Facebook
Fark
Digg
Reddit
Stumble
Sunday, Feb. 20, 2011 | 2 a.m.
Sick leave abuse
Viewing video requires the latest version of Adobe's Flash Player
KSNV coverage of County Commission's continuing investigation into alleged fire department sick leave abuse, Feb. 15, 2011.
Steve Sisolak
Sun archives
- County considers seeking reimbursement over firefighter sick leave abuse (2-15-2011)
- Firefighters had ‘sick rosters’ that planned days off in advance, so others could plan to get overtime (2-15-2011)
- County OKs contract with firefighters that saves $7.4 million (2-1-2010)
- Arbitrator backs county over firefighters’ union in contract negotiations (1-19-2011)
- County firefighters union preaches frugality, to others (11-2-2010)
- Sisolak offers proof of firefighters ‘gaming’ sick leave system (9-11-2010)
- County, firefighters’ union spar over contract negotiations (8-3-2010)
- Is a wave of county firefighter retirements on the horizon? (6-25-2010)
- Rory Reid says firefighters union resorting to ‘scare tactic’ with ad (6-15-2010)
- County considers plan to privatize airport firefighting force (6-11-2010)
- New plan to curtail Clark County firefighter overtime (6-5-2010)
- Staffing shuffle would cut county Fire Department overtime (5-20-2010)
- Las Vegas, Clark County collaborate to limit firefighter overtime (4-27-2010)
- Fire union resists move to increase its ranks, reduce overtime costs (4-16-2010)
- Has fire union support become a campaign curse? (4-15-2010)
As investigators probe the potential abuse of sick leave by firefighters, Clark County officials say they will find many instances of employees scheduling sick time off weeks or months in advance. Among them is a firefighter who used the benefit to help carve out 53 consecutive days off in 2009.
What’s notable about the employee, some officials say, isn’t the questionable sick days that were part of the time off — about a third of the department’s 700 employees called in sick at least 10 days during 2009, the equivalent of a month of work time. Rather what is most significant, officials say, is the firefighter’s close ties to the union, which has described the abuse of sick leave as the actions of “a few bad apples.”
The firefighter in question is Eddie Beaman, who according to the union’s website is a member of its executive board, discipline committee, insurance committee and the union’s AFL-CIO/Central Labor Council chairman.
He is also the father of union President Ryan Beaman, who for weeks said the organization was unaware of sick-leave abuse in the department. This, even after an arbitrator detailed how firefighters used sick leave and vacation time to take extended periods off work while still getting overtime.
When county documents showed the practice was more widespread, Ryan Beaman blamed county and Fire Department administrators.
Clark County Commissioner Steve Sisolak says the long vacation of Eddie Beaman, who was about as entwined with the union as a firefighter could get, shows union leaders had to know about the sick-leave issues.
“That kind of shoots holes in the idea that they knew nothing, doesn’t it?” said Sisolak, the first elected official to accuse firefighters of misusing sick leave and other benefits. “I would tend to think that this is family knowledge or union knowledge that gets passed on year after year, generation after generation.”
Ryan Beaman said he only has a “business relationship” with his father. He does not even know his father’s phone number, let alone his work schedule, he said.
He repeated what he has said in recent weeks, that those found abusing the sick-leave system should be punished.
Including his father?
“Yes,” he said.
Eddie Beaman’s 53-day stretch of vacation occurred in summer 2009. He strung together 37 days off, plus 12 vacation days, one day of “other” leave and three sick days.
The 37 days are the consequence of a typical schedule: 10 work shifts per month (24 hours each) and 20 days off.
Among e-mails obtained by the Sun is a July 8 message from Eddie Beaman to Battalion Chief Jeff Tidwell in which Beaman said he did not want to use “vacation” for two future days off, July 17 and 19.
He still took those days off. His work record, also obtained by the Sun, shows him as “sick” those two days.
In 2009, Eddie Beaman’s total compensation was $222,457: a base pay of $96,000, $60,000 in overtime, as well as contributions of $53,000 to his pension and $14,000 for insurance.
That year, Beaman called in sick 18 shifts, was on vacation 17 shifts, and took nine shifts off using “other” leave. In total, those absences accounted for 36 percent of his shifts in 2009. He also worked 44 shifts of overtime and five callback shifts that year.
Eddie Beaman could not be reached for comment.
The debate over firefighters using or abusing sick leave has raged for more than a year after a Sun article pointed to differences in the amount of sick time taken by firefighters versus other county employees.
Since then, some county officials have argued that a symbiotic relationship exists between firefighters who call in sick and firefighters who substitute for them. County officials think “sick” firefighters and their substitutes work out schedules ahead of time to maximize overtime and callback pay.
