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Friday, March 19, 2010 | 2:05 a.m.
Congressional leaders unveiled the latest version of the health care bill Thursday, and the House Democratic leadership was ecstatic.
After months of being hammered by Republicans with lies about the reform plans, Democrats cheered the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office’s initial analysis of the bill, which undercut the GOP’s complaints. The analysis found the bill would give access to health insurance to 95 percent of nonelderly Americans while cutting the federal deficit by $138 billion over 10 years. The bill could cut as much as $1.2 trillion from the deficit in the following decade.
“We are absolutely giddy over the great news,” said Rep. James Clyburn, the South Carolina Democrat in charge of corralling votes for the bill.
President Barack Obama said the deficit-reduction measures are “but one virtue of a reform that will bring new accountability to the insurance industry and greater economic security to all Americans.”
Indeed. The health care reform plan is designed to cut skyrocketing insurance costs and expand coverage to millions of Americans. The country spends about $2.5 trillion a year on health care, and yet the percentage of Americans who lack insurance is growing. A recent study indicated that 1 in 4 Californians under age 65 are without insurance. In Nevada, 1 in 5 people lack health insurance.
Those numbers are deplorable, but Republicans continue to fight efforts to expand Americans’ access to health care insurance and deny that this is an issue. Never mind that Americans have seen their health care costs go up while their coverage has eroded. And millions have found themselves without insurance during the recession because of job loss.
Instead of working to help Americans, the Republicans are trying to scare them with half-truths to kill the bill. Republican National Committee Chairman Michael Steele told CNN on Thursday that the government was “injecting” itself into private insurance, echoing the standard GOP argument that the legislation is a government “takeover.” It is not a takeover. The bill would increase Americans’ ability to buy private health insurance.
Are they really against government health insurance? If so, why don’t they pull the plug on Medicaid, Medicare and Veterans Affairs, which provide coverage for millions of needy Americans, seniors and veterans? Instead, some Republicans have hypocritically complained about what they say will be cuts to government health plans.
Instead of honestly working to fix the serious problems in the system, Republicans have pledged to throw every obstacle they can in the way of Democrats. “It’s going to be a wild ride,” said John Boehner, the Republican leader in the House. Congress will have to take up two bills to pass health care reform to avoid a Republican filibuster in the Senate.
As Republicans make their stink and try to drum up a campaign issue out of health care, millions of Americans are without health insurance and countless more are being sunk by the high costs of care. A recent study found that a serious medical condition can send someone with insurance not only to the hospital but to bankruptcy as well.
Without change, things will get worse. The Robert Wood Johnson Foundation on Monday released a study that found that without health care reform, the percentage of uninsured Americans will climb dramatically over the next five years. The study found that families and the middle class will be particularly hard hit.
The country can’t wait any longer for health care reform. The issue has been studied and debated, and Congress has settled on a good plan. It’s time to move forward and pass it.
Congressional Budget Office (CBO) is not yet final, and there is reason to believe the score could change. And it just shows you Washington playing games with the American people.
The whole so-called CBO scoring issue is a fallacy. CBO only scores what they're given and they relied on some of the same accounting gimmicks that they employed in previous estimates as well as some new ones. Democrats delayed most of the major spending provisions until 2014 to make the bill appear cheaper over the CBO's 10 year budget window; claimed as revenue premiums from a new long-term insurance program, even though that same money is supposed to pay off future benefits; and it siphoned nearly $19.4 billion from an unrelated student loan bill.
The latest Gallup poll suggests that President Obama's drive to jam the unpopular bill through Congress is taking its toll. For the first time of his presidency, more people disapprove of Obama's performance (48 percent) than approve (46 percent).
Koolaid drinking liberals actally do not give rip that this healthcare fiasco will be a disaster, nor are they listening to the voting masses who are saying this plan should be deposited in the junk yard of bad ideas.The Democrats are on a suicide mission to hell.
The whole health care debate has come down to tactics being used to try and pass this bill. Besides the bills contents being questionable, the methods being used by Pelosi and company are a joke. Deem and scheme, reconcillation, arm twisting, Lousianna Purchase, Gatoraide, Cornhusker kick backs, etc. If this was a popular bill, and IF Pelosi had the votes, it would have been a done deal months ago. But its not popular and the America people have had it with the B.S. coming from Washington. I do not care about Obama's, Reid's or Pelosi's legacy. I care what is right for this country. And this bill is no longer any good - its tainted with B.S. to buy votes. Any congress person who votes for this garbage will not get my vote in 2010 or ever again.
