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By J. Patrick Coolican (contact) 
Wednesday, Feb. 27, 2013 | 2 a.m.
A free road for the north, a toll road for the south. Someone with a sharper wit than I came up with it, but the metaphor neatly encapsulates Southern Nevada’s raw deal compared with the rest of the state. In one instance, however, it’s literally true — a free road from Reno to Carson City, a toll road from Las Vegas to Phoenix. Visitors to the Legislature keep telling me about zipping from Reno to Carson City on the new Interstate 580, six lanes of modern convenience, which Gov. Brian Sandoval called “not just a home run, it’s a grand ...
I asked Krolicki on the Alan Stock Show about a 4 lane road from Vegas to Reno and he shot down the idea. As you say he is more jazzed about a better Road to Phoenix for losers, er I mean tourists.
Diversification of the state's economy would been developing other parts of the state not just RENO and Vegas.
A lottery might pay for a toll free road to the bypass bridge, you know the bridge people use to buy lotto tickets in AZ? of course the casinos, who wink and nod at the prostitution and drugs at their clubs (oh sorry I meant the clubs run by independent operators..) do not want a lotto, nor do they have an interest in diversifying Nevada's economy.
Therefore we can blame "pimps. prostitutes and drug dealers" for the problems of the state and not the connected political law firms, politicians and corporate casino people.
Yep the good old days of the rat pack, they would have nothing to do with tramp hookers or back alley hat pin abortionists connected and protected by the mob. The good old days of Howard Hughes and Binion ...they would have nothing to do with drugs either...right? So roads and the north=south thing are just a symptom of wider corruption ...but hey let's not deal with that.
You actually believe southern Nevada gets a raw deal? When southern Nevada has the vast amount of representation in the legislature? What are you smoking, cool man.? Pass it around.
The problem is that Nevada is expected to pay for it. Nevada doesn't pay for anything. Maybe AZ will pay for it. Maybe the Feds will pay for it. Issue some bonds and sell them to China. It's only 250 million. Sounds scary, but is less than redecorating a large casino. We can't even invest money to help the casinos anymore.
I moved to LV from Chicago. Chicago had more tollways than ANY other city. This was a total rip off and just became another source of political jobs and money in politicans pockets.
Don't let Nevada start down this road. We will all lose in the long run.
And only the greedy, unethical people will benefit.
the road to laughlins sensational.as soon as you get to the california border it turns to crap
Our representation equals our population, as it should, but for decades northern/rural dominance at the Legislature cemented regional advantages in K12, higher ed, road building etc.
Coolican just can't be bothered to portray the old highway accurately -- that is, as a 50 mile-per-hour, four lane road that largely goes through residential areas.
I know that "the south got jobbed!!!!1!!" sells papers for you, but honestly, I would be completely ashamed of myself if I were so loose with the facts when doing my job.
I've been on the new 580 ONCE and vow never again. I consider it a safety hazard. Didn't like the proposal and couldn't believe politicians would waste soooo much of our money to save a couple dozen homeowners the "inconvenience" of revamping the old road thru Washoe Valley. The high bridges on the side of the mountain cliffs are NOT fun. And northern Nevada has recurring earthquakes.... Tolls would not work on 580--many would just take the old road. Not sure I agree about inequities north versus south--the federal money goes to the State for less-populated areas but the federal money goes DIRECTLY TO Clark County and City of Las Vegas because of the population density--so quick calculations on dollars don't reflect reality.
Education and assisting the poor are more important than providing a faster way to get to Phoenix.
Patrick, where are YOUR priorties?
A few things here. First, let MGM and Wynn pay for it. They have the money to keep building and building in China, so let them do it and name the road after them. (Or maybe Sheldon - his ego would allow that.)
Second, having lived in AZ for a tad over 20 years, I'll tell you something - they have gotten used to all sorts of Indian gaming including casinos owned by Caesars or at least run by them. The gaming allure for them is handled locally. The entertainment allure is another thing - but they're pretty broke. I'd like to see a more detailed analysis by the LVCVA on how many visitors come from Phoenix and Tucson and what they spend here.
how about private toll roads for both?
Sell or lease the land to a private company to build a toll road.
This is a great piece. Phoenix wants to be the West Coast Atlanta - a distribution point for goods from both the Pacific, Mexico and Gulf for points North. This would make Las Vegas a secondary distribution point. The Transportation Board is distinctly tilted against Southern Nevada given it's current make up. This needs to be changed.
