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By Karoun Demirjian (contact) 
Friday, June 10, 2011 | 2 a.m.
Harry Reid
Rep. Joe Barton
Sun coverage
Sun archives
- Senate OKs measure to give Nevada boost in online poker (5-30-2011)
- Internet poker bill advances in Nevada (5-24-2011)
- WSOP officials don’t see online poker’s demise deterring event’s momentum (5-17-2011)
- Poker websites’ actions were risky, experts say (4-29-2011)
- Caesars CEO Gary Loveman: Poker indictments present opportunity (4-26-2011)
- Internet poker company looks to Nevada for entry into U.S. (3-21-2011)
- Bill would set regulations for Internet poker (3-10-2011)
- NV considers Internet poker bill, but casinos balk (3-10-2011)
- Board OKs Caesars Entertainment ties with foreign Internet gaming company (3-9-2011)
- Online gambling is illegal, but betting sites’ logos often in Nevada casinos (7-13-2010)
- Question evolving from legalization debate: How to tax online casinos?
- Lawmakers push to regulate, tax online gaming (5-19-2010)
- With aggressive push, Internet gambling again in play (2-9-2010)
WASHINGTON — On most issues, Rep. Joe Barton, a Texas Republican, and Nevada’s Democratic Sen. Harry Reid are thorns in each other’s sides.
Reid hates oil subsidies. Barton is such a defender of oil companies that last year, he apologized to BP for Congress’ pointed inquiry into its mismanagement of the Gulf spill.
Reid has spent most of his career trying to kill the proposed Yucca Mountain nuclear waste repository. Barton is one of Congress’ biggest backers of getting it up and running, and predicted that: “I have a feeling we will, before the end of this year, do so.”
But despite their differences, these two are shaping up as a dream team for the online gaming community and its efforts to legalize Internet poker — and Internet poker only — this year.
Why a dream team is needed became apparent when California Republican Rep. John Campbell and Massachusetts Democrat Rep. Barney Frank introduced in March broader legislation to legalize Internet gambling. It seeks to amend the 2006 Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act by expanding consumer protections, introducing a licensing procedure for Internet gambling providers, and stepping up enforcement against illegal operators through the Treasury Department.
Frank steered an identical bill through the House’s Financial Services Committee last year when he was chairman. But under the new House majority, Alabama Republican Rep. Spencer Bachus controls that committee, and he is no friend to Internet gambling. In fact, none of the congressional committee chairmen with jurisdiction over the Campbell/Frank bill are: Bachus, Lamar Smith of the Judiciary Committee, and Dave Camp of Ways and Means.
So, enter Barton, who brings a new bill, a new face, and a new committee to the mix.
Barton is chairman emeritus of the Energy and Commerce Committee, which is where Barton intends to bring up his bill. The legislation is still a work in progress, but he expects to officially introduce an Internet poker-only bill this summer.
Poker has emerged as the most popular, and thus most promising source of potential tax revenue for the federal government and states that would license the operators.
In the past few years, poker has built a following that goes beyond casinos: A community of 15 million plays the game online, and it has become a spectator sport, with tournaments drawing millions of viewers to broadcasts on sports networks.
Barton is a fan of the game.
“I love to play poker,” he told the Sun last week, explaining why he decided to push to legalize Internet poker. “When I was in the minority, I told (other lawmakers), ‘you’re in the majority, do something about it.’ But now I’m in the majority and I’m trying to get it going.”
To do that, Barton is having to make a few strategic moves.
One is getting the bill under the Energy and Commerce Committee’s jurisdiction by giving authority to license new operators to the Commerce Department.
Another is making sure the legislation takes into consideration recent legal developments.
In April, the Justice Department indicted the three biggest Internet poker operators with clients in the United States — PokerStars, Full Tilt Poker and Absolute Poker — and charged them with bank fraud and money laundering. The government is seeking $3 billion in fines for playing the system to process payments from U.S. players, which has been illegal since late 2006, when Congress passed the Internet gaming act.