Reduce the deficit, increase quality and access, increase rolls by 30 million.
I also have a bridge to sell.
Let's make a deal.
If this thing does reduce the deficit and does lower preminums than us right-wingers will keep quiet.
If this thing does not reduce the deficit and preninums go up than lib koolaid crowd will keep quiet.
The odds are that this program will bust the deficit and preminums will go up.
We all know the track record of government programs and it is not good.
On the other hand, Obama is predicting that preminums will go down by 3000%. No typo there.....yep....he actually said a 3000% decline.
Ever been to public housing? Get a visual on it.
Now picture public health care.
All you liberals, as well as the Sun editorial staff: Call your liberal friends in congress and ask them why they're not signing on to this for themselves and their families. Suckers!!!
Larry5, what are you talking about, exactly?
Public health care? Have you been paying attention lately? The Senate bill, which is the one that is near passage via reconciliation, relies most heavily on the private insurance market, not a public health care system.
"The odds are that this program will bust the deficit and preminums will go up."
When the Republicans passed Medicare Part D a few years back in 2003, and the CBO said it would add an estimated $394 billion to the deficit, the Republicans voted for it with glee.
When the Republicans passed Bush's second tax cuts a few years back in 2003, and the CBO said it would add an estimated $349 billion to the deficit, the Republicans voted for it with glee.
When the Republicans passed Bush's other tax cuts a few years back in 2001, and the CBO said it would add an estimated $1.3 TRILLION to the deficit, the Republicans voted for it with glee.
You guys really just don't get it.
You know this is a good bill for the American people because the insurance industry is flooding the airwaves with opposition ads. Republicans will be the big losers in this when Americans realize that the tyranny of the insurance companies with their "For-Profit Death Panels" is stopped.
"Garbage in, garbage out" best describes the CBO analysis. Besides the clearly questionable constitutional questions engendered by the process the Obamanauts are following, the bill is so laden with pork & special favors and based on such fallacious assumptions that whatever positives it may have are overwhelemed by the negatives.
We want REAL REFORM, not pork & favors worked out behind closed doors and rammed down our throats by a small cadre of elitists hoping to preserve their hold on power. You're either with the people or against them, and this time we'll remember you.
This bill is the first step toward a single-payer system. With passage of this bill the federal government will have total control of health care within 10 years.
Read this, then tell me you're still liberal enough to trust the government with more responsibility:
http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/medicare...
HERE IT COMES...
The Medicare payroll tax will be applied to investment income, beginning in 2013.
A new 3.8 percent tax would be imposed on interest, dividends, capital gains and other investment income for individuals making more than $200,000 a year and couples making more than $250,000.
AND THERE'S MORE!!!
The bill also would increase the Medicare payroll tax by 0.9 percentage point to 2.35 percent on wages above $200,000 for individuals and $250,000 for married couples filing jointly.
IT DOESN'T STOP THERE!!!
The 40 percent tax on health benefits would be delayed until 2018 and would apply only to premiums exceeding $10,200 a year for individuals and $27,500 for families.
HOLD ON, THERE STILL MORE TO COME!!!
The search for revenue to pay for health care has been made more difficult by Obama's campaign pledge not to raise taxes on the middle class.
The result is a bill that would raise a total of $438 billion in new taxes over the next decade, mainly from high-income taxpayers and fees on the health care industry. And with you add more tax to the health care industry, guess who will pay the price...
YOU!!!
Based on Thursday's changes, the health legislation also contains special deals for:
_Retains $300 million in extra Medicaid aid for Louisiana, which had helped win support for the Senate health bill from Sen. Mary Landrieu, D-La. The state is still struggling to recover from Hurricane Katrina.
_Keeps $100 million included in the Senate bill that is expected to go for a public hospital in Connecticut sought by Dodd, who is retiring.
_Preserves language won by Baucus permitting many of the 2,900 residents of Libby, Mont., to qualify for Medicare benefits. Some of them have asbestos-related diseases from a now-shuttered mine.
