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Thursday, Dec. 20, 2012 | 2:01 a.m.
Many people have been talking about gun control after last Friday’s tragedy in Newtown, Conn. They have many ideas, but I haven’t heard this one. All people over the age of 12 who are convicted of committing a crime while in possession of a gun go to federal prison for life. No appeals, no parole, no exceptions. I bet 95 percent of Americans, including the NRA will agree with this idea. Now let’s see our do-nothing Congress pass this into law without watering it down.
While using a gun during a crime should add a few years years to the sentence it will not solve the problem. Many states already do this in sentencing guidelines.
A look at the last several mass killings by DERANGED MENTALLY I'LL KILLERS does not reveal that they committed Pervious crimes
We need to get the mentally ill help to prevent them from committing any crime or murder
Well letter writer put me down for the 5 percent solution.
CarmineD
Given that convictions can be subject to human error in judgment, as well as the craftiness of lawyers, I think this is too extreme a suggestion.
If you want to go that far, just ban guns altogether.
Remember that each person housed in prisons is at the expense of taxpayers. Better to address the real issues before that becomes necessary.
Also, it still doesn't address the causes of the defendants actions, which can be a pyramid of personal and societal issues leading to extreme actions or criminality.
Can't we value people more from the beginning of life and throughout their lives, rather that just throw them away when they act out of their despair or due to insufficient mental health services they might have needed much sooner?
I agree with tougher sentences for violent crimes (don't have to be just guns) but there is only so much one can do here.
Each day some 45 people will be murdered in the USA.
There are a ton of laws against murder.
You can create tons of more laws.
Humans have an evil side.
Tons of laws can only deal with that a little.
Getting to people's hearts and soul will do more than a little.
Religion/philsophy is the answer. Religion/philsophy can change people's hearts and soul.
So school choice or school vouchers or getting more regilion/philsophy into schools can do a lot of good for America.
Domestic violence and poaching game included?
I agree that those who use guns for criminal purposes should have an additional sentence tacked on to whatever crime they are convicted of. And I would agree with Arthur's idea of life imprisonment if it only pertained to those who physically injured or killed someone when committing the crime(s). To me, by their coarse and brutal action, they have forfeited their right to freedom, and in the name of safety for the rest of us, belong caged for the rest of their natural life.
"All people over the age of 12 who are convicted of committing a crime while in possession of a gun go to federal prison for life. No appeals, no parole, no exceptions."
Cesare -- a beginning to the right solution, but ignorant of two important facts, the first being most crimes are state matters, not federal. The other is "crime" includes not wearing seat belts and little girls eating fries on subways.
"Given that convictions can be subject to human error in judgment, as well as the craftiness of lawyers, I think this is too extreme a suggestion."
peacelily -- this part of your post is excellent. The next part about a total ban ignores nature, reality and history.
"Domestic violence and poaching game included?"
wharfrat -- or any traffic violation while exercising one's protected liberty to keep and bear arms? Few seem to know all traffic violations in Nevada are misdemeanors!
"I agree that those who use guns for criminal purposes should have an additional sentence tacked on to whatever crime they are convicted of."
lvfacts -- you're leaving out one important element, intent. "Mens rea" -- literally "evil mind" -- used to be a vital element of any crime, legislated out with tragic results.
"Where once the criminal law might have stood as a well-understood and indisputable statement of shared norms in American society, now there is only a bloated compendium that looks very much like the dreaded federal tax code. The end results can be downright ugly: a soccer mom thrown in jail in a small Texas town for failing to wear a seatbelt; a 12-year-old girl arrested and handcuffed for eating french fries in a Metro station in Washington, DC; and defendants serving 25-year to life sentences in California prisons for, among other things, pilfering a slice of pizza." -- "Overextending the Criminal Law" @ http://www.cato.org/pubs/policy_report/v...
A large portion of the NRA, namely the tea party section will have a problem with that law. Putting them all in federal prison will cost tax dollars so they would prefer capital punishment with a semi automatic assault rifle to save money.
The powerful firearms industry is aiding and abetting evil gunmen who use one of the many available handy killing machines to murder and terrorize. Accomplice to murder is a felony, at least it is for everyone but the gun makers.
There are millions of gun crimes committed in the United States. Within a very brief period of time you would have more people sitting in federal prison than collecting Social Security and Medicare benefits.
At about $16,000 a pop per year it would get extremely expensive.
We have the largest prison population in the world now.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/23/world/...
"We have the largest prison population in the world now."
zippert -- and in the same land where We the people regularly pledge "liberty and justice for all."
"Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual." -- Thomas Jefferson, letter to Isaac H Tiffany (1819)
I suspect that as we learn more about Newtown, we'll discover that this tragedy was much more about a failing mental health system than inadequate gun laws.