(If substitutes fill in within 12 hours of their last shift, they get overtime plus contributions to their pensions.)
During arbitration hearings last year to settle a contract impasse, the county used Beaman’s case and others to argue for more control of firefighter sick leave. The arbitrator agreed, giving management the right to ask for a doctor’s note if a firefighter calls in sick more than five days annually. Previously, the county could not require a note unless a firefighter called in sick at least four days in a row.
County commissioners last week debated the possibility of cutting firefighter pension payments in proven cases of sick-leave fraud.
By using so-called sick rosters and e-mail, plus subpoena power, Sisolak said he is “certain” that if abuse occurred it can be proven.
The Sun obtained sick rosters that show weeks ahead of time who would be absent and who would fill in.
The Sun compared the rosters with e-mail, including one series from April 2009 in which a battalion chief, Gina Hall, asks another, Renee Dillingham, to be scheduled “sick” in June. “I will be taking off June 10, 17, 19, 21, 23 and 25 (all sick days if I can work it out ...),” Hall wrote.
A sick roster printed May 23, 2009, shows the names of those scheduled in June to substitute for vacationing or “sick” battalion chiefs. Dillingham was scheduled to work two of Hall’s sick days.
“That’s the kind of thing I hope investigators look at,” Sisolak said.
“With subpoena power, the FBI or Metro could get credit card receipts and, if you were out playing golf that day, you obviously weren’t sick. That would be proof to me.”
Oh what a tangled web we weave...
Where was (is) Mr. Weekly and the other elected leaders on this issue. Were they not aware of this theft of taxpayer funds?
I had no idea it was that bad. That's some pretty damning evidence. Jailtime needs to be handed out, along with loss of pensions.
You can't abuse the taxpayers and expect to be rewarded financially, unless you are a big business Republican.
"You can't abuse the taxpayers and expect to be rewarded financially, unless you are a big business Republican."
--------------------
You betcha. :-)
And to think many towns have an all volunteer fire dept.. I look at what the men and woman make in the military, there jobs are more dangerous, how does a fireman make 200k a year? Hooray for the union, job well done.
these the same guys sitting at the bar banging on the teacher's union ??? . just checking
Why are people acting so shock and surprised???????
This is exactly how government works.
For every pond of waste and fraud that is found there is at least 10,000 other ponds waiting to be found.
I think even the libs like the Sun now see that.
We are throwing tons of cash into waste and fraud when it should be going into public safety, education or returned to the taxpayers.
All these "cuts" are still far far away from even getting close to a truly efficient government.
"All these "cuts" are still far far away from even getting close to a truly efficient government."
--------------------------
Because unions are controlled by the Soviet Union, right Rock?
I'll take his job as firefighter for $90-k a year, give me 2 weeks vacation a year, 5 sick days a year and have me contribute to my healthcare..I havent been sick or called in sick in over 15yrs,and I'll give back my position on any boards! AND I am available immediately!!!
whats amazing is not only his pay from being a fireman, but he gets paid from the union for certain jobs.
Again, as bad as this is, you cannot (sgtrck) lump
ALL government employees or public employees into the same pot and call them evil and greedy. They are not even REMOTELY or tangentially connected.
It's like lumping all private sector workers together and calling them greedy and shady because used car salesmen have a bad rep.
Or all plumbers & electricians together because some shops are unionized and their work costs more because of it.
(Generally speaking, unionized shops cost more, but IMO perform at a much higher level and are more trustworthy).
Or all republicans together because John Ensign is such a sleazeball...
I cannot believe you children complaining about this. If you are going to prosecute just one fireman then you must prosecute every fireman. If you are going to prosecute every fireman, then you have to prosecute every politician that had previous knowledge in this matter dating all the way back to the get go. How long ago did Mr. Sissylak know about this, he probably should be let go too. He only brought this out in the open because it would look good on his political resume. What a game!
I guess I've never really the understood the Firefighter as God icon anyway. Yes, there are the rare dangers. But mostly, it's just a physical-labor type job for overgrown boys with undeserved benefits and limitless chances for abuse of their misplaced privileges. The local firefighter culture has been revealed for what it really it is.
If Vegas wasn't in the financial mess it is in now, this abuse would still go "unnoticed"....This has been going on for 20 plus years, and the county commissioners have all known about it.
@gmag39,
This article demonstrates a culture of manipulation of benefits for personal enrichment with taxpayer money.
Unions constantly cry foul when any negotiation with them asks for cuts or even just pay freezes. Must always get more is their motto.
The unions will spend millions of $$ on ads that proclaim the DIRE threat to public safety if they do not get their proper funding and pay.