_Provides an additional $8.5 billion over the next decade for 11 states and the District of Columbia to help them pay for the more generous Medicaid assistance they have been providing low-income residents. These states are Arizona, Delaware, Hawaii, Maine, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New York, Pennsylvania, Vermont, Washington and Wisconsin.
_Maintains a Senate-approved provision giving extra money for hospitals and doctors in North and South Dakota, Montana and Wyoming.
_Includes an additional $99 million in 2012 and 2013 for Tennessee hospitals that treat many poor people.
_Promises new aid for colleges serving minority students, using money the government is supposed to save by no longer paying banks to make student loans. Included are annual payments of $100 million for schools with large numbers of Hispanic students, the same amount for colleges with many black students, and millions more for schools with large numbers of native Americans and other minorities.
THANKS SENATOR REID. Nevada will only pay higher taxes to remember Harry by...
Caterpillar, the world's largest construction machinery manufacturer by sales, said it's opposed to provisions in the bill that would expand Medicare taxes and mandate insurance coverage.
The Peoria-based company said these provisions would increase its insurance costs by at least 20 percent, or more than $100 million, just in the first year of the health-care overhaul program.
It would be better to pass gas.
Sue Lowden has a history of illegally cutting health benefits.
http://www.harryreid.com/ee/index.php/ne...
"The results from the Medicus Firm survey, entitled "Physician Survey: Health Reform's Impact on Physician Supply and Quality of Medical Care," were intriguing, particularly in light of the most recently published career projections from the Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS). The BLS predicts a more than a 22 percent increase in physician jobs during the ten-year period ending in 2018. This places physician careers in the top 20 fastest-growing occupations from 2008 to 2018. Meanwhile, nearly one-third of physicians responding to the survey indicated that they will want to leave medical practice after health reform is implemented."
http://www.themedicusfirm.com/pages/medi...
The actual survey is posted at the bottom under methodology.
In Nevada 1 in 3 lack insurance not 1 in 5. Among the worst in the US.
ECM...physicians will leave...bul...t. 1.1 million medical doctors got nearly $500 billion last year. If you include dentists it's almost a trillion bucks. Do the math. It's not as lucrative as derivataves or hedge funds but a lot better than Walmart. $400k per doc not exactly minimum wage.
Houstanjac...the voting masses aren't paying their medical bills. Over $200 billion went into default last year. If people refuse or can't pay the bills the system needs an overhaul. Doctors and hospitals want to be paid.
Each time Obama leads a big push for his health care plan, his job approval ratings suffer.
For Members of Congress, the impact may be more tangible. Fifty-percent (50%) are less likely to vote for a Member of Congress who supports the health care reform plan proposed by Obama. Just 34% say they're more likely to vote for someone who supports this legislation.
Did our elected officials forget about JOBS???
NEED A JOB???
If ObamaCare becomes law, the Congressional Budget Office expects the IRS will need roughly $10 billion over the next 10 years and nearly 17,000 new employees to meet its new responsibilities under health reform.
You could be one of the 17,000 new IRS employees, so apply today and get the same health care that your Congressman has...
Larry...at the rate people are dropping insurance and signing up for medicaid and medicare the government controls over half of healthcare currently. They will own the vast majority in 10 years if nothing is done. If the 150 million that are sick could BUY insurance maybe it would reduce reliance on uncle sam.
Caterpillar has done over 120 billion in sales in the last few years. 100 million bucks is probably what they pay the top few execs.
The 94,000 people they employ need either healthcare from Cat or to be able to buy insurance.
Obama's poll rating is at a all time low. But if you think that is bad, take a look at the recent Gallup poll:
"Americans hold Congress in far less esteem than they do the president -- 16% approve and 80% disapprove of the job Congress is doing."
Don't forget to mark November 2nd on your calender. There is no better way to show your elected officials what you think of them than VOTING!!!
