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StumbleNevada’s low taxes not always the best incentive, officials say
Ulf Buchholz / File photo
Members of the New Nevada Taskforce were told Monday that other states are more appealing to corporations than Nevada because of the incentives they are able to offer. This retail development in Henderson was one of nine large commercial projects in the valley under construction late last year.
Monday, Aug. 9, 2010 | 7:20 p.m.
John Restrepo
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Task force members
The task force represents a diverse slice of the state’s business interests. Among the members are:
Renewable energy leaders
Gaming and mining leaders
Airport heads
Education leaders
Also
Nevada has built its reputation as a low-tax haven to encourage companies to relocate their businesses here in recent years.
But low taxes alone won’t be enough to lure companies when rival states offset the low-tax advantage with economic incentives to move, a group studying the economic diversification of the state was told Monday.
John Restrepo, head of the Las Vegas-based Restrepo Consulting Group, told members of the New Nevada Taskforce, that despite the state not having a corporate income tax, a personal income tax or an inventory tax, rivals like New Mexico, Utah and Oregon are still more appealing to corporations because of the quantity and quality of the incentives they offer.
Mike Skaggs, director of the Nevada Commission on Economic Development, added that the state is outgunned budget-wise by Georgia, Indiana, Colorado and Utah, among other states.
It was the second meeting for the New Nevada Taskforce, which was formed by Lt. Gov. Brian Krolicki earlier this summer to chart a course for the state’s economic development and diversification efforts. Critics have called the formation of the 28-member task force a political ploy by Krolicki, who is up for re-election in November.
The group now has one fewer member following the death last month of former Nevada Gov. Kenny Guinn, who had told Krolicki the day before the accident that took his life that he was willing to chair the group. Guinn’s name is being left on the roster of committee members in memoriam.
The first two meetings have centered on providing background information to the group, comprised of business, government and education leaders from across the state.
In today’s session, Skaggs explained how the Commission on Economic Development operates with allied organizations and offers incentives – tax abatements and deferrals based on the number of employees hired at wages above state averages, investments in equipment and job-training programs.
Skaggs also compared Nevada’s incentive programs with those of other states. Restrepo offered case-study examples and added detail about how programs offered in Phoenix; Albuquerque; Salt Lake City; Portland and Salem, Ore., offered more to companies than those offered in Clark County and Reno.
Clark County ranked fifth behind Albuquerque, Phoenix, Salt Lake City and Reno in low operating costs and low land and facility costs, and fourth behind all but Reno in the cost of utilities and in a three-way tie for third on payroll and training costs net of incentives. Restrepo made the conclusions based on a hypothetical development of a $25 million solar product manufacturing plant in a one-story, 130,000-square-foot facility built in 2010, growing to 400 employees by 2013 and gross receipts estimated at $212 million a year and net income of 8 percent of gross receipts.
The primary reason Clark County fared so poorly: Nevada has no specific incentives targeting renewable energy manufacturers as the other states have and the Salt Lake City site came out No. 1 on taxes net of incentives.
Restrepo made similar comparisons for standard manufacturing against Oregon and California. While Clark County, Reno and Carson City fared better than Los Angeles, Sacramento, San Diego and San Jose in the analysis, Clark County was behind Salem, Portland, Carson City and Reno.
Restrepo added that incentives aren’t the only reason a company chooses to move.
“Sometimes,” he said, “it’s just a matter of it being a city that the CEO’s wife likes.”
He also mentioned that other factors such as lifestyle, education and perceptions about Las Vegas’ image as a party town can influence decisions.
Skaggs said Nevada was outspent by several states in efforts to recruit business. Georgia, led by the state’s Department of Economic Development, has a $25 million operating budget with $8.5 million dedicated exclusively to business attraction and expansion, $1.5 million for innovation and $2 million for international trade.
Indiana turned its recruitment efforts to the public-private Indiana Economic Development Corp., to replace the state’s Department of Commerce in 2005. The organization has a $37 million budget to focus on growing, retaining and attracting business.
Colorado’s Office of Economic Development and International Trade has a $40 million budget to cover six divisions, including business development, finance and tourism.
The Utah Governor’s Office of Economic Development spends $25 million a year on business, tourism and the film industry.
By comparison, Nevada’s budget is just under $5 million for economic development. Skaggs said Nevada loses most of its recruitment deals because other states have more lucrative incentive packages and companies considering a move can’t because of high real estate and relocation costs, the inability to finance new operations, the inability to attract or retain a sufficient workforce and, in some cases, higher utility costs and the lack of availability of water.
The Commission on Economic Development partners with the Nevada Development Authority in Clark County and the Economic Development Authority of Western Nevada and Northern Nevada Development Authority in Washoe County and rural counties.
The Nevada Development Authority has recruited heavily in California, taking advantage of that state’s high taxes and utility rates. Terry Shonkwiler of Shonkwiler Partners, the NDA’s contracted advertising consultant, showed the group its history of advertising campaigns placed in California.