What the author didn't mention, but should be is that AZ gets no benefit from the small portion of I-15 they need to maintain. If I-11 doesn't get built, they will make it a toll road and that will further hard the Southern Nevada economy because commerce won't be able to flow freely from Salt Lake through to Los Angeles.
Write your representatives NOW to urge them to fund I-11.
"and it costs our economy untold millions of dollars every year because Phoenix residents who might come to Vegas wind up vacationing elsewhere because they don't want to drive on a road that's more appropriate for 1930s Okies."
J. Patrick, please cite your source.
Why not make the strip a toll road and use it for enforcement costs. Oh and here is an idea Gibbons would like, why not have a private resort district police for the strip and downtown paid for by the casinos, they have private security on cruise ships, some railroads have their own police. They couldn't be worse than the status quo.
You can guess from my screen name than I live in Oklahoma. Not too thrilled about the Okies line.
Now, my main point is that in Oklahoma there are many toll roads. They work very well, with better maintenance than other roads and their planning and placement is done more quickly. Also, the mantra of the pro turnpike faction is the most basic of truths: "There Are NO Free Roads." A trunpike is paid for by the people who use it. What is the downside to that?
I agree that Northern Nevada has gotten more than their fair share of the state monies for many years, and it has been damaging to Southern Nevada. In a few more years the effects of term limits, and the dimming of Mr. Raggio's legacy, will begin to equalize the injustice. But equalization of the damage done will probably take at least 30 years.
The funding in Nevada for this Interstate 11 Highway, would (normally) be partially funded by the Federal Government, as All roads of the Interstate Highway System have been.
One EXAMPLE of Interstate Highway Federal Funding is the initial construction of I-95 (more than 30 years ago) in Northern Virginia. And, more recently, the on-going expansion of "The Beltway" - I-495 - that circles Washington DC. While I-95 runs north and south, it also runs "on-top" of I-495 as it goes AROUND Washington, DC. (to continue its north/south path).
All of this was built with a majority of Federal Funds (as mandated under President Eisenhower. So the problem for Nevada does not appear to be a lack of STATE funds for Nevada's small leg of I-11 - but rather a lack of political WILL, and CREATIVE discussion, to obtain FEDERAL Funding assistance for this Interstate Highway.
The primary impetus for building Interstate 11, is because it will be good for local and national interstate commerce: commercial transporation, tourism, freight shipping, etc. - and will reduce the travel time between NV and AZ. I-11 would also INCREASE REVENUE and BUSINESS ACTIVITY for both States.
So, I suggest that the Nevada DOT, the Nevada Governor, and the Nevada legislators put on their "thinking cap" - and make this happen - WITHOUT ANY TOLLS, ANYWHERE, on I-11. Interstate Highways are supposed to be "FREE-WAYS;" NOT toll roads.
When Arizona Governor Brewer spoke to the Arizona State legislature earlier in this year about completing I1-11, the response was exhuberant - and with wide bi-partisian acclaim. She said she wanted to finish I-11 "SOON."
Of course, Governor Brewer never contemplated that teh State of Nevada would create a "SNAIL DARTER" (a small endangered fish) "roadblock" (this time, in the form of funding) - which could be detrimental to the construction of I-11's terminus point, in Nevada.
The "roadblocks" that the State of Nevada is throwing up (as noted in this article) are actually nothing more than "turf" and "funds" protection by Nevada legislators, and the Nevada DOT. If they wanted this road, they would build it!
The Clark County Nevada Chamber of Commerce is always saying: "Build it and they will come." Well, if Nevada's leg of the road is never completed, no one will come.
Here is Nevada's chance to provide so much benefit for the people of Nevada - just like the bridge over the Dam has done. And the people of Arizona will benefit too.
So, lets stop the political chit-chat, Governor, and DOT, and NV State legislature - find the money, and get the road built!
You know, even Harry Reid might be able to show his ability to "work wonders," and coordinate funding for this Nevada leg of I-11. Of course, if the State of Nevada powers-that-be instead, did this THEMSELVES - they might not have to give all the CREDIT to Harry Reid.
Though Mr. Coolican appears to be a very intelligent gentlemen. He unfortunately does not have all the facts about the area. Though it seems frivolous to build a proper highway to Carson City certain facts are very familiar to local residents
- The roadway is only two lanes in each direction.
- That road is the only roadway at certain points between Carson and REno
- In the event of a fatality or a major fire most travelers had to backtrack through SR431 (Mt Rose) or SR 341 (Virginia City). So the traveler must extend their drive by 30 miles through SR 341 (Virginia City) which is filled with 90 degree turns or through SR 431 (Mt.Rose)which is an additional 54 miles.
