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twitterLetter to the editor:
Illegal immigrants receive free care now
Thursday, Sept. 24, 2009 | 2:02 a.m.
Ah, summer is finally over! But the heated debate about health care reform continues.
Shouts of anger and name-calling by those who are for or against the reform continue to reverberate on main streets, in town-hall meetings and even on the floor of Congress.
One of the main issues of the proposed reform is the question about illegal immigrants. Most agree that they should be excluded. For politicians who agree with this, Republican or Democratic, it makes for a good sound bite and it will get them votes — but it’s not realistic. And I think the illegal immigrants think they should be excluded also.
Why would they want to be included? Why waste money on insurance premiums, which could be as high as a couple of thousand dollars per month, when they are getting their medical care now for free? Well, free for them but not for the insured who pay extra to cover the uninsured, and taxpayers who subsidize the county hospitals.
So, the question is: Should we really exclude illegal immigrants in the reform? Do you think excluding them, which actually means ignoring them, will make the problem go away?
Unless we have mass deportation of the estimated 12 million illegal immigrants, and change the policy that requires hospitals to provide care regardless of the patient’s ability to pay, the problem is not going away.
Maybe we should rethink our approach and include them in our health care reform. Why not make them help pay for their health care? Just think how much money we will save on our insurance premiums. And taxpayer money now being spent on their health care will be available for other purposes.
I’m struggling to pay for my own health care and I don’t think I should be paying for others’ care, do you?
Discussion: 53 comments so far…
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I like your idea of a mass deportation of all
the illegals. Finally a solution that I can endorse.
I'm with just_mike. Send them home for their free health care.
Our Government, past & present, Republican & Democrat, have allowed the invasion of 20 to 30 million criminals and uneducated peons which is the largest invasion of any Nation, at any time, by any means & in direct violation of Article IV, Section IV of our Constitution.
This refusal to abide by our Constitution or enforce our Immigration Laws should be classified as Treason of the most foul kind, & as grounds for impeachment & trials for Treason!
Not only have they allowed the invasion, they force American tax payers to pay Billions on Billions of dollars to provide Welfare, Prison cells, Educate the invaders numerous children, and free medical care, at the same time the invading horde break numerous laws and massive document fraud, & are destroying our schools, hospitals, communities, culture and standard of living while Robbing, Raping, Killing & Assaulting American Citizens WAKE UP PEOPLE!
Pyrostavo-
Another post which I can endorse. May I
suggest that with the mass deportation of the Illegals, we include all the politicians both national
and statewide with them.
We can then start all over with new elections and possibly get politicians that will
represent the People instead of their own personal agenda.
To include any illegal immigrant in any bill written by a member of the Senate or the House would be adding stepping stones to their pathway to citizenship.
Which other federal lawbreakers get their crimes absolved and at the same time get more rights as an american citizen?
I guess being an elected official of our government allows these politicians to get away with breaking our own laws and at the same time not enforcing our own laws on the books. The only problem we have with illegal immigration is our government not upholding our laws and protecting our citizens.
Call out for our federally elected officials to enforce our laws. Make the use of e-verify a law for existing employees and for any person applying for any job. Once our job market is not available to any illegal they will deport themselves at their own expense.
i think all of our elected leaders who support illegal immigration and allow billions of taxpayer money to support the illegal aliens should lose their political seat. Do they not take a vow to uphold the laws of the land???
funny thing...
if we don't pass health care reform...
and the cost of health care doubles every 7 years...
in short order...
we will all be going to mexico for medical care...
because that is the only place we will be able to afford it!!!
There are 13 million American kids living in poverty, 15 million unemployed American workers looking for jobs to feed and shelter their families, 15 million underemployed American workers looking to make ends meet with part time jobs. Wall Street has been bailed out and can still smoke their $50 cigars, but the pain and suffering of Main Street Americans goes on and on, while 8 million lawbreaking illegal aliens hold jobs that would alleviate that suffering. Right now there are new college graduates taking farm jobs to make ends meet in our lousy economy. Deport every last illegal alien and take care of hurting Americans now.