Over the years, the NDA ads have capitalized on Gov. Arnold Schwarzeneggar’s acting career, asking “Will your business be terminated?” Other campaigns have highlighted a missing California golden bear from the state flag, a plea to “save your business from the giant California tax nut,” “California will be more pro-business when …” with a picture of a pig with wings and “Kiss your assets goodbye.”
Shonkwiler said the strategy of the campaign was to generate leveraged media – turning the ad campaign into a controversy that generates news stories the NDA doesn’t have to pay for.
With news stories generated by the New York Times, USA Today, the Los Angeles Times, CNN, CNBC and the Associated Press, Shonkwiler estimated the NDA campaign captured a TV audience of 42.7 million people, 34.5 million print impressions, 615.4 million monthly online visitors and 2.3 million radio listeners with its efforts.
The New Nevada Taskforce next meets Sept. 13.
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Gee, and republicans say that low taxes solve every woe.......DOH !
Hey Mister Restropo, the geniuses forgot one thing in their equation:
The completely crappy education system in Nevada. Bottom of the barrel.
And just HOW many students don't even speak English? Of course you really don't need English to find a tattoo parlor or a pawn shop, now do you...?
Only a company that IMPORTS its workers from more educated climes will consider this place for relocation. (that is, if the new company can keep its workers out of all-nite strip joints, away from lose-it-all gamblin' casinos, and keep 'em off the easy-buy methamphetimine dope once they arrive here)
And you say which? CEO's wife likes it here....?
Hey Mister Restrepo...(correction of spelling)
Nevada is not a low tax state: http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/...
The liberal Urban Institute and left-of-center Brookings Institution rank Nevada 22nd highest in the nation for tax revenue collection.
We have franchise fees, payroll taxes, property taxes, high sales taxes, gross receipts taxes on gaming, room taxes, entertainment taxes, property transfer taxes, taxes on your insurance premiums...
To make matters worse, Nevada's legislature keeps raising taxes and threatening to raise taxes.
Finally, offering corporate welfare is no way to attract business. It is not only unfair (favoring the politically well connected) it is unconstitutional in the Silver State:
Quoting directly from Article 8, sections 9 and 10: http://www.leg.state.nv.us/const/nvconst...
Sec: 9. Gifts or loans of public money to certain corporations prohibited. The State shall not donate or loan money, or its credit, subscribe to or be, interested in the Stock of any company, association, or corporation, except corporations formed for educational or charitable purposes.
Sec: 10. Loans of public money to or ownership of stock in certain corporations by county or municipal corporation prohibited. No county, city, town, or other municipal corporation shall become a stockholder in any joint stock company, corporation or association whatever, or loan its credit in aid of any such company, corporation or association, except, rail-road corporations[,] companies or associations.
Education is not the problem. People would move to Nevada for work. The issue is Nevada wont invest in itself. No rail, no transit, no healthcare. It is not attractive. California continues to get start up companies and Seattle as well. Actually the high tax areas of the country are home to all the best places to work.
No way Nevada will ever attract Fortune 1000 companies, or any company that has to hire educated people, to succeed. Nevada has no Education system, no infrastructure, basically nothing to offer. The guys right, only cut rate businesses would even dream of locating here. Now even the large gaming corp headquarters are leaving.
Low taxes my @ss. Car registration fees upwards of 1.5% the value of the car, sales tax of 8.1%....could go on and on and on about ways every state in the Union makes it look like they have low taxes. They make it up some other way. Nevada advertises no state income tax...big deal. They just find another way to cover the "lost" revenue.
And don't forget that our taxes at the gas pump are higher than most states -- being next door to crazy high pump-tax California only makes us "feel" as though it's not that bad...
As for fixing the educational system, no argument about the improvement we all desire. But I argue that it has been the quality (or lack, thereof) of Valley students and families which has dragged down the educational levels, in our erstwhile boom-town community. Valley parents simply treat the public schools as places to drop the kids of during the day. Kids treat school as a place to socialize, treat classes a place where they can do their busiest message-texting, and treat teachers as nuisances. Kids today can't write a sentence with a complete thought, let alone compose an acceptable, page-long paper. And math or science? HAH!
We're all competing with the best and brightest from China and India, these days, and will be, for as far as the eye can see. Today's clueless, disinterested kids, and their dopey, feckless parents are not prepared and not taking advantage of the free 12+ years of education that we, the tax-payers, already provide them. And just throwing more tax dollars at the problem will not do a thing. I studied in school in the 70's with text books from the 50's and 60's. Computers in the classroom were non-existent. All Abe Lincoln had was that weak candle-light and some old, borrowed books to learn from.