- We don't have a lot of options due to the mountain passes between Reno and Carson.
I see nothing inherently wrong with asking those who use a specific service to pay for it. Toll roads are a personal choice since there are always alternate "free" routes to use. Toll roads are usually faster routes (no traffic signals, no variable speed limits (speed traps), no dangerous intersections, etc.), kept in better repair and more direct. I always chose the toll road (I-294) to bypass Chicago's surface streets and was more than happy to pay the couple of bucks it cost for that convenience. For those who didn't want to pay a fee? They could use the "free" (US 41) roadway provided.
@lvfacts101 hits it on the head. The only way that I-11 is going to be built is by getting the users to pay for it, which means a toll-road. Give it a 80 or 85 mile per hour speed limit and you can be in Phoenix in 4 hours more safely than the current roads will allow.
It is clear that you have never actually been on the road between Reno and Carson nor do you understand the reasons behind it. Unlike your road between Phoenix and Vegas, this is a daily commute for people who live in one area and work in the other. We don't use the road to attract tourists, we use it to make a living and survive. The existing road that you reference is a small, two lane road that goes through residential areas and has had several fatalities over the years. School buses and bus stops line the road you think we ought to be using instead of our new, fancy and unnecessary freeway.
I find it more than a little ironic that Vegas of all places is crying that we actually got some funding but not at all surprising that you think we don't deserve any.
How bout fixing the "widow maker" between here and Reno? That should've been priority before the Carson to Reno, or Vegas to Phoenix roads.
To address Mr. Coolican's overarching point, Southern Nevada wont get its "fair share" of the Nevada state budget until a southern Democrat is elected governor, and can force the hand of the legislature. Southern Republicans (e.g. Kenny Guinn) couldn't get a fair shake, and anyone from northern or rural Nevada will keep the status quo.
That said, I don't know why people think its OK to toll just I-11 and then leave all the rest of the roads in the state untolled. If we're so adamant about users pay for roads, then all roads need to be user paid when feasible - basically all the highways outside of major metropolitan areas: I-15 north and south of Las Vegas, I-80 outside of Reno, the new I-580, etc. If we want a user-pays system we need it across the board. Otherwise its just the typical "I don't want to pay for anything that doesn't directly benefit me" selfish attitude.
Just a quick glance at a map of the Interstate system shows a need for a major North/South road in Nevada: http://www.mapsofworld.com/usa/usa-road-...
I see no need for a toll road as part of that system here. That goes against the spirit of the Interstate system. There can be little argument that Las Vegas in general would benefit greatly by having easier access from Phoenix.
I discount the argument made above that people in Arizona have their gambling needs well-served by Indian casinos. California also has this, with some of the largest along I15 and I10, and several poker rooms in LA county. Yet they come here in droves because the experience is so much better.
@boftx, I lived in both northern and southern Arizona for 22 years. Did you?
@Siromega: I think toll road systems work best when they operate in kind of a socialist manner. Build some toll roads in very busy areas and let them operate at a profit in order to subsidize low volume roads to remote areas. If done perfectly, this improved access increases volume to and value in these areas. Worked well in Oklahoma, for the most part, although some roads are still money losers.
You socialist dupes. Everyone knows that the Interstate Highway system is going to be used to move UN troops around the country and to access locations for FEMA concentration camps. This proposed highway will simply make it easier for the Mexicans to recreate the Aztec Empire to the doom of all patriotic Americans.
chekiski,
I have not lived in Arizona. I have lived in Los Angeles and Orange Counties at different times for a combined total of 41 years. Texas (10yrs), Virginia (2yrs) and now Nevada (6yrs) round out my 59 years of life.
I doubt that the experience in Arizona with Indian casinos is much different than that in California.
NV pols would be well served by pulling their support for the "train to nowhere" and instead focusing on connecting NV south and north. I-11, interstate between LV & Reno, interstate north into Oregon. Just as we need to diversify our economy and rely less on gaming, so we need to diversify our tourist base and rely less on CA (especially as they seem to be in a slow but steady economic decline, while Mexico & the mountain west-plains states are taking off). We'll actually benefit economically from increased road connectivity, far more than we will from the money pit passenger train.
I think an overwhelming number of Clark County residents would support I-11 (and the likely economic benefits it poses, especially when compared to the "train to nowhere", green energy black holes) and it might serve as a useful litmus test when it comes to the 2014 elections. Add in the state of education here, and what you would do to improve it, and those two issues alone would probably drive the debate and determine results.