Good point.
When a comment was called out, "You lie!" during a presidential speech, much fuss was made without journalists following the real story: What did you mean? What is the lie?
The lie is probably that nothing is set up to change health care for illegal immigrants. What's to stop them from continuing to have millions spent on their care at our emergency rooms? And so, implying that they won't get care under a reformed system is a lie unless that care becomes forbidden - which we all know it won't be. I am sorry for these people, but not sorry to the point where I feel the American people should be supporting them to the degree that's been happening for years.
If you can't afford children, don't have them. That's something the U.S. needs to address through policy - and don't blame Democrats. The Republicans think every sex act should be/ is guided by God, and if a child results, then so be it: punishment for those who have sex and can't afford children. How weird. The problem is that millions of impoverished children punishes the innocent children as well as all the rest of us.
If you have to rely permanently on the government to support your children, then your children need to be taken from you until you can afford them. A helping hand through a crisis is one thing, but there are people who have children knowning dang well that they will immediately apply for free food, free health care, etc., and continue to rely on it until the kids are finally kicked off at legal adult age. So this craziness is not just an illegal alien problem. The question is, what are we going to do?
Anyone here in this country illegally - from ANYWHERE in the world - should be deported. It's a tough call when they're violent criminals held in our prison system because they'll just come back and do it again.
Gunowners4Obama: you're treading on sacred soil when you say people shouldn't have kids if they can't afford them. You're going get shouted down and insulted for it.
However, I wholeheartedly agree with you and even take it a step further - too many parents AREN'T CAPABLE of being parents. They let the kids do whatever they want with excuses like "I can't control them" or "They should be free to express themselves" or "If I try to discipline them, they call the cops on me." I have more compassion for the man who slapped that noisy kid in a Wal-mart because parents are letting their kids act like wild animals everywhere - from banks to stores to restaurants to neighborhoods.
Our health care system has progressed to the point that only the affluent and lucky can afford it. The rest of us? SUFFER!
Simple minds, lol. Come on people. The problem is way past the simplest of solutions. The borders should have been closed long ago, but we didn't and now the problem is too large to solve easily.
First of all, it's operationally impossible to deport every illegal. Secondly, you can't build a wall along the entire US-Mexico border, most of which is barren desert in BFE, and they'll just come right back over.
Thirdly, and most importantly, these illegals that you hate so much have been here so long now, that they are now a very very important cog in our capitalistic society. Remove the illegals from the workforce and watch prices on everything explode. That head of lettuce will not be $1 anymore. That room at Bellagio won't be $300 anymore. On down the line.
I look at it like a necessary evil at this point. And let's face it, not one of you whiners would be willing to take a min. wage job picking lettuce or oranges, etc. in the hot sun all day long. That min. wage employee just turned into a $20-hr. employee. And we all know what that will do to the retail price of goods, right?
Methinks the same people crying about illegals now are also the same people that would be crying about the increased cost of goods and services as a result of removing illegals from the workforce.
If you accept the premise that the majority of illegals are in low paying jobs or unemployed, including them in an expanded medicare will not lower anyone's premiums or costs. If they had the money to pay to begin with, many of our hospitals wouldn't be in the fix they're in.
While there may be too many to deport, concrete steps need to be taken to reduce the demand. Secure the border, Real ID, eVerify & employer fines, to start.
And there are no jobs Americans won't take -- they just won't do them at slave wages. The additional labor costs associated with paying fair wages would have a minimal impact on the price of food at the grocery store, as the bulk of the cost pays for non-labor production costs (land, machinery, etc), processing, & handling. And the modest price increase in food would be offset by reduced social welfare costs.
Can you be so ignorant Eleu?
Illegal immigrants don't receive "free health care". How do they receive it? If they receive, citizen of the U.S. should receive more!