Several states also have taken up measures to legalize Internet poker. Most efforts have failed, but in April — just days before the gaming outfits were indicted — Washington, D.C., became the first U.S. entity to make it legal.
The crosscurrents of state pressure to change federal law to increase opportunities to gamble online, and growing federal concern that states may not license trustworthy operators, are fueling a debate that Barton is aware of. He wouldn’t detail exactly how he plans to address the tension.
Enforcement of good gambling practices will be key to drawing bipartisan support necessary to carry the bill. Last year’s bill proposed treating illegal online gambling operators similar to how comprehensive immigration proposals usually treat illegal immigrants: If you come out of the shadows, you’ll have to wait for a certain period (under last year’s bill, there was a 15-month blackout), but then you can apply for legal papers and join the system on the up and up.
It’s unlikely that any state’s statutes would allow licensing of a company that is under indictment or found liable for illegal activity, but that system left an opening for companies that have broken the rules to join a poker market that’s going to be tightly regulated by new rules: no underage gambling, no abusive gambling, and efforts to address gambling addiction. Many lawmakers, especially Republicans, aren’t sure those executing such regulation are up to the expectations.
“I’m not opposed” to considering Barton’s proposal, Bachus told the Sun last week. “But if there’s gambling, it has to be regulated.”
A woman who wants to remain anonymous plays poker online.
The poker lobbyists appear convinced that if anyone can bring conservative lawmakers along, it’s Barton.
“We think he can bring a very strong coalition of conservative-minded Republicans to support it,” said John Pappas, executive director of the Poker Players Alliance. “He’s respected, not only with the more socially conservative, but the more fiscally conservative caucus within the House, and brings a really credible voice to this issue ... because he understands why regulation makes sense, not only from the perspective of a lawmaker, but also that of a poker player.”
Barton said he has gotten a “yellow light” from Republican House leaders to proceed.
“This is not a Republican leadership initiative, but they’re aware of it,” Barton told the Sun. “It’s a sensitive issue, but an issue where there’s a majority consensus in the House and Senate to make this change.”
He’s also got the support of his chief competitors, Campbell and Frank.
“I’m co-sponsoring his (bill), I believe he’s going to co-sponsor mine. If his moves first, I’ll support him,” Campbell said. “The resistance is still there, but I think there are some minds that are more open now than they were last year.”
Frank said: “I’ll go for the broadest bill possible. We have an extraordinary restriction on people’s freedom right now, so I would support the broadest bill possible ... but I would take something over nothing.”
The Nevada delegation appears to be in favor of Barton’s efforts.
Rep. Shelley Berkley told the Sun that when Barton produces a bill, she’ll eagerly sign on.
Shelley Berkley
Dean Heller
Sen. Dean Heller said he supported the bill in concept and would like to see something move, but that he thinks a poker bill “needs to start on this side (in the Senate), because that’s where it failed last time.”
Last year, efforts to pass Internet poker legalization ran aground when Republicans, led by Minority Whip Jon Kyl of Arizona, said there was “zero chance” the GOP would accept that sort of a package. But in a policy statement this year, Kyl said he would keep a more open mind about poker-only bills, and “consider them carefully as long as they leave in place the broader proscriptions against online betting.”
In the Senate, all eyes in the poker community are on Reid.
If they team up it would be a remarkably cooperative venture for two statesmen so far apart on the political spectrum.
But Barton and Reid have both been in Congress since the mid-1980s and as such, are seasoned statesmen from a more collegial era. The suggestion that they might, as two like-minded opposites, engage in a little classic congressional cooperation, was enough to give Reid a little grin.
“We lost him elsewhere,” Reid said. “But we’ll work with him — and maybe we’ll win with him — on this.”
Harrahs pays our DC boys good , Geterdone Gary
Harry follows a false prophet. How can you trust a person who is easily mislead?
Thanks Frank for your assessement on Joe (oil company) Barton. A very good one!
Now, tell us how you really feel about Joe Barton.
I think Joe and Hairy make a perfect team. Between the two of them they take money from all the major players.