I'm no Obama/Reid basher; not going to pin this one of GOP policies, either. That kind of tribal warfare/ manure-hurling isn't helpful to any of us. I do want to emphatically say that the issue of education is not one of "more money." Until Valley kids and families WANT to compete, and WANT to train their minds so that they CAN compete, no amount of good money chasing bad will stop our swirling dance around the drain.
It's not that difficult to get thru K-12 with a B average. On to a decent college, get a degree and you have a good chance to have a good life. I'm not saying a degree is the end all for success but it sure as hell is a good start. Kids today are all about "what are they doing for me".....instead of "what can I do for me".
Dropping out of high school usually guarantees one thing. A life of poverty.
Again. As far as taxes go. There is no free ride. All states find some way to hide, cover or manipulate what you really pay. No state income tax. Great. How about $500+ to register your car every year? How about a nice 8.1% sales tax? How about a nice gas tax? Airport tax? Hotel tax? The list goes on. I've seen it a 1000 times...politicians touting their low taxes. It's one big joke perpetrated on taxpayers. There is no free lunch, or even a discounted one.
the lack of big corps is down to poor infrastructure
This is not good news for NV.
At least these corporations are not going to China.
If our politicians do not do something soon
NV.will be the #1 state for welfar.
Forget the education argument. It's all about the water. Large companies move in for the long haul and Nevadas water future sucks. Don't blame Harry Reid for this one. Nevada can never match the political clout of California and Arizona so any attempt to get more river water will never happen. It doesn't help that so many Nevada citizens stomp all over the water authority when it tries to secure more water supplies or make efforts to conserve. It's my opinion anyone buying a house in Nevada for the long haul had think of the house being worthless some time in the near future if the water problem isn't solved.
Sen Shelby of Alabama was one of the biggest critics of bailing out GM and Chrysler. Yet he failed to mention the billions of dollars of incentives spent by southern states to attract foreign auto plants and related industries. These plants were going to locate in the US anyway but our elected officials fell all over themselves throwing money at these people to influence them. When payments like these come up the free market anti-government crowd are noticeably silent. The free market people rail against government regulations, unemployment, taxes, welfare, minimum wage, etc. yet think it's perfectly OK for the free market corporations to be the biggest welfare kings. Yes there is plenty of socialism and wealth distribution going on in this country but contrary to the spin it's going to rich people and free market corporations.
what grants or incentives does las vegas or henderson have on offer for companies? small or large
It is one of the funnier things that people that are opposed to welfare for individuals are often quite okay with corporate welfare. The efforts are sometimes mixed in that states can give away as much or more than they net in revenues. With Las Vegas reputation does have a bit to do with it and it takes time change that perception. One should also not necessarily assert that the high tax states have business because of their spending. California and New York have high taxes and also very large debts, so even their high taxes are not enough. And people look at places like Silicon Valley as much because of the existing talent pool and synergy with existing companies as infrastructure. Being able to grow without having to move talent into your area can be very important. Places like Austin, TX and Albuquerque, NM are beginning to develop reputations for engineering talent pools similar to Silicon Valley.
Spending on infrastructure and education are very important but like everything else, spending needs to be done wisely. Quite often it is thought that a rail project will be a boon but frequently they do not live up to their projected usage. With education, we are usually told that the problem is that we are not spending enough money rather than that we might be spending it poorly. Hopefully the task force will come up with some reasonable proposals to move the state forward.
Its amazing that this theme is parroted all over the country on the same day. It seems that the Progressives are busy little beavers trying to break the back of the people who actually work for a living.
From the AP "Alabama's state and local taxes are the second-lowest in the nation, ahead of only South Carolina, a ranking that has its critics as well as supporters."
I lived in LV for several years and loved the weather, my huge house and no state income tax but I moved back to NYC. I will glady pay the highest taxes in the country to live here.
I wouldnt move back to LV if you gave me a free house and I paid no taxes.
LV has nothing to offer: no transportaion,lack of educated people, lack of creativity, theres no taxes but LV overcharges on everything from car registrations to concert tickets...a phony art district..Need I continue?
The government needs to realize cities are for PEOPLE to live not just for business and revenue creation. Until LV treats citizens and tourists like human beings no one is going to spend more then a few days in the middle of the dessert.
For what it's worth, I moved my small business to Las Vegas from out of state because there's no personal or corporate income tax here and because I didn't have to negotiate with anyone from the government for the zero income tax rates.
It's so much easier when the income tax policy is already set and there's no one to negotiate with.
At the time when the NDA was trying to recruit new businesses to Vegas, there was a feeding frenzy amongst casinos/developers/speculators/investors over commercial real estate. Traffic and infrastructure was at it's worst.
The bottom line is that those corporations looking to relocate to Nevada are looking for cheap dirt, cheap labor, tax breaks and other government freebies and everything else will follow. None of the aforementioned had been very true for Nevada.
With our current political climate in Carson City, I'm not very optimistic anything will be happening soon. Remember: It's not the senators job to create jobs, yet Harry Ried gets hammered for the economy and housing fiasco. Go figure!
mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, libs love their taxes.