The 10 highest paid CEO's of US Healthcare companies. Annual compensation:
Ronald A Williams, Aetna CEO compensation: $38.12 Million
H Edward Hanway, Cigna CEO compensation: $10.27 Million
Michael Neidorff, Centene CEO compensation: $8.77 Million
Heath Schiesser, WellCare Health Plans CEO compensation: $8.1 Million
George Mikan, UnitedHealth Group CEO compensation: $6.531 Million
Joseph Zubretsky, Aetna CFO compensation: $5.57 Million
James Carlson, Amerigroup CEO compensation: $5.29 Million
Stephen Hemsley, UnitedHealth Group CEO compensation: $5.03 Million
Michael McCallister, Humana CEO compensation: $4.76 Million
Angela Braly, WellPoint CEO compensation: $4.07 Million
How we are affected from having these high paid executives issue orders to deny claims, increase premiums, and decrease benefits:
America spends $7,290 per capita on health care, far more than other countries with far lower health results.
From 2000 to 2007, health care premiums increased 10.6% per year. In the same period, overall inflation averaged only 2.8%.
America's infant mortality rate is 87% higher than France's. The United States ranks 43rd in infant mortality rate. 30,000 infants die in the U.S. each year.
The US is ranked 48th in life expectancy, Cubans live longer.
More than 25% of Texans don't have access to affordable health care. 100% of Mexicans do.
Prescription drugs cost around 50% more in the U.S. than in other industrialized countries.
Remote Area Medical, or RAM, was an organization set up to provide health care to the needy in third world countries. Now it is doing 60% of its work in the U.S.
Only 28% of U.S. doctors use electronic medical records. 90% do in the U.K.
Most doctors in Europe are paid based on performance. In America, this is true with only 30 percent.
41% of U.S. adults now have problems paying medical bills and many are hounded by collection agencies.
A quarter of Americans throw away prescriptions because they can't afford to fill them.
20% of Americans report having had a lab, medical, or medication error (worst in world rankings).
Doctors spend $210 billion per year on procedures based on fear of liability, not patient need.
Inefficient claims processing costs over $200 billion per year.
Medicare operates with a 3% overhead. Private insurance has a 26% overhead.
Automation, elimination of pre-approval requirements, and other Innovations could increase billing efficiency by 50% and save insurers $27.2 billion, hospitals $17 billion, and physicians $6.9 billion.
Without reform, employer-based health care costs are projected to increase 166% by 2019.
The per employee cost of health care is projected to reach $28,350 by 2019, nearly 3 times the cost in 2009.
The assumption that having a full time job guarantees you health insurance is false. 45% of uninsured Americans actually have a full time job.
Eight percent of U.S. health expenditures go to insurance administration. Compare that to two percent in Finland.
Larry...you spend way too much time looking at polls. Presidents always have bad poll numbers in a lousy economy and it's the same with congress. When people can start buying insurance and the unemployment numbers begin to drop both will get a good pop.
People blame politicians for everything. They say they don't want government in their lives but blame government when they buy a house they can't afford or accrue medical bills they can't pay.
Greed and corruption are behind the massive economic collapse and they want Obama to create jobs and pull us out of the mess.
The government can't even deliver mail efficiently and at a profit. There is no way they can handle health care. Besides, it won't happen. As I said before....
Article 1, Section 7 of the Constitution stipulates that for any bill to become a law, it must pass both the House of Representatives and the Senate. The bill must contain the exact same language in both chambers - and in the version signed by the president - to be a legitimate law.
If Pelosi tries the deem and pass without meeting the constitutional requirements, this thing will be so tied up with legal challenges by the States that we will all be long dead before you get your socialized health care.
And if they go with an up or down vote (which they are likely too scared to do)Virginia already enacted legislation that prohibits the federal government from forcing its citizens to purchase government-approved health insurance. and at least 30 other states are following that lead.
Either way, this won't come to fruition. The challenges alone will tie up Obamacare long enough to throw out Obama, Pelosi & Reid, at which time this will be repealed before the challenges are even finished.
GO FIGURE...
A Fox News poll released today finds 55 percent of Americans oppose ObamaCare now being considered, while only 35 percent favor them.
Ah, yes, Fox News. For some reason, people never notice that the "o" is really a "u," for that's what that organization does to journalism and truth. Is that poll anything like the great national chamber of commerce poll that found 34 people opposed to health care in District 3 and concluded therefore that everyone in Nevada is against it?