THIS article casts a HUGE shadow of doubt on the unions motivations for ever increasing monies from the taxpayer. Is it really about public safety, when articles like this bring to light the manipulation of pay via abuse of sick days. <----- the best part is they arrange their sick days so that other firefighters can collect OVERTIME to cover their shift, a win-win for them and nothing but robbery (and I mean that quite literally) for the taxpayer.
Seriously, SHAME on these firefighters!
Why would a supervisor approve the sick leave without questioning it if it was scheduled in advance?
The mafia would be proud of these HEROES!
This is all about trust and honesty. The Firefighters and the Firefighters Union have directly organized a system to defraud Clark County taxpayers. Thanks Steve for exposing this fraud by people who are supposed to protect, but instead are in effect stealing from us.
And the records will also show there are lots of fathers, sons, brothers, nephews etc in the department. It's not so much about being skilled it's about being related.
Waaa, Waaa. Have some of you posters graduated High School yet.
So you guys want to get rid of all the firemen and all the county commissioners to start?
PartyLV-----
And being more specific---It's about being LDS. More money for the church if you have a big salary...Let's investigate that...Commissioner Collins is LDS...He's protecting his "brothers".
ENOUGH RELATIVES ON THE GRAVY TRAIN. So much in state government it's sickening. Tired of Managers and Directors promoting and referring girl friends and spouses into HIGHLY PAID STATE JOBS. And it's in the County too.
Loss of pension and retirement contributions upon conviction / plea bargain on misconduct charges. CONVERT THEM TO SOCIAL SECURITY PLAN. End PERS.
$227,000 in yearly compensation? 53 consecutive days off? This is insanity.
Getting one of these jobs is like winning the lottery for life, every penny of it on the taxpayers' back.
We have to stop this fiscal malfeasance or our children will spend their adult lives paying for this and our state will never recover economically.
This organization is rotten to the core; time to disband and start over. Start a national campaign and we will attract highly experienced firefighters at half the cost. Most firefighters throughout the nation would be VERY happy with HALF the pay our firefighters are receiving.
Chicago, has $14 Billion, in unfunded Pension liabilities and they are borrowing! $245 Million, for anticipated Fire Fighters raises!! no wonder IL.& NJ are in the verge of declaring State Bankrupcy (yes, they can declare BK, like any mismanaged corporation) The investors have stopped investing in Municipal bonds for the same reason. There is no way Clark County can afford this blatant fraud where a FF (his perks of $127,457 is more than his base salary $96,000,) is looting the taxpayer, hiding under the Union banner. This County is headed for BK. The Clark County Commission overseeing the FF, is akin to "Morris the Cat watching your Tuna Fish."
And to think that these clowns were so arrogant and determined to steal more money from the taxpayers. They would not take pay cuts like all the other unions in the state that did cooperate. Instead they showed a callous disregard for the entities that employ them and the taxpayers of the county.
Heroes they are not. The real heroes were the cops, fireman and citizens that died on 9/11. These idiots have ridden that assumption long enough and now their true colors come to the surface. They are less that common thieves!
With the FBI involved--something will happen...There is no money to pay for this scam any longer......They will make examples out of some to show that they are trying to fix the problem and regain respect for the community (which will never happen for quite some time if at all).
"Again, as bad as this is, you cannot (sgtrck) lump
ALL government employees or public employees into the same pot and call them evil and greedy."
----------------------------------
Agreed, punish these fireman who abused the system, they deserve to get slammed for this abuse.
we have the same prolems with firefighters out here in boston for many years and our 'scared' mayor is so afraid of the unions.
so many stories to tell.
I did not say that all government workers are like this or evil.
But I did said that are tons of waste and fraud that is going on.
Government is one of the inefficient systems on the planet.
This would never happen in private sector.
All the people that abused sick leave would have be fired by now.
Even now....after all this....not ONE SINGLE PERSON HAS BEEN FIRED!!!!!!!
It's easy to establish a pattern of sick leave abuse, just by comparing month to month schedules and see if a pattern exists. If it's fradulant, then "fire" these people..no pun intended!
Very much looking forward to the criminal charges, including restitution for all of the guilty parties involved in this.
What is done in the dark is brought to the light.
And a number of firefighters are able to work another job on top of this one.
For all of you who are screaming---fraud ! Here is something that none of you has addressed: The people who REPRESENTED the county in the "CONTRACT NEGOTIATIONS"---signed off on the wording of this contract. The wording that allowed this "fraud" to perpetuate itself. If the attorneys for the county of Clark had read the contract and saw that it would allow this behavior, then they are partially at fault-----the "fact" that this "fraud" has been going on for years clearly outlines my point. It "appears" that these firefighters were just "playing by the rules".....like it or not! There is such a thing as "past practices"......this has been going on for years and I believe that it will be difficult to "prove" criminal wrongdoing ! Unethical, maybe "yes" but criminal, maybe not ! The way to curb this behavior is to change the contract wording----retirements should be a percentage of the FF's BASE PAY---NOT a percentage of base pay PLUS overtime or callback time. Padding the OT for the last two or three years prior to retirement is why these guys are making 200K +----BOTH sides are partially to blame.