Reid tells Jeffery Weiner "Don't call me"
Reid tells any corporation involved in gaming; "Call me anytime 24/7 Three-Sixty-Five babaay!"
Barton tells the oil and gas corps - "I'm yer holla back gurl!
And we keep electing them time and time again.
Online gambling:
1. If you get cheated, where do you go for compensation and how is it proven?
2. Who gets the profits and where are they deposited? (On the Isle of Wight?)
3. Does the State get any taxes? (No, the hdqrs are all offshore)
4. Who gets the jobs? (What Jobs?)
5. How does this boost the economy? (What economy?)
Joe Barton is a Methodist, a "Christian", and so how does gambling fit in with his "Biblical Beliefs" and personal responsibility? Barton's belief is: He who cuts the pie gets the biggest church. Religious philosophy is a political plug-in for Congressional men. I've know bar tenders with better morals then Joe Barton, because just a little is better then nothing atall.
All but one comment so far has been on the individuals presenting the bill rather than the actual bill. First the bill being discussed is to fully legalize, license, and regulate online POKER, a zero-sum game of skill. This means you can only win what other willing participants put on the table. Poker is unlike craps, blackjack, bingo, or lotteries where simply place a bet and hope to win big. In poker you control what hands you play and how you choose to play them.
@SunJon
1. If you get cheated, where do you go for compensation and how is it proven?
Under the current state if you were cheated you could bring issues up on various forums, contact the sites directly, or the gaming commissions that control them. If this bill gets passed companies like Caesars, Wynn, MGM, etc would run the new sites. They would be regulated in a similar fashion to how they are now.
2. Who gets the profits and where are they deposited? (On the Isle of Wight?)
Currently poker players are forced to play on overseas companies. Pokerstars Full Tilt, and Absolute Poker the three largest poker sites in the world were recently forced out of the US market. There is a need and demand from American players. This would bring in billions annually to the US.
4. Who gets the jobs? (What Jobs?)
Tens of thousands of poker players were supporting themselves fully through their online poker winnings. Hundreds of thousands of others were supplementing their income through online poker. If the bill gets passed the sites are going to need employees to keep up with customer service, marketing, and day-to-day operations. There are also entire industries through various training sites and coaching, to magazines and forums. There is an ever growing demand for content and people will be hired to deliver this.
5. How does this boost the economy? (What economy?)
It would create several new American jobs, bring in new tax revenue, and put tens of thousands of players back to work. I think you fail to grasp how big poker is. The number one game on Facebook is Zynga POKER. Over ten million Americans play online poker, an additional 50 million play in home games with friends, or bar poker, etc" A decade ago cell phone applications were in their infancy. Now Apps. Are a multi billion dollar industry that was created seemingly overnight. Things change over time due to technology and customer wants.
Joe Barton is a Methodist, a "Christian", and so how does gambling fit in with his "Biblical Beliefs" and personal responsibility?
What legal responsibility does he have to tell other hard working, law obideing, tax paying citizens what the can or can not do with their own time and money, in the privacy of their own home? If you do not wish to gamble or play poker that's fine, but why punish others who choose do it responsibly? Over 2/3rds of Americans placed at least one bet last year. Why are you tring to stop the majority from what we want?
1. If you get cheated, where do you go for compensation and how is it proven?
ANSWER: This bill will regulate online poker in the United States. There will be regulatory bodies in the United States to establish practices and rules in regards to cheating. Proving cheating online is actually easier than proving it at a casino poker table. Statistical analysis of player tendencies will be very easy for the regulatory bodies.
2. Who gets the profits and where are they deposited? (On the Isle of Wight?)
ANSWER: Again, this bill is going to regulate online poker IN THE UNITED STATES. The casinos would be running the sites and thus generating revenue via the rake (% of each pot).
3. Does the State get any taxes? (No, the hdqrs are all offshore)
ANSWER: Yes, the revenues will be generated in the USA by USA companies (ex) Harrah's). The revenues will be taxed by the federal government and states.