Emthree.... I worked on medical issues for many years as a trustee. We don't have a mental health system in this country. We spend massively on heart disease, cancer, diabetes and arthritis. There's nothing left for anything else.
A recent report put out by the American Dental Association reflects that 100 million Americans can no longer afford to go to the dentist.
Mental health is rock-bottom on the list. You could threaten the blowup the world and you would be lucky to get a 72 hour hold. They would more than likely release you within 12 hours.
While additional time for possession may be appropriate, a blanket "life without parole" is excessive. And would do nothing to prevent murder-suicide killings, nor deter the deranged who often seem to not act with rationale concern for the consequences.
What's required are effective & efficient meaures to : "harden targets" to deter attacks; increased measures to make it harder for thugs & the deranged to access weapons; and improved procedures for pre-emptively identifying the troubled and intervening before they hurt themselves or others. None of which will be politically easy to agree upon or especially cheap to implement, which is why the challenge is so problematic. Unfortunately, we don't seem to have ANY adult leadership in DC willing to step up to the plate and provide thoughtful proposals.
Bans on things that people want do not work, alchohol, drugs. gambling and prostitution, guns etc.
very astute mred I agree
I'm not sure what you're basing your data on but you might want to double check. The opium epidemics in the 1800s and early 1900s were some of the worst drug epidemics in history. Soft drink manufacturers in the United States used to put highly addictive substances in the drinks to get people addicted to the soft drinks. Restrictions on opioids have reduced this phenomenon. Widespread recreational cocaine use has also been dramatically diminished.
Selective fire weapons were available to the public in the early 1900s. Gangsters blew the hell out of everything killing God knows how many people. Restrictions were placed on automatic weapons. I can't remember the last time someone was killed by machine gun. Assault rifle restrictions were put into place in California after and not blow up a Jewish school. There have been very few assault rifle deaths in California since.
Restrictions have been put into place on cigarettes which has reduced cigarette smoking in the United States.
A combination of education and stricter laws can have a profound effect on the things that plague our society.
The writer illustrates draconian ignorance at it's best.
In reply to "PeaceLily"; spot on post at 4:54 AM. Especially where you wrote; "Also, it still doesn't address the causes of the defendants actions, which can be a pyramid of personal and societal issues leading to extreme actions or criminality. Can't we value people more from the beginning of life and throughout their lives, rather that just throw them away when they act out of their despair or due to insufficient mental health services they might have needed much sooner?"
Well said "PeaceLily"!!!
In addition, I would like to add that some years ago a mental health inmate who somehow got past my secured post and made it deep into an "inmate off limits area". When I did see him I called over the radio, "That an escape was in progress."
I ran towards the location of the inmate hoping to subdue him before he got any further. Upon getting close to him, he turned around and stared at me. I then realized he was a mental health patient. A departmental memo had recently been issued for staff to keep a close type surveillance on him due to the fact that his medications were reduced in potency and that it was possible he would have unexpected responses.
I used no force on him. In fact, I asked him in a gentle tone what he thought he was doing in this off-limits area. He replied that voices in his head were telling him that today was the day for him to go home. I told the mental health inmate I would have to place him back in a lockdown unit until the mental health professionals reassessed him. Strangely enough, when I asked him what he wanted me to tell his parents when they come to visit him and discover that he is not available for visits, he broke down and started crying.
Reactions are unpredictable when it comes to mental health patients, without doubt. As a society, we're lucky when they do not react violently. However when they do, our entire free society suffers.
Is it worth taking this chance? Not to me. This means for both our free society and many individual mental health patients who can well be a productive member of our free society with the right treatment.
By the way, this particular mental health inmate was released from custody before I retired. It was reported that he was doing quite well. This young man was lucky. His parents had the money to continue his mental health treatments. And, it's true, in his case, so is society quite lucky. However, the reality is, these type cases are few and far between.
Any person who feels they need an assault rifle with 300 rounds of high velocity ammunition in 30 round clips to feel safe driving back and forth to work and to the market is too mentally unstable to own or possess any type of weapon.
Anyone who feels that teachers should be carrying guns in the classroom to protect their students should be forever prohibited from owning a weapon. These feature will solve many of the safety issues related to identifying the mentally unstable and prevent them from owning or possessing guns.
Anyone who lives for guns should not be allowed to set the standards of safety for America.
gerry says "Assault rifle restrictions were put into place in California after and not blow up a Jewish school. There have been very few assault rifle deaths in California since."
Wow, what a useless example. How many is "very few" since the ban? How many were there prior to the ban? (Hint: It's also "very few")
And more importantly, what was the effect of California's assault weapon ban on crime? As seen in the data from the California Department of Justice, violent crime and homicides both continued to increase after the 1989 ban.
Violent crime in California didn't start decreasing until 1994, which is significant because there were no gun control laws involved in the changes which caused that downturn.