The over paid firemen have to PAY BACK all the MILLIONS OF DOLLARS they STOLE from the TAXPAYERS for all the Overtime and Sick Pay they got paid for.. Then FIRE them all .. Also how many Fires do these over paid firemen put out a year ??? Pay them for each FIRE they put out.. They get Paid for going to COSTO !!! Cut there pay in half...200 Thousand a year is WAY OVER PAID... THE MONEY WELL IS DRY !!!
hey district attorney david roger...
what the hell are you doing about this???
you frickin clown...
we know you are not capable of protecting the citizens of nevada...
just look at the hepatitis disaster...
roughly 50,000 people affected...
and only 3 charged...
only one doctor charged...
that happened years ago...
and no one is in jail yet...
no one is on death row yet...
you are clearly a pathetic district attorney...
a frickin clown...
now what about this davey boy???
hmmm...
what say you district attorney david roger???
you know what i think...
i think we should organize a protest rally...
right outside district attorney david roger's office...
time for the citizens of clark county to say enough of this frickin bull$#!^...
let's all get egyptian baby!!!
hey commissioner tom collins...
how much are you to blame for this bull$#!^???
aren't you a big firemen guy???
hmmm???
hey commissioner chris giunchigliani...
how much are you to blame for this bull$#!^???
aren't you a big firemen gal???
hmmm???
and you want to be mayor...
hee hee hee...
hoo hoo hoo...
haa haa haa...
The sad part is the dishonesty. Don't know about anyone else but I go thru life trying be honest to a T. If I see someone doing something wrong or dishonest, at the very least I'll point it out. Note it, to either my self or if need be confront it. All this is is people doing something wrong, getting away with it and others just covering up and lying.
The "not me" attitude that has all but consumed society. Any way I can get "mine" seems to be the mantra. No wonder people think nothing of skipping out on their obligations. Seems every other person sees it as being ok.
i think we clearly need to start organizing rallies...
only commissioner steve sisolak seems to give a damn...
all of the other bozos just want to sweep this bull$#!^ under the carpet as soon as possible...
we must not let that happen...
rallies baby...
how much frickin fun would that be...
just like the go go's said...
it is time to "walk like an egyptian" baby...
we can organize it all right here...
right on these boards...
we can rally in front of district attorney david roger's office...
we can rally at a commissioner's meeting...
it's time for the citizens to say...
enough is frickin enough...
speak up people!!!
Keep going Birdie, you haven't even scratched the surface yet. How many politicians knew about the firemans work ethics and yet did not raise a voice of concern? Are the politicians just as guilty as the firemen for "just going along with the norms"?
Any odds on Ryan Beaman keeping his job as President?
For the firefighters, the pariah status will take years to overcome and Ryan's departure marks the beginning.
Chunky says:
In just the one instance outlined above we're talking a substantial amount of the public's money. Multiply that by the 200+ employees who had ten or more days, plus the ones who still abused it less than ten days.
If ten days are equal to a month work and these people are making say $180,000 in total compensation that's roughly $32,000 x 200 employees or about $6.4 MILLION dollars. That's just the 1/3 who took more than ten days averaged.
Chunky is certainly no math scholar but if it's anywhere close to these kind of numbers we do need the FBI or DOJ in here. This is NOT a job for Metro to be trusted with.
That's what Chunky thinks!
Wow, I thought Omaha, NE had an issue with corrupt FF union. Vegas you win, now go prosecute them all.
Birdie, how long did Sisolak know about this before he said anything about it?
the time to organize rallies is right frickin NOW!!!
everybody needs to get off their fat @$#es...
make a sign...
and start protesting...
how much frickin FUN would that be???
it would be a frickin BLAST!!!
Are there laws written against gaming the work schedule of a city or county? If so, which actions of a citizen define illegality?
Greasy Birdie speaks.
Don't forget these guys are YOUR heros.
hey steve sisolak...
run for governor buddy...
private birdie reporting for duty!!!
This is Organized Crime and needs to be prosecuted by the Feds under the RICO Statutes.
"This would never happen in private sector."
---------------------------------
This from a Sharron Angle supporter, priceless.
do you guys realize how few people you would need for a kick a$# rally...
my guess...
50...
if 50 people showed up outside david roger's office...
with signs...
and tv cameras...
and newspaper reporters and photographers...
the message would be loud and clear and unambiguous...
the time to organize protests is right frickin now...
if the damn egyptians can over throw a dictator...
we sure as hell can shake up clark county...
listen to the go go's boys and girls...
we need to...