If Nevada raises taxes, I will most likely have to shut down or move my business elsewhere. i moved here in part due to the low taxes and quick startup.
NPRI nut talkers are in a dreamland, besides defending segregation on "property rights grounds" they live in a voodoo world of economics?
taxfoundation rates Nevada number 4 in low business taxes, next to Alaska, Wyoming and South Dakota. Overall Nevada is number 2 next to Alaska for "internal" taxes. That means Nevada passes some taxes to people living in other states, (e.g. tourists)entertainment taxes, gaming taxes, gasoline taxes, liquor taxes, room taxes, etc. Alaska does the same with energy taxes. Put a tax on exported energy that people in other states pay indirectly, then rebate money to Alaskan residents and businesses.
I wonder if taxfoundation.org knows that NPRI trashes their rankings on a daily basis?
Since "Nevada is NOT a low tax state," I guess NPRI considers Gibbons and Sandoval to be "High Tax Politicians?"
Worldwide places like Denmark and Australia are ranked well in terms of employment and debt to GDP rates. States and countries that have good solid government regulation and taxes that pay for adequate infrastructure and education create a platform for a prosperous and productive society.
The NPRI's, Vin's, Sherms and Angle's philosophy produces a third world cesspool.
The SUN pointed out the false and bizarre data used by NPRI when it came to "unemployment benefits causing unemployment" - the person doing the study they relied on, said it did not apply when unemployment was at high levels.
Also Nick's analysis "of educated people moving to get a job in another state," etc...that may not be the case if someone is upside down in a house or has kids in schools they like. Relocation benefits maybe taxed as well.
Also, with two people in a household often working, the relocation decision is not that simple.
Companies like an indigenous educated workforces. Hiring from outside the area can be a hassle.
As the great Sun article points out, New Mexico is having some success with their solar and movie industry jobs programs. Nevada has lost movie production to New Mexico.
We need to raise taxes and spend money to grow the economy.
Does NPRI consider the tax break for Steve Wynn's Art Collection to be "illegal?"
Sadly, the late Governor was aware that the monopoly energy cabal in Nevada is part of the problem.
mred, excellent post.
mred,
the probable reason Nevada lost movie production is what our pinhead Governator Jim Gibbons said in 05:
"Tree-hugging, Birkenstock-wearing, hippie, tie-dyed liberals" go make their movies and their music and whine somewhere else". It's just too damn bad we didn't buy them a ticket [to become human shields in Iraq]."
Sorce:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Gibbons...
Mred, you need to come up with data of your own without cherry picking and obfuscating. I pointed to two left of center think tanks whose own data supports my position. Their data shows ALL tax collection. Your data shows just one segment of it. I also have Tax Foundation data that points to all tax collection and they rank Nevada very high as well. Finally, you need to drop the logically fallacious argument about who people are rather than the facts they present. Attack the arguments not the person.
Mred,
There should be no tax breaks. Taxes should be uniform and flat so one individual is not advantaged over another. What is illegal, is Nevada's government giving grants or loans to corporations.
And whoever thinks museums, art districts, light rail or high speed rail will save Nevada is simply an elitist who wants everyone else to pay for their own entertainment. And btw, museums and art districts are not economic development.
Mred, page 9 table 6. Nevada's total tax collection per capita ranks 25th in the Nation: http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/sr163...
As I said, you mislead, obfuscate and cherry pick your data and then follow that up with ad-hominem fallacies.
MSLV>>>>> You can have New York. As u know the highest taxes , highest prices for homes, weather,bad highways (Van Wyck ,LIE, ) New York was great 40 years ago. Now u need a dictionary to get around NYC. As for education they have the same problems as Nevada lack of qualified science and math teachers. When is the last Fortune 100 co that transferred to New York?
It has a lot to do with image. "Sin City," "Mob Museum," What Happens Here, Stays Here," "Harry Reid." What industry would want to set up shop in such a place?
When your state Senator sets his priorities based on political contributions, has helped other states get more funding for education reform and believes the department of education is a great group of talented people... yes, you can blame a lot of this on Dirty Harry.
Plus he was in on the deals that made banks loan to unqualified people, bulk up the wall street fat cats and pushes for an unstable tax system to fund ObamaCare, yes, you can blame a lot of this on the leadership that includes harry reid.
Nevada's total tax collection may rank 25th (or 23th) but that hides some important issues.
1. As was previously noted, some of the taxes are on visitors. So, the local tax burden is 49th. Given that environment, according to NPRI, businesses should be beating down NV's doorstep to set up shop (especially given the CA tax rates). The article points out one reason why they aren't. Recently, CNBC suggested that our education system might be to blame when it ranked NV 47th for business friendliness.