Are you trying to say these people benefit more than you? Wrong.
It's called the Emergency Room. I know, it happens but they're not receiving more than the average American.
Joe Wilson was actually wrong when he lied. That ignorant fool. Check this site to debunk his claims..
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/...
In fact, Illegal Immigrants aren't going to be covered, get your facts straight people! Stop listening to Dumb Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, and Glenn Beck! They know nothing of politics and aren't political scientist to make their bogus claims valid (unreliable sources).
If we take the Emergency Room out and do not provide to anyone regardless of their legal status, it's a violation of a basic human right. At that point, we'll be worse than any communist nation Republicans always babbler about by not providing an emergency service to anyone.
You are clearly misinformed.
Solution:
Require each employer to use a system to verify each employee's indentity and SSN.
Employers can be exempt from the above if they pay a $5,000 fee per employee.
The money from the fees will be used to support auditing of employers that they say they are using verification system.
Also the money from the fees can be used to reimburse hospitals, schools, cops, prisons, etc that spend money because of illegals.
Anyone with half a brain knows that MALDEF will pay off some crooked federal judge who will then issue a ruling that illegals are have a right to the same healthcare that Americans have. Remember Prop 187 in California when that crooked Judge Pfelzer threw out the votes of millions of Californians? I wonder how much she got paid for that one? Probably enough for a good luxury retirement.
Millions of lawbreaking illegal aliens were deported by President Eisenhower! Deporting all 12 to 40 million illegal aliens is no big deal. Mandate E-Verify for every employer and the criminal greedy ones will stop hiring them. Build the border fence, finally, 8 years after 9/11. Get rid of useless Napolitano and increase interior enforcement and they will self deport by the millions, freeing up jobs for Americans. Give emergency care for medical emergencies, stabilize and deport. The 1986 amnesty was a travesty and total failure! Never again!
mr. meow you may be right that in Obamas' speech he claimed that the bill had no provision for illegals to get any medical care provided by the bill.
However what you may not know is that Dean Heller put SAVE(a safeguard put into the bill to verify each persons citizenship, similar to e-verify) into the bill and since Joe Wilson was the only House member who read the bill, he was the only one who realized that SAVE was taken out of the bill.
If Obama and the rest of the House were aware that SAVE was taken out of the bill, they sure kept their yappers quiet.
By the way, by that Friday, some how SAVE was put back into the bill.
How about mass importation of illegals. Then conscript them to invade Mexico and they would them be legals.
I'm aware Fremmasmind, but you can't deny emergency care to anyone that's worst than anything else.
Many of you are stating that illegals have to be deported in a normative point of view rather than empirical.
Thing is, it's not going to happen. They've got American Citizen children and they'll be back. You can't beat that.
What happened to "Proud to Be An American"? These people are American, Latin American. Just legalize these folks so they could earn a decent living and pay taxes just like the rest of us.
And lets bring up people from Central and South America... We are all Americans. How about the Canadians. Are they Americans???
Vegasvampire your statement tells me that you believe in biting your own throat. Will you be the first to give your job to an illegal?
It's way past due with the immigrant problem in terms of getting a complete handle on it....The horse may already be out of the barn...
Common sense tells us that we can't deport 18-20 million illegal's, but we can work toward closing our borders. I believe most American want that very thing..
We should greatly discourage American businesses from hiring illegal's. Simply fine those businesses that hire illegal's and that alone will solve much of the problem....
Fewer jobs and many/most of the illegal's will go home. There will also be fewer illegal's entering the country..
I personally believe that we should double or even triple the number of legals that we allow to come into the country each year. Those applying for entry into the country, who have special skills, should go to the front of the line.....
That may sound cruel, but in terms of what is best for our economy, that's the way to go...
USA TODAY ran a story this last week concerning the number of foreign students who leave this country once they complete their education. At one time, almost 80% of the foreign students who were educated in this country chose to stay in the country and live and work here.
The numbers are now down around 50%.