WALK LIKE AN EGYPTIAN!!!
to verify if daddy Beamon was really sick, just look at all the other union postions, committees he is on. If he called in sick but atteded any of these meeings then I think we have our first fraud case!
"Walk Like ann Egyptian"--The Bangles, not the Go-Go's.
I'm with Birdiedreamin; let's have protest rallies.
To Birdie, The nurse will be by soon. The doc has ordered a double dose of medication in the little white cup today and a 72 hour watch.. I hope you can get out soon..
Your buddy, $kip$ter.....
A teacher is in jail because she had knowledge of a crime. What about these guys. They all knew.
The only reason 1/3 had so much overtime is that it wasn't the other 2/3's time yet. They all get their turn at pension padding toward the end. It's strategic!
Ryan Beaman is a complete liar, he doesn't know his father home phone number, that the answer you get from criminals. Ryan knew of the abuse because his father was one of the participant. Tell me how many sons don't know what their fathers do, none. I still say the citizens of Clark County have ground to file a class action lawsuit again the firefigher directly for abuse of trust and misappropriation of public funds. Most cities have a rule against calling in sick and then working overtime or taking vacation time. I guess its time that firefighters must get a doctor's excuse before calling in sick, its clear that they are not repsonsible enough or be trusted to call in sick. I say terminate firefighter that have taken 10 day or more sick leave in a year, there are plenty of qualified firefighers across the country that could be trusted and would love to have a job.
There are two changes that could be made to the contract that would greatly reduce the incentive for this to occur in the first place.
One, make sick time "use it or lose it" on an annual basis so it can't be saved up for the last year before retirement. The current contract allows for 12 sick shifts per year than can be accrued.
Two, stop paying PERS on callback shifts. Any PERS contribution should be based solely upon the base salary and normal shifts worked, period.
I would like to see other changes made to NRS288 in general. Taking away the either/or aspect of binding arbitration would help, too. That would make the contract negotiations a lot more meaningful.
But just these two changes to sick time and PERS contributions would go a long way towards stopping this from happening.
Heads should roll and the abusers and people who knew of the abuse should be punished. There is clear evidence of abuse here and it seems to be so widespread that a renegoatiation should take place.
Sissylak, he started the momentum here and won't finish what he started? He should be charged with enciting a riot. What a fool.
Wow, what a slanted and biased article.
1) I'm not saying that there was not sick time abuse, but the man only used 3 sick days. The rest was vacation time.
2) A call back calendar is a good idea. Fire/rescue work is dangerous, and even more so when understaffed. Doctors use something similar, called being on call. Why not a witch hunt for the doctors too?
3) He did not make $200,000+ in a year. He made $96,000 plus overtime. If the city hired enough personnel to account for vacation time, there would be less overtime. The average firefighter in Las Vegas only makes $34,000 a year. http://www.simplyhired.com/a/salary/sear...
This man is clearly a senior firefighter (or higher rank)who has spent his life protecting yours. Assuming he has worked nearly 25 years, he may have known or worked with Firefighter / Paramedic Billie Combs, Engineer Ronald Crews, Firefighter Mark Keeton, and Firefighter Kendall Preas, all of whom have DIED in the line of duty with the Las Vegas Fire Department.
I don't condone abuse of sick time, but 3 days? really? Unless LVFD has unlimited sick time, the man earned this time off.
Welcome to the world of corrupt unions. This is occuring over the entire 50 states. But in some states it is a fight to the death. Welcome to Wisconsin. Check out what is happening there. Good union people are targeted to give up all collective bargaining. Now advance to Las Vegas. What are you all thinking??? Do you all want to go back to working 12-14 hour days with no benefits. It is coming your way. With corrupt people sticking it to the regular folks. I think all corrupt people should lose their jobs, pension etc.
TN_Fireman,
I don't know where that figure of $34k/yr came from. Here is the contract that just ended last year: http://media.lasvegassun.com/media/pdfs/...
Look on page 108 for schedule 69 (Firefighter 1) and it shows the base at $51k/yr.
You should also look at the sick pay provisions in Article 16. It takes about 7 pages to explain that, one of the longest sections in the contract. But 12 shifts/yr that can be accrued amount to almost unlimited if held on to for long enough. Don't overlook the section allows them to be sold back if enough are accumulated.
The way the benefits work it will always be cheaper to pay OT than hire more people, which just further increases the incentive for some one to game the system.
If that contract had been printed on toilet paper it would better serve the taxpayers.
The avg Clark County firefighter earns over $150K a year in wages and benefits.
The avg Clark County firefighter retires at 55 with a pension that pays out $100K a year plus health insurance.
Like I've said before, staff the sick / vacation shifts with volunteers. Problem solved.