It comes down to this. Either you believe you have an obligation to help your fellow human beings, or you don't. Republicans who say this is the wrong way to do it have not proposed ANYTHING--I know what they claim, and they are as honest as John Ensign was about his sex life--better. But many of them sure are eager to go to church on Sunday and say they're Christians. I guess they never heard of the Ten Commandments.
"I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve" will be on the mind of all Democrat Representatives in Congress if they vote for ObamaCare.
House Democrats on Sunday will largely determine the votes of independents in November. It's hard to win an election without the support of independents and with the intensity of opposition working solidly against you.
Independents, even more than most Americans, strongly disapprove of ObamaCare. In June, 66 percent of independents supported President Obama. After fifteen months of Obama focusing almost entirely on health care, the same poll now shows that only 38 percent of independents support him. Even fewer of these same independents, just 29 percent approve of the Obama's handling of health care. More than twice as many, 63 percent, disapprove.
OUCH!!!
WillieTanner...thanks for the great statistics. Of course you can't expect FACTS to change the minds of faith based tea bagging idiots!
Green: http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/10/q...
Larry whined to high heaven about the wording of poll questions just a few weeks ago. Let's see if he's willing to treat everyone fairly and if he'll attack Fox, too.
"The answer may have to do with the questions Fox asks before the question on health care. This weekend, for example, Fox News put out a separate release with their health care questions -- but the health care questions weren't asked separately. Instead, they were questions #27-35 of their larger, national poll, which you can find here. And what were some of those questions? Here are a few:"
3. Do you think Barack Obama's travel and speaking schedule makes him look more like he is a candidate on the campaign trail or more like he is the president of the United States?
4. Do you think President Obama apologizes too much to the rest of the world for past U.S. policies?
5. Do you think the Obama administration is proposing more government spending than American taxpayers can afford, or not?
6. Do you think the size of the national debt is so large it is hurting the future of the country?
7. Would you rather: [ROTATE OPTIONS 1 and 2]
Cut spending now so future generations don't have to pay
Keep spending at current levels and let future generations pay
20. When Barack Obama was a candidate campaigning for the presidency, he spoke of the urgent need to finish the fight in Afghanistan, which he called the central front on the war on terrorism. Do you think that, as president, Obama is doing what it takes to win in Afghanistan?
"These questions run the gamut slightly leading to full-frontal Republican talking points. Some of them, such as question #3, are almost literally rhetorical questions, which are never good things to have on a poll. And no, you can rest assured that Fox News was not asking questions formed from comparably biased Democratic talking points."
When you ask all these baited questions before questions on health care, you skew the results. Even Larry should admit that one!
NOW, IS THIS CHANGE WE CAN BELIEVE IN???
Investors Business Daily:
"By presenting the CBO with incomplete, inaccurate and misleading data, the Democrats in Congress were finally able to come up with a cost score they like: $940 billion.
That's the estimate the CBO arrived at. Like a used car dealer pricing a car at $9,999 instead of $10,000, the hucksters in Congress were anxious to get the official cost below the scary $1 trillion level at which things suddenly sound very unaffordable.
Using the rigged $940 billion estimate, Democratic leaders now hope to force a health care bill through as early as Saturday, seizing 17% of the U.S. economy by simply "deeming" the bill is passed -- rather than actually passing it in an up-or-down vote.
In fact, the real cost of this health care takeover is more like $2.5 trillion over 10 years -- not $940 billion. That's off by, oh, 166%."
Fasten your seatbelts.... Health Care managed by the same group that brought us the wonderful Bank Bailouts!
9ballguy says "Fasten your seatbelts.... Health Care managed by the same group that brought us the wonderful Bank Bailouts!"
Good! The bank bailouts worked to fend off a depression and the Dow is up 4,000 + points. Most of the bailout money has been paid back with interest.
Turn off Faux News and read a paper ballguy.
The vast majority of drug and health insurance stocks are near 52 week highs. The smart money wouldn't be pumping billions into these companies unless the reform efforts are going to be very profitable.
These states that threaten to sue the feds get billions from the feds. Check the stats. They have millions of medicare and medicaid recipients. They will fall in line in a few weeks.
Even if reform costs $2 trillion current projections without reform reflect over $35 trillion in health spending with both medicare and medicaid rolls exploding over the next 10 years. At least everyone will be paying their share as opposed to dealing with medical bills in bankruptcy court.