2. Both studies aggregate local and state taxes. If you separate them out, you'll find that the percentage of tax revenue going to state coffers ranks near the bottom nationally. I make this point because NPRI uses that 23/25th ranking to argue that state is well financed. (It isn't but local governments were prior to the recession.) Also, since Nevada gets few federal dollars (relatively speaking), a greater percentage of the state budget must be financed by local and state taxes than in other states. Hence, you can have average tax collection and below average state coffers.
It's all about image..let's see, what does Las Vegas present itself to the world as? What's the corpate saying for the past 10yrs? What are the current ad's showing? Just what every CEO wants his employees to be a part of..
Would you want your child to grow up in Las Vegas?
The opportunities for a world-class education are bountiful and abundant in every way here for those whose ambition is coquetry, glitz and shell-games.
It's the culture, stupid.
From the top down, our governor, elected leadership of all stripes and speckles have embarrassed us time and again with tales of the bizarre and whacky. The ass-grabbin, drunken sorties and bags of cash and lies, mom n dad buying off the families of the abused...
If you loved your kids, how in the world could plant them here and expect anything but plastic lemons and intoxicated genitalia to manifest?
Dazed
1) You look at state and local taxes together because some states spend more money at the local level while other states are more centralized and spend most money at the state level. It is the only way to compare states with other states.
2) Federal revenue makes up a small but growing portion of all state budgets. Some of it is poorly designed spending that is often very wasteful. Often programs where we have matching grants (state spends more, government sends you more) are such wasteful programs -- it becomes more about chasing federal dollars than actually providing a quality service"
3)Any tax dollar taken from a visitor is a dollar that cannot be spent in a store, restaurant, casino etc. The more we take from visitors the more we retard our economic growth in areas frequented by visitors. Thus you are literally taking income from these areas"ie, don't think that the tourists are paying these taxes, we technically are paying it with them in the form of slower growth, lower incomes and higher unemployment rates than we otherwise would have.
new flag
49 bright stars & one BLACK HOLE!
Dazed, there are also lots of other factors businesses consider when moving. Sure they consider subsidies (but that is only as good as the subsidy lasts and as soon as the capital values fall enough they're out of town. Most of the time you're just stealing income from one part of town and shuffling to another creating no economic growth at all. Business do not care about art parks and light rail (unless they're building government subsidized condos and shopping malls). And frankly we've seen a lot of growth in economic diversity that, isn't reported.
Even looking at Moody's data (January Nevada Vision Stakeholders group handout) I can see Nevada's had more growth in economic diversity than Florida, Utah and Hawaii (the only comparison states they provided). Las Vegas also seems to tie Orlando and Atlantic city in diversification growth and beat Myrtle Beach and Honolulu. Reno beats them all.
Been to Reno lately, Gibber?
Except for Hot August Nights, the streets are empty - the casinos and motels and restaurants all shutters and graffiti.
Empty casinos that are still open.
Even the tattoo places are closing up.
Half the people upside down in mortgages.
And of course the reflection in the NPRI quoted statistics are a healthy booming economy. Robust, when the winds blow the rubble to dust.
Reno beats them all LMAO NPRI LOL
http://www.bls.gov/eag/eag.nv_reno_msa.h...
Gosh, what you say and what I smell are so different?
Maybe the difference between a walk on the streets and a glance at a number from an ivory tower.
It all boils down to what do corporations look for when opening a new venue?
Are favorable state taxes the #1 issue?
As we all know corporations can get anything they want with the lure of jobs. When Boeing moved their headquarters to Chicago there was 48 states offering them the world. And they used that to their every advantage.
What does Nevada have to offer...that every other state does not have? Gambling and fun? Which I agree they do have.
If they are going to open a factory, they want cheap labor. That is why they go to China. Do you want a corporation to insist on slave wages, which would basically affect every one's wages? They also like lax environmental laws. Do you want poison in your drinking water?
I live in Chicago so I got no dog in the fight.
But I do love LasVegas as my sister lives there and I visit her once a month. Maybe tourism is not such a bad thing and you have been doing very well with it for quite a while.
IT'S ALL UP TO YOU!
If low taxes are the deciding factor, why is it that states with higher taxes seem to attract businesses and we don't? I wonder what the reason could be. Hmmm maybe being 49th or 50 [at the bottom] in education, business amenities, roads, infrastructure, other transportation options, lack of investment in anything not gaming-related.
Just a drive around town and seeing the state of our streets [barely paved], our street lights [often out for months], terrible schools, and yes politicians who brag about how they are going to cut back even further--even up to 50% of the current expenditures. So a poor business climate, no plan to improve it, and a promise to be even worse in the future. I bet business people are running to that.
Patrick,
Thanks for your thoughtful comments.
Your points on the inefficiencies of chasing federal dollars and the reasons for aggregating state and local taxes may be true. But, neither addresses my point. NPRI uses the 23/25 ranking to argue that the state budget is well funded (or funded at the average).