I read this in another blog, so I'm not trying to steal someone's thunder. But they asked a good question: Why would the fire department hire people who are so sick, so often?
The only education required for a firefighter is a GED.
They only work 10 days (24 hour shifts) a month.
Most have 2nd jobs.
They get to work out, watch movies, watch TV, read books etc while on the job.
They drive around those big trucks to get food, workout, see mistresses, etc and for each mile driven the truck cost like about a $1 a mile.
I feel sorry for the MedicWest and AMR paramedics. Those are the people that need a pay raise.
According to the article in the Review-Journal YESTERDAY, Eddie Beaman used a whopping 27 hours of sick leave in all of 2009! Holy Cr*P! Someone call the FBI, CIA, NSA, EPA, NASA, and the Navy Seals! This guy used a whole 1.125 shifts of sick leave. Oh the humanity! Lets break out the tar and feathers. For all of you parrots out there, I hope you support firing EVERONE in this country who used more than 1.125 shifts of sick leave in a year.
Could it just be that he is being attacked becuase of who he is related to?..........NAHH!
BTW, didn't Sisolak get 23 million dollars from the taxpayers? I guess that qualifies for an honest public servant. I mean, who knew that you couldn't build a 100 story building next to an airport. I need, um....about....oh, I don't know....23 million taxpayer dollars to make me whole.
I think the Mayoral election is a chance for the people to show their displeasure with this situation. Chris G can lecture all she wants, but I don't see how she can avoid being seen as a career civil servant and career politican. She's never worked in the private sector and been in elective office for 20 years. Seems like she is either part of the problem or too clueless to be rewarded with another job.
It almost appears to be an illusion. Let's point the finger in one direction, while forgiving and forgetting those responsible for creating this mess. This contract appears to be the source of all evil.The writers, supporters, and abusers of this contract are all intertwined in some form of fradulent rip-ff of the all ignorant tax-payer.
This is why you can't give government a blank check and support their every whim while failing to do the diligence of determining the public benefit.
I feel sympathy for the hard working fire fighters that were not a part of this negotion and scam. They are definitely not to blame and I do not trust the politicos whom are trying to make a name. It seems the solution is an independant investigation that our state cannot afford. The Feds need to step in as our own local government is incapable of telling the truth and appears not to be concerned with the truth, hence the almighty blame game. Sisolak is not a savior, but a magician, otherwise why aren't we hearing the truth? No mention of the writers and approvers of this scam?? Where are the journalists? Someone sure could make a name by getting to the root. The source, the bottom of the slime. Tell us the TRUTH!!!
go_rebels,
Here is the list of Commissioners who approved the contract that ran til last year and which is currently being negotiated again.
Rory Reid, Chairman
Chip Maxfield, Vice Chairman
Susan Brager
Tom Collins
Chris Giunchigliani
Lawrence Weekly
Bruce L. Woodbury
where's the donuts?
again--after all this obvious overpay and abuse of the sick leave system in place---why were the firefighters given almost the same contract???????? You could fire everyone and put up job offers for 60k and get 10k people waiting in line for this job!!!!! the county and cities are out of line to agree to these contracts in the first place. 222k for a grunt????? come on.
Tahoe DI obviously doesn't know the policies and procedures of sick leave abuse in Clark County. You can be terminated for "sick leave abuse" if a pattern of suspected abuse is documented. i.e. if an employee calls in sick every Monday after payday. You can take sick leave whenever you want if it's scheduled and it meets the criteria for what is defined under sick leave uses, but the wording of the contract has nothing to do with the main point, being abuse. Firefighters were clearly "working" the system. My supervisors are clearly aware of who calls in sick and when and they keep track of it. It's funny how Fire Chief Steve Smith conveinently retired prior to the sh*t hitting the fan! He should be investigated as well. Let's see if Commissioner Sisolak goes after him?
Boftx,
I stand corrected on the firefighter starting salary, but $17.65 hr isn't overpaid - I'd say it's pretty fair. Like firefighters everywhere, overtime is the bread and butter of the job. But they sacrifice a lot. 24 hr workdays, (24 on 48 off) averages out to 56 hours a week. 1 overtime shift, and you're looking at an 80 hr work week on average. That's a lot of family time missed.
The article also comments on scheduled sick time - this is not unheard of either. Surgeries, cancer treatment, and more are viable uses of sick time that one would schedule, in advance.
I don't oppose penalizing a guy if he shows a pattern of sick time abuse, but the article makes the guy out to be the second coming of the mob, just because he has 3 sick days following his earned vacation time.
Find the problems and fix them. I'm sure they have proper disciplinary procedures to follow, they don't involve dragging a working class hero through the mud.
