since a lot of other cities in the area were boring compared to Vegas and even those who retired out here, still have life left in them and were not ready to sit in a house with those Roladen shutters to keep out crime and the sun like they do in Arizona. The nightlife options were exciting, even to us old farts in our 50's and 60's!!
Unfortunately, all got burned by what has happened all over the country and not just in Vegas or in Nevada. I'm sure those who have left did not want to leave but had to out of necessity. My heart broke the day I left because all the dreams and reasons why we originally came to live in Vegas went up in smoke. I never thought I'd leave Vegas; I assumed I would grow old(er) there and die there. Never would I have thought I would have HAD to move back to the Midwest.
So that comment is moronic at best. MANY of us did belong here but when the fates work against you - what else can one do? Reality sucks.
Harley makes some great points about catering to the elder population here. Old farts, of which I am one, just want to be able to gamble a little, go to a buffet at 4pm, and be in bed by 8pm. They have saved beaucoup bucks, have pensions, and just want to be pain free. I really think that the reason Cali has so many great hospitals is that they cater to old folks, who have Medicare, and don't normally show up at emergency rooms at 2am riddled with bullets. Part of the reason that ML King hospital failed in South LA is that their clientele was younger, mostly uninsured, critically injured or dead. Not a real profit maker there. Loma Linda, no problem.
Sadly, I doubt we'll be seeing any more Anthems or Sun City senior developments here. Something about being hauled off to UMC. That's like being taken to the Gates of Hell. Maybe we can make a start by providing decent health care here. But I doubt it...
BDover/NedNougat(same person) thank you for the shout-out and welcome to the post.
Why do you think I'm wanting to sell my condo? I love my condo, with my famous balcony you mention all the time. The condo is awesome! I'm making a small profit, have a place for me and some of my friends and family to visit for free. However this is a bit off point and a topic saved for another time. PS: One day, I can meet you at the casino to show you my statements to show you I am profitable. :)
I'm still wondering why everyone is getting their feathers ruffled and there are 98 posts on a census topic that is a GUESS!?!?! Nothing is confirmed. Some people just have too much time on their hands and have to complain about something.
However, Nednougat/Bdover (same person that likes to argue with himself) I do agree with you that Nevada hasn't tapped into the active retirement sector much as it could. This age group does have money, stability, pensions and healthcare. Maybe this is what they should turn the undeveloped LLV property into? :)
I have friends in Arizona who lives in a 45 + community. While I'm not old enough to live there yet, I would LOVE to live in a place like theirs one day. Pickleball and Tennis in the morning, lunch at the clubhouse, afternoon Siesta during the afternoon heat and then cocktails and dinner starting at 6pm. However, AZ can be about 5 to 10 degrees warmer in the summer than Las Vegas. (AZ is really hot)
So, again, everyone calm down about the census GUESTIMATE, it's a guess. Wait until the actual number is determine, then complain.
Happy Holidays and hoping for a great 2010!