But, when you separate out local funding and the percentage of the state budget financed by federal dollars, the state budget has well below average funding. (For example, the Brookings Institute study that you cite says that NV gathered 10.4 billion in taxes in 2007; as you know, much less than half of that went to the state general fund.) Again, local governments have been well financed; the state government isn't and hasn't been.
Your point on taxes has a little more merit but I'm afraid it sidesteps my point. If NV ranks 49th with respect to the direct tax burden that citizens face, businesses should want to set up shop here. Now some service oriented businesses may feel the economic effects of sales taxes in terms of lost potential revenue, but many of the businesses that NV wants (and needs) won't. They face minimal levels of direct taxation (esp. compared to neighboring states). Why aren't they here? I'm afraid that NPRI's answer isn't very strong on that point.
I can't speak to the Moody's data but assume that it is specific to growth in diversity. If your economy isn't very diversified to begin with, growth in diversity isn't hard to achieve. That said, you won't get very far trying to argue that Nevada's economy is diversified relative to other states.
The taxfoundation's 25th ranking for Nevada is considering the "external taxes" that Nevada passes on to tourists, gas taxes, gaming taxes, room taxes, etc. Taxfoundation.org has Nevada ranked 4th, next to Alaska, South Dakota, and Wyoming for business taxes, and 2nd in terms of "internal" taxes next to Alaska.
NPRI regurgitators, people that belch out Cato and Heritage talking points the way people would quote from Mao's "little red book," are in the business of warping statistics. They don't allow others to challenge their VIEWS on THEIR WEBSITE, but they come over to the Sun's website to spread their lies and distortions. This is because their statistics are wrong.
Look at the NPRI tax proposal: Put a tax of food, so that a poor person would have to pay extra on a gallon of milk. At the same time, a person buying a multimillion dollar imported yacht would be given a lower overall sales tax rate. So the poor person pays 10 cents more in taxes on their milk, and the imported yacht buyer saves $30,000 in sales taxes on their purchase. Gee, that is really "white" of you guys.
It really shows the elitism and arrogance for Patrick Gibbons of the NPRI to come over to the Sun's website and try to define the rules. As mentioned, their website is sanitized of any opinions but their own.
So tax everyone to subsidize specific, politically connected industries. Mr. Restrepo, step away from the Kool-Aid.
Thanks to mred and dazed and confused, readers get a common sense approach to the need for NV to change it's direction and policies.
The constant mantra of those who believe that all NV has to do is cut even more taxes which continue to erode the essential services required to attract a diversified industrial base has over the years proven wrong for NV. That's why NV is at the bottom of every quality of life measurement used to attract businesses.
Most of the research including this article is not asking for an across the board increase in the tax base. What has been suggested by the research is to diversify and to broaden the tax base. Make them fair. No longer should the major corporations be exempt from paying their fair share. There are companies in NV today that pay no gross profits or corporate taxes. That leaves the rest of us to carry their load in one form of tax or levy.
Why not try it? Our Governor's policy has already proven that his policies of "no taxes, at any cost," has failed this state and is an obstacle for growth.
No one will tell you they want more taxes. What most people want is a fair broad based tax structure where every segment of the economic structure is paying their fair share and the taxes collected are working for their interests and can be accounted for.
NV will never be able to compete in the modern era if it continues to follow the path defined by Patrick-R- Gibbons.
If the taxes and life suck so bad here in Nevada, why in the hell are these people posting on this site living here? Go move to another state where the taxes are lower and life is better. We won't miss you!
Being preoccupied with stealing companies away from California and other states is an unhealthy distraction for Nevada. Sure, I'll welcome any transplant with open arms. The more jobs, the merrier. But trying to fight a zero-sum game with California is a fool's errand. It's something Oscar Goodman wastes time on. Nevada needs to develop ORGANICALLY. We need are own bright young minds staying in Nevada after they graduate from school, and making their own startups. Silicon Valley used to be sleepy suburbs and farmland, until bright minds graduating from Stanford and Berkeley started tinkering around in their parent's garages. Pittsburgh was a burned-out, decaying shell of its old, steel mill industrial self. But start-up companies and their spin-offs that fed from the next generation of bright minds graduating from Pitt, Carnegie-Mellon, Duquense, etc., built a modern economy of medical instrument manufacturers, hi-end plastics manufacturers, and health services.
I ripped Oscar Goodman above, but I'll praise him for his effort of trying to have the University of Pittsburgh's Medical Center open and operate a teaching hospital here in Vegas. Our Valley remains one of the premier retirement destinations of the nation and making this valley a pre-eminent center for senior health care services would be a tremendous boost to our community. Instead of the current practice, whereby anybody with the means goes *away* from Vegas for quality health care, people from across the nation, and beyond, might someday come to Las Vegas for advanced medical treatment. Similarly, UNLV is a very poor educational institution *now.* But most recently, I've met some very bright, enthusiastic kids who turned down acceptance to Stanford, John Hopkins med school, and the like, to take advantage of the Millennium Scholarship. Now if we can just get these kids to stick around and work/create locally, after they graduate. The private sector is the primary engine of growth in the American economy. But the two above examples are instances where government can and should partner with private efforts. Failure is not an option for Nevada. We MUST mature and develop organically. Nobody is going to hand us anything.