Brian D,
I don't want to knock the volunteers for what they do, but their response times are far lower, their rate of accidental deaths are much higher. Are you seriously suggesting that the county should let people (residents and tourists) die just to save money?
TN_Fireman,
I have tried to suggest reasonable steps to take to prevent such abuse that at the same time recognizes the unique characteristics of the job. There are other steps that go beyond those, but I don't think they could ever be accepted.
My solution is to remove the incentive as much as possible to game the system, yet still be fair to those who don't. I would rather say a straight salary, with no OT, at a fair rate. The system should not be rigged in favor of paying OT instead of hiring adequate numbers of staff. If firefighters insist on having an education to receive a specialized degree be paid for at public expense to be a professional, then they should be treated as such and classified as exempt.
Such behavior pretty much defines "middle-class" American, no?
Common man's attempt at being a Capitalist?
Have you no morals, man?
Nope, can't afford 'em.
Who can?
: {
It is time to start Firing the Firemen...
Through gross greed and abuse, Unions have allowed themselves to become distinct. They have no one to blame but themselves.
My proposal to fix the problem:
Put the firefighters on salary. No overtime, no sick pay. Just a flat annual salary.
Get rid of the 24 hour shift. This is a huge waste of money. We are paying these guys to sleep, play video games, workout, cook, etc. If we went to a 12 hour shift, you could eliminate all of that. How much cheaper would it be to build a firestation without the sleeping quarters, large kitchen, TV room, gym , etc. Then we could actually get 12 hours of work out of them.
Firefighters need to be staying busy when they have downtime. Going to the gym is not working. They could help out at neighborhood schools, clean up graffiti, pick up trash, do data entry for the county, something. If we are paying them for a shift, they should be working the entire time.
It seems like common sense to me.
What ever happen to volunteer firefighters?
I'd be willing to fight my own fires, fry the smelt, and run the raffle boards at fund raisers.
: {
The public is to blame as well. YOU, not me, held these cock roaches up as heros. I didn't fall for that 911 bulls%$t, but YOU did. And now they have f%$ked you. You deserve it, because you didn't get off your lazy butts and find out what these contracts said. They were and are public knowledge. Be a citizen not a whiner, you bunch of morons.
I was at the grocery store in the alcohol section picking up a few six packs for my bbq & who of all people do i see..A fireman in full uniform putting a case of corona beers in his packed shopping cart..
These guys are getting paid loads of cash to booze it up at the fire station.
ronster,
I won't disagree that many are to blame for allowing this to happen in the first place, but at the same time County and IAFF 1908 had this clause put into the contract. ( http://media.lasvegassun.com/media/pdfs/... )
From Article 2 paragraph 2:
"The Union and County agree that the only way the public shall obtain a copy of this collective bargaining agreement is a request in writing to the Union or the County. At no time shall the County place the collective bargaining agreement, in whole or part on any website."
That would seem to indicate that they have intentionally made it as difficult as possible for a member of the public get a copy of the contract. Worse, they have deliberately prohibited the widespread dissemination of this information.
This, all by itself, warrants a state law or constitutional amendment mandating the publication by all available means of any public contract, preferably prior to approval.
How much do the LV Firemen give to the United Way each year? I would like to know what the average gift is, using an average yearly compensation fo $183,000...or is this secret too?
PartyLV and Steve10
"It's about being LDS. More money for the church"
What is the LDS percentage on the LV Fire Dept? After working at the Nevada Test Site, I was amazed at how many LDS members got hired, and usually into the same group with an LDS manager.
The Nevada Test Site is big on nepotism and hiring brothers of the same faith. Groups of them will be hired at one time from one small areal of the US where the majority of people are one religion. They get the raises, they get the bonuses and they get the awards. Infidels beware, your days are numbered....
Maybe he had knee surgery? Is it possible that someone might actually use sick time for something legitimate. Oh I forgot, this is America where you're guilty until proven innocent just because the media and a politician say so.
Ted25, Nice try. Did you hear about the FF who solved cold fusion? We're all going to get free power for the rest of our lives thanks to the FF. Wow, your right...making up stuff is fun!
Buddy,
Good to see you posting as always. What do you think of my suggestion that sick time not be accrued from year to year? Would that harm those who do not abuse the system?
Also, do you have any opinion on why such a clause as Article 2, paragraph 2 is needed in a contract?
Not trying to put you on the spot, just truly interested in what you think of those items.
boftx, sick time is to be used for illness or injury. If I get T-boned while driving off-duty and I break a leg and a vertebrae or two. How much sick time do think I might need to use to recover from my injuries? Do you think 12 shifts will cover my recovery and rehab? Figure that 12 shifts off work is just over one month of shifts.