4. Who gets the jobs? (What Jobs?)
ANSWER: There will be a ton of jobs created by regulation of online poker in the USA. There are basic support functions (email, etc), accounting, security, tech support, computer wizards creating, maintaining, & improving the software just to name a few.
5. How does this boost the economy? (What economy?)
ANSWER: Revenue from the poker games will be taxed. Jobs will be created as I mentioned in response to question 4.
SunJon,
Your questions actually prove the point as to why we need legislation to regulate/tax the online poker industry in the USA. Online poker will continue to be played by US citizens with or without government intervention. Prohibition of online poker will not work. Congress may as well regulate and tax the industry so as to protect the players and stimulate the economy.
Online Poker does bring in jobs.
TV advertizing.
Merchandising for site logo's.
Satellites to bring more people to B&M tournaments.
Customer service staff.
Security staff.
Programmers.
Also will bring tax dollars to the US instead of offshore.
Great day for freedom!
I live in Joe Barton's congressional district. Barton is a great conservative and I love the fact that he is pissing off Nevada progressives. Your state is going down the toilet and you need this legislation. But being Progressives you just don't get it. Oh well, God Bless Texas.
"Barton is a great conservative and I love the fact that he is pissing off Nevada progressives."
-------------------------------
Another Texas republican who voted for Bush jr twice talkin Tea, tee hee hee.
*spits tobacco juice*
:-)
There is really only one big question regarding online gaming, and it is one that applies to any online activity: it is impossible to prove someone's age online.
The postal service is going to offer a "prove your age" service for deliveries which will help online tobacco and alcohol sites, but that does nothing for gaming and adult sites.
Adult sites currently operate under the rule that only adults can enter into a contract to receive a credit card. Again, that does nothing for gaming which requires one to be 21 years of age, not 18.
Another problem would be an increase of credit card fraud, but that has always been present in the online world and there are ways to deal with it to some extent.
I am not opposed to online gaming, but there are issues that must be addressed.
Thank you Mr. Barton for joining the fight for internet poker in the U.S. Since 4/15/2011 thousands of honest Americans have been devastated with basically being fired from their jobs. Hopefully this bill will get quickly through congress and senate and be signed by Obama, then 50,000 Americans can get back to work. Also regulated internet poker can bring as much as $4 billion/yearly into the U. S. Treasury. The upside vastly outweighs the downside when it comes to regulated internet poker.
Overseas online poker sites are billion dollar companies that hire a wide variety of careers such as computer scientists, software developers, IT professionals, accountants, marketing personal, customer service, financial analysts, HR, etc.
An April 2010 report by H2 Gambling Capital, an English gaming consulting company, determined that over 32,000 jobs would be created as a result of government regulation over the course of five years.
Currently all these jobs are overseas, by regulating this industry we will bring jobs and tax revenue back to America.
Only fools invite government into their vice games.
: {
Regardless of your personal opinions of these politicians, legislation for online poker is much needed. This is a multibillion dollar industry that over 10 million Americans enjoy each year. Currently, nearly all of these jobs and potential tax revenue is traveling overseas to foreign operators.
While many of these foreign operators run a very stand-up legitimate business (TY PokerStars!), there are many that have been involved with cheating scandals and not paying out their player base in a timely manner.
We need this industry regulated and licensed in the U.S.! The potential tax revenue is over $40 billion over the next 10 years. This legislation is a complete no-brainer, no matter which angle you look at it.
"INSANITY" is the best word to describe this quest.
@boftx,
Poker sites Full Tilt and Pokerstars have always had a thorough process in proving someone's age. To prove your age you must send a copy of your license and a bank statement/utility bill to verify your license and prove your residence. If a child of an adult player got a hold of his parent's account there are passwords and also security tokens available to protect the child from accessing that account. Also Barton and Reid are working on an online poker bill only, which doesn't include online gaming such as casino games or sports betting.
Having to see these morons getting together over something as great as the game of poker is refreshing.
Reid supports more gambling, but wants the brothels closed. A vice is a vice. You cannot pick and choose your vices.