I think Mr. Coolican is overstating the importance of this "little" stretch of road. Weather a road gets built or not has no impact on how many people come to Las Vegas and gamble. The "little" stretch in Washoe county did not bring more tourists to Carson City. What it did do is make it safer to travel between Reno and Carson City when the weather is bad. Which is what a lot of people now do because of the economy because they have to go to Reno to work. Also drivers don't have as much worry of hitting a Wild Mustang as they did when they used the old road. Our infrastructure here in Northern Nevada is crumbling, it is in need of repair. You travel the interstates in Las Vegas, and they are up to date and not to mention extremely beautiful! Every time the southerners think that the northerners are getting something that they are not getting, they throw a temper tantrum! Las Vegas gets MORE than their fair share. Heck, even the governor flies there everyday which costs us hundreds of thousands of tax payer dollars every year so he can be, not at the capitol, but at a city that according to Mr. Coolican is getting the short end of the stick with respects to Northern Nevada. Give me a break! Go cry to someone else. Maybe Arizona will listen!
Coolio,
Instead of throwing out anecdotal "facts" about how the south consistently gets screwed, why don't you back it up with some primary data?
Public expenditures is public information. The fact that you consistently (and conveniently) skip the research speaks volumes. Where is the comparable information about the Hoover Dam Bypass and other Las Vegas transportation projects that occurred in the last 5 years?
And if and when you do get off your lazy rear, make sure you compare the state spending on the dregs of society that Las Vegas attracts in droves (and that "rewards" you with that higher population representation).
But I guess I would feel the same way if I was continually stuck in traffic with ganstas in their thumping six-figure rides shuttling their hookers around instead of enjoying white-capped mountains on an efficient freeway.
I-11 should be built with Federal Dollars from Mexico to Seattle/Vancouver completing the final phase of the Northern loop of the Beltway. BTW - it also wouldn't hurt to complete I-70 from Utah to San Jose with a tunnel (like Austria's) through the Sierras, linking Las Vegas and San Francisco who are about 350 Air Miles Apart and right now are a 10 Hour Drive.
The 'infrastructure' to herd people to what is ostensibly the grandest adult playground in all the world is, in a word, PATHETIC to say the very least...
If you'd planned to make a drive to this burg difficult, you'd have roughly what you have now...
Las Vegas via Reno
Las Vegas via Southern Cal
Las Vegas via Phoenix
Las Vegas via Salt Lake/Denver
Horrible, awful trips all.
Not exactly, 'hey! let's get in the car & head to VEGAS for the weekend!' inducing road trips (though thankfully, MANY still find the lure of 'Vegas' worth traversing one of these Godforsaken, Stephen King-inspiring, brain-numbing, death-inducing 'Great American Road Trips')...
THAT SAID...
The notion that a loooong-overdue upgrade for the Las Vegas to Phoenix route will include a TOLL portion is SHEER FOLLY.
(The fact that the 'Western Wrangler' weighed in to voice support for tolls should tell you all you need to know on the subject).
Agree that we need to ask our reps in Washington, D.C. WHY they can't get funding for such VIA FED FUNDS; it's one of the few tax-administered functions for which we ALL BENEFIT, regardless of whether you actually physically DRIVE ON IT.
If Nevada would change its stance on Yucca I bet there would be fed funding in a heartbeat. :)
I-11 should be built, period. Some have mentioned a road to Reno, which has been proposed as a logical extension of I -11 eventually. However, the Phoenix-Las Vegas portion should get top priority, the reason being that there would be more than four million Arizonans at the opposite terminus, many of whom would spend more time (and money) here if we made it easier for them to get here. A road to Reno, while worthwhile in the future, would benefit far fewer people and it would bring no new business into the state.
Don't forget: the northern/rural dominance at the Legislature cemented financial, academic, and research advantages of UNR over UNLV.
People from Arizona can get here very easy now, it's called aircraft.
Reno area is becoming a distribution hub--with access east, west, north, but not-so-much south. How about a real highway from Reno/Carson to/from Vegas? We still need a train on this route too.
so why don't you let military do experiment which benefits the L's Vegas, they have the power to make rocks to roads.
Rocky mountains near are waiting a tunnel of love, tourists would love it.
What is with the whining? The Southern Nevada Democrat dominated Assembly and Senate voted in the Toll Road. Don't blame the Governor.