flashpoint:

The pot folks are back. And they come bearing, once again, facts

Thursday, Sept. 24, 2009 | 2 a.m.

The pot folks are back. And they come bearing, once again, facts. This time they have offered $10,000 to anyone who can refute three statements about marijuana being safer than alcohol. Those three, according to Dave Schwartz of The Marijuana Policy Project, are that alcohol is “significantly more toxic” than pot, that “health effects from long-term alcohol consumption cause tens of thousands of more deaths in the U.S. annually than the health effects from the long-term consumption of marijuana” and, and, and ... he forgot the third one. Just kidding, potheads. The third was that those intoxicated by drink commit more violent crimes than those high on smoking grass. I bet Schwartz keeps his money.

Discussion: 7 comments so far…

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By POWERPLAY

Sept. 24, 2009

8:57 a.m.

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Potheads: Some people just don't grow up in life! Marijuana is a gateway drug also most of these people are just plain lazy not at all motivated to get a real job and pull there own weight in life. These people that agree with this stupid lifestyle are also the same people that fear law-abiding citizens carrying concealed handguns when those people are stone cold sober. This drug crowd needs to get there priorities in order life is just to short.
By Patrick_R_Gibbons

Sept. 24, 2009

9:15 a.m.

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Power, alcohol is actually the gateway drug, more people seem to pick up smoking (tobacco and marijuana because of it). But I bet Schwartz does keep his money.
By NLV-Indep13

Sept. 24, 2009

10:05 a.m.

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It'd be an interesting study -- I'm surprised no one's done an impartial comparison on toxicity and long term health impact. I'll bet the data's out there, it just needs to be found and a comparison made. But I won't bet on which is less damaging.

As to violent crime, again I'm surprised that no one's done an impartial comparison study unless law enforcement doesn't collect the data (which I would think they would; if someone's arrested for a violent crime and they're suspected of being "under the influence", aren't they routinely tested?) But on this I would definitely bet on the drunk being more prone to violence than the stoner. Most stoners just don't seem to get all that agitated, whereas a "drunken brawl" is relatively common.

Regarding marijuana being a gateway drug, I would agree. Alcohol & tobacco are as well. And IF marijuana is more so, the question is why? It might simply be because it's illegal, and once someone crosses that line, going further doesn't seem like such a big deal. In which case the more appropriate societal response might be to move the line.

Finally, the marijuana prohibitionists seem to ignore the reality that their efforts have failed and failed miserably -- at considerable cost. Legalizing & regulating might be a more effective solution in controlling usage.

American society has drawn a line that says alcohol & tobacco are okay (with warnings), marijuana & other drugs are not. Should independent study indicate that marijuana is, overall, no worse than alcohol or tobacco, than it would seem logical to apply the same social controls on it. So, prohibition & pot advocates, pool your money & hire a reputable research organization to conduct the study so we can all put the issue to bed!
By Patrick_R_Gibbons

Sept. 24, 2009

10:58 a.m.

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NLV Ind

I believe the federal government has done a toxicity study and so have other legit medical research facilities. They've found nothing. In most cases, from what I've seen, they've recommended legalization it (especially for medical purposes). I do believe the Federal government still runs a medical experiment using marijuana and provides mj free for those patients to great effect. I bet that MJ think tank has links to those studies if you can find their website.
By blackvegas

Sept. 24, 2009

11:29 p.m.

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The more I think about it, maybe we should decriminalize marijuana and outlaw alcohol.
By tensity1

Sept. 25, 2009

3:42 a.m.

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Those lazy potheads! Oh grow up! They're ALL SLACKERS! The imminent downfall of society is upon us because of these reefer smokers!!! Powerplay, try to not buy into the stereotypes and propaganda. Make a real argument based on logic and facts instead of conjuring bogeymen.

The only gateway there is is prohibition. Correlation is not causation, otherwise water, then milk, then aspirin, etc. lead to alcohol, tobacco, and other substance use. If there's any reason people move to harder substances from another, it's either something innate in their personality, or because they're exposed to black market forces that aren't regulated--either way, these people need treatment (maybe), and they shouldn't have to be exposed to a black market. Drug use (licit or illicit) should be for health policy, not police, unless you trust the judgement of police with all of their med school training. Parents, worried about your kids and gateways? Then demand the end of prohibition as policy, because it's been an utter failure in protecting your kids, and it's also been about a trillion dollar sinkhole since its inception. Prohibition is giving up control, not the opposite. Legalization is not a free-for-all, but actually taking control and responsibility by regulating. Dealers don't card.

All the truth and information is out there, if people are able to stop being afraid and buying into the misinformation of the illogical, hypocritial moralists and prohibitionists. Pot doesn't contribute significantly to violence or traffic accidents, it has negligible health effects on chronic users (and no, no lung cancer, and it can actually ward off lung and other cancers, even if smoked). If you want self-serving lies, remember to follow the money and the ever-present desire of people to impose their will on others. Pot was prohibited because of racism and financial concerns early last century (after being cultivated for industrial and medicinal use for a couple hundred of years in the US, by decree of law, even by our founding fathers). Nixon ignored his own commission on pot (and previous ones) that said it was relatively harmless to society because he wanted to persecute hippies and minorities. Tapes don't lie. Anyway, I could go on, but it's up to you to wake up. Here's some resources to get started:

www.mpp.org
www.saferchoice.org
www.leap.cc (Law Enforcement Against Prohibition)
www.norml.org
www.drugpolicy.org

Check out these books (with links to Amazon):

Marijuana Myths Marijuana Facts: A Review of the Scientific Evidence

http://www.amazon.com/Marijuana-Myths-Fa...

Marijuana is Safer: So Why Are We Driving People to Drink?

http://www.amazon.com/Marijuana-Safer-Dr...
By rol1

Jan. 21, 2010

1:21 p.m.

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I love it when some drug warrior who's job qualifications consists of pissing in a cup talking about;

"Potheads: Some people just don't grow up in life! Marijuana is a gateway drug also most of these people are just plain lazy not at all motivated to get a real job and pull there own weight in life. These people that agree with this stupid lifestyle are also the same people that fear law-abiding citizens carrying concealed handguns when those people are stone cold sober. This drug crowd needs to get there priorities in order life is just to short."

http://tinyurl.com/Microtags can tag all controlled substances and are to be used nation wide in a couple of years to stop counterfeit drugs in the US market. All cigarettes, beer, prescription drugs, and even recreational drugs can be tracked and if found in possession of minors could be used to take their provider to task.

And as far as lazy, I'd like to get Mr. PowerPlay in a concrete pour and see if he can work a real job.

And if stupid lifestyle means that I'm not stupid enough to have my retirement invested into projects that are "value added" by the drug war, that become valueless without tax dollars paying for their enforcement, so be it.

And I don't think that very many pro-legalization are against gun ownership. Most gun control advocates ARE drug warriors.