At least they're working together instead of fighting each other. I'd say a step in the right direction. People like Simmons will forever be the way they are and hence nothing will get done.
There is nothing to stop little Johnny or Susie from getting their parents' ID information and submitting it to create their own account. It happens a lot.
The best process I have seen so far has been sites (of any type) that require you to send a photo of you holding a photo ID next to your face, and a larger image of the ID itself so it can be verified as genuine if possible.
Let's say that 5 or 6 people are sitting in a room on laptop computers and hooked up to an online poker site, they slo-play until they all [or some] get on the same table where they can utilize their average [or better than average] poker skills to 'clean house'!
Question ... are they cheating? and why? if 6 buddies are playing on the same live table at one of the casinos in LV are they allowed to do so? what's the difference?
The bank employee in Elko [or was it Ely] lost 5 to 8 million primarily playing online poker... did he get cheated? would a major casino in LV care? if they can prove one way or the other why doesn't our trusty DA investigate?
Once online poker is legalized a lot of Americans are going to go bankrupt... question ... can I sue the poker site if, unknown to me, my wife loses all of our life savings or vise versa?
Americans are protected for credit card fraud by mandated loss limits... question ... should any legalization of online games be offered the same protection?
Unlike a lot of casino games poker is profited by the 'rake' so why eould any new site really worry about the numerous opportunities to cheat when their bottom line is secured before anyone else gets paid.
Someone is going to whine that the American casino has a bigger vested interest in seeing that the games are fair and honest... butt BULL S. the existing online casinos have made billions and nobody is really stupid enough to try and sell us that cheating doesn't go on or that they are making anything more than a puny effort to stop that cheating.
"Currently all these jobs are overseas, by regulating this industry we will bring jobs and tax revenue back to America."
Jason.. your comment is another reason we need to outlaw MJ and other like illegal substances as it is apperent that something is clouding your ability to ratonilize.
I suspect a location like India or some other offshore location that doesn't monitor this type of activity is a much more logical location.
If you pit big business against big government big business is going to win EVERY TIME!
"There is nothing to stop little Johnny or Susie from getting their parents' ID information and submitting it to create their own account. It happens a lot.
The best process I have seen so far has been sites (of any type) that require you to send a photo of you holding a photo ID next to your face, and a larger image of the ID itself so it can be verified as genuine if possible." - boftx
There's at least two very good reasons why one should NEVER reveal their identity to a licensed gaming provider -- if you don't know the reasons, you're likely a loser and it doesn't matter.
: {
Collusion is rampant in online poker, and is basically impossible to prevent. About the only thing that can be done is to prevent more than one player at a table from using the same IP address. That stops some of the multiple players in one room scenarios, but not all by any means.
But there is no need for collusion to involve people in one room, any IM or VOIP program (i.e. Skype or Teamspeak) facilitates it.
A skilled player can sometimes detect, or reasonably suspect, when such collusion is taking place and adjust their play, but it can not be prevented.
Collusion does occur online, but it is fairly easy to spot and the offenders quickly get their accounts frozen and balances seized. I have reported suspected collusion on PokerStars and they have done a great job of investigating every single time. One of the times, collusion was verified, the players got banned, and money got returned to people who were colluded against, myself included.
I won't deny that reputable sites will take action against collusion, but not all, and I suspect only a small portion or it, is detected.
I live in the 6th District of Texas and Joe Barton is my Rep. Out all the State and US Reps. that I have tried to contact before Joe Barton is the only that sent me back a personal message himself. Mr. Barton has in the past served his district well and has been a great congressman for Texas. While you might not like some of the things he has done in the past I will say that he has done them because they have serve his constituents. And now I sure that his constituents are upset about "black friday" and he is stepping up to the plate to help us out be finding a way to regulate online poker. Even reaching across the aisle to ask some Democrats for help. I have a great respect for Mr. Barton and proud to be represented by him in congress.