You guys make it sound like healthcare is cheap and reform will make it expensive. People are trying to pay $7 billion a day now and going bust by the millions. Not exactly chicken feed.
Wow, it baffles me how the media titles it's stories. Here the title is "Pass Healthcare Reform" yet the article discuss the questionable tactics of the CBO. Could it be that the title is biased. Of course it is and I am not surprised. Is the Las Vegas Sun also in bed with Obama and Reid? Have they forgotten the treatment of Obama towards Las Vegas?
Wow Willie, I thought these forums were a place for the free and easy exchange of ideas and opinions???? So anyone who disagrees with your opinion is ill informed? Now I get It.....
If your opinion is that the bank bailouts failed, then you are ill informed or ignoring the facts. The bailout success is factual, not an opinion. If your not ill-informed, are you just ignoring the facts? No offense intended but it has to be one or the other.
Mr. Tanner:
You are full of interesting statistics. What are your sources of information?
Thank you.
PS. The bank bailout was a success in so far as it kept some money moving in the economy. Without the availability to borrow, the economy comes to a halt because revenues and costs are typically negative in direction. Credit bridges the gap.
As bad as it was, it could have been much worse and lasted much longer in the absence of the bailout. We would feel okay for about 5 minutes cutting the banks loose. Then the economy stops and we are all unemployed for the next decade.
Tanner is absolutely correct. The govt. has made billions in interest so far. Every major bank and insurance company was near total collapse. In addition there was a near run on money markets when 2 funds broke below a buck. Short term credit instruments like money markets are what back the nations payroll.
A failure of money markets would have caused many paychecks to bounce.
If healthcare works near as well as the bank rescue and the economy starts to grow Obama will win by a landslide in a few years.
Currently about 13 banks have paid back billions in TARP money.
Turrialba....If you want details type TARP into your search engine. You will have a geat night sleep if you read before you go to bed.
To see what the true CBO costs are look here;
http://fixhealthcarepolicy.com/in-the-ne...
Not $1.2 Trillion for the next 10 years but $2.3 Trillion.
Greedy republicans are already the losers here.
The lies spun by these greedy crooks are the
worst I have seen in my life.
Come November, the rest of these right-wing
crooks should be booted out of office.
gblaze...thats about 8% above cost estimates if nothing is done and u get coverage for almost the entire country...plus people with lousy employer coverage, which is nearly every non-union job can drop it and buy insurance that fits need.
If u get insurance from a non-union employer take it to someone who will understand the fine print. It is probably a policy that covers only bare minimums.
larry, your fingers are working harder than your brain.
zippert1
Its way to early to call the bailouts a success just as it is unfair to call them a failure. It is true that they kept the system functioning and as you correctly said pay checks from bouncing, we may have just been kicking the can down the road.
The government has not MADE billions in interest so far, thats just a complete fairy tale. Or maybe accounting journal entry magic, shuffling numbers from one column to another and scores of "off balance sheet" transactions we arent privy to. (see Bloomberg suite against the federal reserve regarding 2 trillion in government guaranteed, zero % interest loans they refuse to release the borrowers names, thats just one "loan") Or maybe Citi "paying back" 30 some odd billion in TARP money, which was a fantastic success story...until it was revealed the same week the treasury for gave 30 some odd billion in taxes due. (the "pay back was "just a few billion" less than the forgiven amount) just a journal entry or that the initial preferred shares have been converted to common.
Turrialb may sleep better if he googles TARP but if he researches the real cost of the bail out he may jump out a window. TARP is only the tip of the iceberg. The GOA estimates to cost and exposure to bail outs at over 4trillion and thats is kind, private estimates out it closer to 14 trillion. "Off balance sheet" transaction is where the real work is done, just like it is where the real trouble began its all behind the curtains. Hundreds of billions in zero% interest loans taken to treasury auctions to buy bonds you pay interest on and its all free to them. Many private funds have complained banks are crowding themn out with their free money.
If you think its been a certified success, just look at CITIs new derivative product and ask why they would be doing that if everything was so successful.
By the way I think your other posts are spot on, agree completely.
This is a very exciting time! We have talked about health care reform forever yet done nothing to address the issue. We are finally moving forward toward a better, more just America for all people. Yes We Can!!!! and it feels Great!