Japan and Germany were once noted for cheap ersatz products, times have changed. Look at Korean Cars, big improvement. So Nevada can gain respect in solar technology, while still having tacky tourism.
The notion of "no government" pushed by Angle, doesn't work. Singapore, Switzerland, etc. have plenty of government, grow-up and join the first world.
Chazbean:
LOL. Did you think I was talking about High Schools? When I mentioned education I meant higher education; like NYU, CUNY, SUNY, Columbia, Hofstra, Fordam... LV has UNLV. Lets not mention UNLVs budget cuts!
You get what you pay for thats why prices are higher here, New Yorkers also make more money so I guess it balances out. As for the winter, I'll be in Miami.
Good luck with the economy!
@mslv
Very true what you've said. Although on the educational side, the thing about Las Vegas is that companies here need to make money, and they need people who can do that for them as soon as possible. Whereas in other cities corporations will demand college degrees from job applicants, Vegas prefers actual experience. Vegas wants people who are already proven to get the job done, rather than simply people who have a degree with no actual experience. So for a middle class person, Vegas can be a great thing. HOWEVER, it's not a long-term place to stay. 10 years tops is all I'd recommend. Once you get in some great experience here in a related field, move somewhere else and live out your life, career, and go back to college there. Technical positions are far easier to get in Vegas than other cities, so you can get that job experience in, and take it back with you. Plus when you go back for your education after having established yourself, you don't have the high student loan debts that so many others do.
Like you say, the arts and culture here is a complete joke. Our culture here is totally manufactured like the facades of the hotels. There are some real things like the old mines and ghost towns outside of town. And the little scraps of heritage we had from 1906 until about 1980 or so. But in the 90's, that all got bulldozed away with the crowning achievement of destroying Helldorado. We literally have nothing now. And as for contemporary entertainment, there is nothing to do here at all. You can only hike the same trails, and hit the same fishing spots so often. Gambling is the most boring thing in the world. Although I'm glad to see I'm not the only person who has noticed that whenever an entertainer or musicians come to town, Las Vegas gets price-gouged for no reason. I'd rather drive to Los Angeles or Phoenix to attend a concert than see it here in Vegas. It's cheaper, and the performances are always better. Like George Carlin once said that when performing on the road, the audience really wants to be there, but in Vegas it's just a passing thought to see someone simply to kill boredom, or because they got comped tickets for some reason, versus actually wanting to attend the same show.
Just a thought, and I'm not even sure I agree with myself here, but...
Efforts to emulate California, Utah, etc will get us nowhere, as we will NEVER be quite as good in whatever quality is being measured. We need to build on what we have -- entertainment, gaming, sin -- and milk it for all its worth. Not just push the envelope, but shred it! Make the strip and downtown a mix of Hollywood, Broadway, Spring Break, Mardi Gras, and Amsterdam all rolled into one. And make it cheap for out-of-staters to get here -- then encourage them to spend freely while they're here. We will never be Silicon Valley -- but we sure as h*** can be THE #1 wild a** place to go and party or hold a convention! Let the Mormons have Utah and the Socialists have California -- you know where they'll come to let loose!
Trying to boil down corporate relocation decisions to a single factor is an oversimplification of the issue, but empirical data don't lie: companies are not coming to Nevada.
After numerous conversations with high-ranking executives at companies like Raytheon and other manufacturers who have chosen to operate in other states, I believe Nevada faces two major obstacles:
First, education is inadequate. Employers of skilled workers need local talent; Nevada has cut UNLV's budget by 31% over the past three years. Educated employees demand high-quality K-12 schools for their children; our schools consistently rank in the lowest quintile of public education. If we continue to undervalue education, employers won't come.
Second, the Las Vegas culture is unattractive to many corporations. Our city has a national reputation of being dirty, immoral, corrupt, and about obfuscating what goes on here. What kinds of companies want to be associated with that kind of reputation? Also, what kinds of parents with kids want to raise children here? -- Although the reality is that many wonderful people and families live in Vegas, the global stigma is one that is not family friendly.
Las Vegas and Nevada chose to embrace tourism and the "what happens here" perception. When you pick up that end of the stick, you also get the negative consequences of being called Sin City. Nevadans need to either live with the current economic situation or seek to diversify their economy by changing their image.
I think the Taskforce is going in the right direction. Any Business will do Preliminary Research before moving to a new location, including checking the Ratings of the States most recomended to be moved to by Independent Research.