Wow, this seems like a hostile crowd when it comes to online poker. I'd like to chime in in support of a bill to license, regulate and tax online poker. It is currently not illegal to play, but U.S. competitors are forced to play in an environment that isn't U.S.-regulated. And the Dept. of Justice shut down the only really trustworthy sites. I should have the freedom to compete against other people in poker -- from my own home. Liberty and freedom, please. Thank you.
Wow, lets see a Sen from Nevada wants to legalize online gaming. Great idea give people another reason NOT to come to Vegas.
You have o love the transparancy of the Gov motives:
" In April, the Justice Department indicted the three biggest Internet poker operators with clients in the United States -- PokerStars, Full Tilt Poker and Absolute Poker -- and charged them with bank fraud and money laundering. The government is seeking $3 billion in fines for playing the system to process payments from U.S. players, "
Revenue generation pure and simple.
@sunjon: I assume your questions have to do with what happens after legalization. On that assumption (and note that I don't work for an online gambling operation - I'm a player):
1. If you get cheated, where do you go for compensation and how is it proven? [that's why we need regulation. We need a regulatory regime that ensures that each site not only uses state-of-the-art collusion detection, but shares information with other sites. There is collusion in live poker too - the difference is that online poker sites have a *lifetime* history of hands played, so has a far better chance of catching it.]
2. Who gets the profits and where are they deposited? (On the Isle of Wight?) [I think you are referring to the Isle of Man, where PokerStars is based. No, all of the proposed bills require US-based entities.]
3. Does the State get any taxes? (No, the hdqrs are all offshore) [No, as above, all licensed entities must be US-based. There are differences among the bills regarding foreign ownership, but that's irrelevant to the tax issue. In the Federal bills, tax revenues are shared between opted-in states and the Fed.]
4. Who gets the jobs? (What Jobs?) [15,000 of them, according to estimates from the 2007 PriceWaterhouseCoopers study on the topic.]
5. How does this boost the economy? (What economy?) [According to that same study, online gaming would produce ~$52 billion in tax revenues during its first 10 years. Not enough to retire the debt, but not bad.]
Online- poker, sports-betting etc. would be a HUGE plus for Vegas casinos. Much bigger handle and the rooms would be filled with gamblers who would get rooms as an incentive for bettin' with Nevada casinos, somethin' the foreign internet-only casinos could NOT offer!
Simply pathetic... its all about the money the governemt can get thier hands on... it has nothing to do with protecting US citizens freedoms and rights while protecting the country from any unlawful activity.
All of the pro-poker comments for this story have "expired" so nobody sees them anymore. But there are millions of Americans who enjoyed playing online poker until last month when the Department of Justice seized our money and shut down the three largest online poker sites. I look forward to the Barton bill passing, as do millions of other folks.
Hi SunJon, I would like to answer your questions.
1. Since this is for US online sites you go to the US poker site your playing on and they look into if you got cheated or not. They have all the hand histories and can determine if some was colluding by how they played. If you have a problem with the poker site you can complain to the US regulators over the site.
2. The poker sites will be in the US and the US gets a cut and the State you are playing from gets a cut and the State where the poker site is located gets a cut. The site gets keep what is left after all the above gets theirs.
3. These will be US sites.
4. Online Poker does bring in jobs.
TV advertizing.
Merchandising for site logo's.
Satellites to bring more people to B&M tournaments.
Customer service staff.
Security staff.
Programmers.
Will bring tax dollars to the US instead of offshore as it is now.
5. See 1-4.
Hi boftx, As far as little kids playing online poker goes, Where are their parents. If the parents are not keeping tabs on their children enough to catch them on a poker site then what about them chating in a forum with a sicko pedifile. Maybe the kids will get moms car keys with that credit card and take a drive. Maybe we should do away with cars. Look how many kids die in pools. Should we do away with pools? See my point?
There is collusion and the sites catch them by tracking their play and how many times they play at the same tables. There is software looking for paterns used by colluders. A US base site can turn these colluders over to the law and send the colluders info to all other licensed and regulated online sites. Skilled players at the tables can warn the sites to look at a player who looks to be colluding.