A2/P2- I don't know. I believe there are a lot of contracts that the County enters into that they would rather not publicly post, for whatever the reason. The FF's CBA is just one of them. This article was changed in the new CBA to match state law. I don't remember the actual language.
Buddy, I'll grant that there could be legitimate reason to take sick leave that 12 shifts (33 days max I think) might not cover such as a broken bone or some other reason. I'd be willing to have some kind of mechanism to cover that.
But what about the principle itself? I have never had a job where sick time could be accrued, let alone sold back. Vacation time, yes, but never sick time.
Regards A2P2, what reason could a state or local government ever have to keep a contract secret or nearly so? (I'll grant that at the federal level there could be national security issues that would require this.)
I called in sick maybe 6-7 times and was never paid for it...in my entire 36yr union career.
boftx, I really don't think the sick time accrual is a problem. Not all jobs have the same risks and rewards. The abuse was the real problem and it is actively being resolved by all parties. But when negotiating benefits everything is a trade off. For example, I would prefer to see some of the money attributed towards sick time spent on a wellness program. Maybe the County could propose to less buy back and replace it with a pro-active wellness program.
The information has always been available. It just needed to be requested. IMPO... No municipality wants to have a public forum for every contract they consider. Politicians need to be elected and if they had to publicly account and argue every choice they made they would never make any decision for fear that they would lose constituents.
"Politicians need to be elected and if they had to publicly account and argue every choice they made they would never make any decision for fear that they would lose constituents."
I would submit for your consideration that elected officials should damn well be held accountable for every decision. :)
hey buddy boy...
sorry charlie...
still not buying the crap you are selling...
you know what i think they should do with that money attributed to sick time???
GIVE IT BACK TO THE TAX PAYERS!!!
have you lost all perspective buddy boy???
what the f do you want the taxpayers to do???
wellness programs???
hee hee hee...
does that mean jacuzzis and massages at the fire houses???
do they already have jacuzzis???
you know what i think they should do to those that abused sick time???
that money must be returned...
their pensions must be stripped...
they must be fired...
AND THERE MUST BE CRIMINAL CHARGES!!!
boftx, you are talking way to aggressive these days, have you just recieved a political position and you are trying out those new wings?
Somebody pull the reins in on this guy, he's even using 4 letter words!
birdie, nobody really cares what you think. You never add anything of value to these discussions anyway. Why don't you go outside now and play, the adults are talking.
boftx, I believe the politicians should be accountable, but since your a supervisor, you must know how hard it is to get a room of 20 people to agree on something or anything for that matter. Imagine if the room had 2 million people all taking their turn on the microphone. You would never get past the first contract. Politicians don't have any superpowers to make decisions that we the people don't have. They put their pants on the same way we do. Everyone deserves fair representation, but you elect "leaders" to make decisions on your behalf.
hey buddy boy...
you keep lobbing them over the middle...
and i'll keep crushing them out of the park...
got that skippy...
now...
let me ask you a question pal...
how many people did you think were abusing the system???
hmmm???
You're right, Buddy, about having every taxpayer there to take part. That wasn't exactly what I meant. My point about contracts is that they should all be easily available for review, and if they are bad or questionable then the next meeting might be packed. Hopefully the voting booths will be packed next time around, too.
can clark county file bankruptcy???
do we qualify for bankruptcy???
this issue should be explored in great detail...
we could eliminate a huge chunk of the pension liability...
save billions...
easy way to correct any and all abuses by any and all public employees...
very interesting idea!!!
You people seem to love to flap your lips with nothing to claim as what laws were broken. Keep flappin' I heard the sissylak is going to let someone else handle the rest of this. He starts all this crap and now will let someone else pick-up the pieces. He is a strange sort. Must be related to birdielak. Strange people I tell ya...
The FF contract should be public information and the bargaining session also open to the public. I've heard that the fire union uses much intimidation during negations to achieve their ends.
If those sessions were open, that wouldn't happen and the public would get a better deal.
SunJon, Intimidation? Really? Like they bring guns and stuff? Maybe they walked into the room and start pushing Ed Finger and Don Burnette around. Actually, I heard they held them upside down by their ankles until all their lunch money fell out. Get serious, you can't honestly believe that.
Are there any other bargaining sessions open to the public? Don Burnette and Ed Finger just got huge raises. Did you watch their bargaining session? Why should the FFs be treated any different? Oh that's right, they use intimidation.
hey buddy boy...
what's the matter skippy???
afraid to answer the question???
hmmm???
let me try again...
how many people did you think were abusing the system???
hmmm???
Birdie, your communication skills are like that of a four year old that wants ice cream they can't have. I've answered that question numerous times. If you really want an answer go find it. In the mean time please be quiet when grown ups are talking.
hey buddy boy...
i missed your answer pal...
humor me...
how many people did you think were abusing the system???
hmmm???