Many of these well educated and talented foreign students are going back home (India & China leads the way) to work and live. It's fast approaching a "brain drain" situation for the good ole USA.
How much longer can we continue to lose talented foreign students that we educate to other countries? To a certain degree, we have invested money in them and to lose them is watching money walk out the front door....
We can already see that very thing happening with the number of American jobs lost to points off-shore. The billions & billions of dollars that we spend on foreign oil also contributes to the loss of American wealth... Last year we spent approximately $750 billion on imported oil..For the most part, that's money leaving the country....
Why is getting rid of the illegals so complicated? It really isn't. We prohibit any government services to anyone who is not here legally. We deny citizenship to any brat who's parents are not here legally. We make it a felony for any employer to hire any person who cannot document that he/she is in the country legally. We provide a penalty of $1000 a day for every employer who has an illegal working on his payroll for each day the illegal has worked. We might want to tack some jail time on that too. We enforce these laws. The whole thing is quite simple but given that congress a bunch of money grubbing whores on the take, don't expect the problem to be solved. It is getting time for the people to take matters into there own hands as the government is useless.
mr. Meow, the second richest man in the world lives in Mexico, see the problem? Another problem is we cannot be responsible for the worlds poorest. If you haven't noticed we've got a bundle of problems that our elected officials aren't addressing now. If our government would wake up and address the problems effecting our citizens and take it to a point to where we are O.K., maybe, then maybe we could afford to help other countries. Imagine if we didn't have these trillion dollar occupations going on in the mid east, we would have some extra tax dollars to spend on our country. Imagine our government wouldn't have let big business outsource their manufacturing to countries around the globe, we wouldn't have the unemployment as we do.
As I have said, we don't need to deport illegals. Enforce our immigration laws and prohibit them from getting work, they'll deport themselves.
So lobo, bringing in any immigrants now, illegal or with a greencard or a visa is allowing them to take jobs away from american citizens, I understand you are more concerned for the immigrants than our citizens, so you are willing to give up your job to let a federal lawbreaker survive. It's almost like aiding and abeting the enemy. If you were a true patriot of our United States you would side with our citizens before even talking about people that are destroying our economy. If you sir are not satisfied with standing with the Red, White and Blue may leave our country and go somewhere else to help these poor federal lawbreakers. 'nuff said!
fremmasmind.......
I don't believe you even read my post. Where did I say that I favor the immigrant more than I favor an American citizen? Nonsense....pure nonsense!
Please go back and read my post again...and maybe again.....and maybe again.
I said that we need to close our borders. I said that we need to put pressure on America bussinesses thus making it almost impossible for illegal's to find a job. How did you miss that part? Wow!
I also said that we need to double or triple the number of immigrants that we allow to enter the country legally each year and those with special skills/education should have special consideration in terms of entry. I don't believe doing that would take jobs away from Americans already here......History does not show that!
Studies done time after time, clearly point out that the higher the educational level of a society, the more wealth there is available with in that society...This means more jobs available....
The problem with the number of illegal's that we currently have in this country is that most don't pay taxes and yet they use all of our basic services.....health care, roads, education, etc..... Legals do pay taxes.....major difference!
I continue to believe that this country is still all about the "Golden Door." We're a nation of immigrants. I'm in favor of continued immigration, but it must be controlled immigration.....they must ALL come through the front door.....not the back door.
I love my country very, very much and I'm not about to leave it. I try to work with in the system to change what I feel is wrong about the system. This means I pay taxes, vote, and stay informed about what is going on....
THANK HARRY REID AND OBAMACARE!!!
"mr. Meow, the second richest man in the world lives in Mexico, see the problem? Another problem is we cannot be responsible for the worlds poorest."
I know, Carlos Slim. You obviously haven't been to Mexico and if you have, you go to excluded areas, which is hilarious.
I agree with you that if you reinforce immigration, they'll leave. That's a fact, look at Arizona.