This might leave Nevada in the dust, so as any good Salesman knows , besides all the obvious crieteria of Schools, Transportation, Civic Endevours , and all , the Taskforce would proactively seek out Businesses of the kind that would suit Clark County and Nevada overall, to the Benifit of both the Business and Clark County and Nevada , i.e. Solar , for which Nevada is particularly suited , and a mutually taylored agreement can be made for the Busineses to move to Nevada, and that is about all it takes , to "get" new Business to move here , and is a step in the right direction by the Taskforce.
This guy is a retard... seriously?
Yeah, let's start "downplaying" Las Vegas' reputation as a party town.
Sounds like a real winner of an idea there.
Nevada could be the business center of the world if it wanted to be, but nobody in Carson has the guts or lack of union puppet strings to ever allow that to happen.
nevada does not have low taxes, we have a problem and the solution is easy;
1. Time is soooon to be here that HUGE decisions will be made because we have the largest budget shortfall in the U.S. and by a factor of 3 times the national average. Most money is spent on people and pensions so the wh0res who sold out Nevada to the unions will have to admit the gravy train stops here. The state will no doubt steal $ from the cities and counties and those wh0res will have to admit to the public unions that the gravy train stops here.
There are easy ways to fix this problem but it takes brains and not arrogence.
I could explain the simple fix for revenues but U will never get there if U can not start w/ salaries, pensions, illegas and the wh0re politicians
BANKRUPTSY must be decared, all gov. employees contracts and pensions must be nullified.
public employees need to be fired en mass and rehired at the national average (no execeptions)
NV needs a law for illegals like Arizona as those illegas are on the move and coming here
We are 3 billion short and loose at least 1 billion because of illegals alone, if u can't start with the obvious u will NEVER get there
Geezus, krolicker and gibbons and your legislature have done Nevada so proud. You can thank you fellow Nevadan's stupidity for this fiasco. Hopefully your not one of the horsford reid, sandoval and or r&R kind of voters. Good God Nevada!
The "lack of culture/lack of quality education" vs. "move Nevada up the economic food chain" argument is a chicken vs. egg dilemma: which begets which? I say, start making improvements wherever we can. Any improvement in one area will make improvement easier in others. We have to crack the vicious cycle of having nothing begetting nothing.
As for Vegas sticking with it's tried and true "Vegas" formula -- no reason we have to abandon it. But also, no reason it should remain the only game in town. Those arguing to diversify the economy (and I've been in this camp, on this forum, for a loooong time) are correct. Casinos are EVERYWHERE throughout the U.S. and abroad, now. Fine dining and headlining stars appear at venues across the nation (and for less money than here). The Vegas experience is mostly living on its reputation. No reason to kill it off, but belief that it will ever again pay the bills by itself is gravely mistaken.
Please pardon any apparency of ever intending to break the law, but viewing our bleak landscape and bleaker futures from here, I must to admit to having evil thoughts, father, forgive me as I sin before thee.
I envision a renaissance in Vegas, a pent up splurge of visitors. They'll gawk at the strip, applaud at the shows and tip at the restaurants. They'll pay the taxes again.
One new tax is the one they came for. Let's count our blessings and survey our roots: gambling, liquor, prostitution, cheap rooms, cheap food, tax here, tax there, tax the going and coming.
They'll pay all the old taxes and this new one: the $50 an ounce on the best legal pot in the world.
Smoke our way back to healthy real estate values, jobs, schools, futures as the party capital of the world.
What are our options, fellow state dwellers where the gold is going fast, the silver's gone, but TARNISH still sells?
WHY is it every article, no matter the subject, someone has to mention: mexicans, illegals, obama, reid, angle, bush, whomever.. yes, I get that some of those things may pertain to this particular peice, but really people, keep it legit..
Corporations/Business's have employees that have families. Those families want to live where there is a quality education system, a quality health care system, a quality infrastructure. and low crime.
Nevada has none of those.
Until Nevada starts investing in the future there will not be any large business location to NV.
There are a number of business opportunities in NV for start up companies such as warehousing of goods for serving large metro areas in the this regional area, a credit card company that caters to those with good credit with low rates, solar and wind manufacturing plants, a west coast fashion center, a major insurance company, a trolley car manufacturing company, etc...
All NV has to do is take the first step.
The rich and very rich in NV could start a mutual fund or Corporation that would evaluate potential ventures and go for it.
<When Boeing moved their headquarters to Chicago there was 48 states offering them the world. And they used that to their every advantage.>
mgmHarley:
I was living in Chicago at this time (prior to moving to Vegas) and remember that one of the reasons Boeing moved their headquarters there was because the City and the area had so much to offer: an actual public transportation system, abundant housing, excellent schools, culture. It was an all-around place to relocate to even though they did get those tax breaks. Vegas would never be able to entice a company such as Boeing to move there.
PS Refresh my memory - did they not move to the suburbs? It seems like so long ago.....