Also, just to let you know, Patriotism isn't the greatest thing ever, it's a two edged sword. Look at Hitler and his Nazi's, they were Patriotic, too much I think. The correct term is Nationalism so don't bring that crap here.
Also, Joe Wilson is the biggest hypocrit ever and he's not one to talk, he's just here for political points.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/11...
El Lobo, I guess that the fact our nation is so wealthy we can afford to bring more legal immigrants into our country when we have millions of americans without work right now. Only 1% of our country is the wealthiest 95% is below middleclass. Where history held a place for the need of immigrants, today it is a different story with millions of good americans looking for jobs. Bringing in immigrants with higher education levels would only take more jobs away from our unemployed and in fact add americans to the unemployed list.
Is there something wrong with our citizens keeping their jobs and letting them pays taxes?
The golden door must be shut to stop the legal and illegal immigration. Our politicians must be told that because they did not try and stop the outsourcing of good manufacturing jobs to foreign countries and are not upholding our immigration laws to protect our middle class, their political positions are in jeopardy.
Mr.meowski, my comment about Carlos went completely over your head.
It seems that Patriotism was good enough to help our forefathers create the United States of America.
I'll take Joe Wilson any day over Obama and any member of the House who didn't realize that SAVE was taken out of the health reform bill. Joes' bill in Congress was to get money back to hospitals who were losing by giving meds to illegals and not getting reimbursed by them, the illegals were not benefiting directly by his bill.
LOL, just not illegal's, Obama followers also receive free healthcare and whatever else they want to suck off the system. Welcome to America, if you're lazy, illegal, imported, affirmative action receipt then you get all the freebies you want. You'll never have to work and the working class is forced to take care of you with our hard earned money.
"LOL, just not illegal's, Obama followers also receive free healthcare and whatever else they want to suck off the system. Welcome to America, if you're lazy, illegal, imported, affirmative action receipt then you get all the freebies you want. You'll never have to work and the working class is forced to take care of you with our hard earned money."
Get an education and you won't have a need for this.
"I'll take Joe Wilson any day over Obama and any member of the House who didn't realize that SAVE was taken out of the health reform bill. Joes' bill in Congress was to get money back to hospitals who were losing by giving meds to illegals and not getting reimbursed by them, the illegals were not benefiting directly by his bill."
Your ignorance is still visible...stop listening to Limbaugh!
"Mr.meowski, my comment about Carlos went completely over your head.
It seems that Patriotism was good enough to help our forefathers create the United States of America."
We're not our forefathers, and they're not mine, so I don't care. If you really want history, we should return Texas to Mexico, since it was an illegal immigration take over....
mr. meowington:
Love your posts, they provide even more insight why not to vote for liberals in 2010 and 2012l.
To all you "send illegals back to where they come from". You need a reality check. They aren't going anywhere. Yeah "ICE" can catch a measly few, and some go back on their own because of the down economy but the ones that have been here for years are here to stay. There is no way in hell the u.s. government is going to round them all up and send them anywhere. Put them on the path to citizenship and get over it. At least this way we have a record and identification and the ability to track those who fail to meet requirements or break further laws and send them packing. But make no mistake, this government will NOT be rounding some (only god knows how many millions) of illeagals and send back to their countries or origin.
A measly few here and a measly few there...
Once this country gets serious about illegal immigrants, they will be flowing South by the bus load. Wait a minute, they already are...
If the Obama Administration tried the push "legalization" through. It will be the end of the Democrat party for years and years...
I would simply have to disagree with you larry. But like I said..."They aren't going anywhere".
fremmasmind said....
"El Lobo, I guess that the fact our nation is so wealthy we can afford to bring more legal immigrants into our country when we have millions of americans without work right now. Only 1% of our country is the wealthiest 95% is below middleclass."
Hmmmmm.....do you have a link or two that says that 95% of the American population is below what one would call middle class? I would love to see that link! I believe your talking just to be talking....
fremmasmind also said.......
"Bringing in immigrants with higher education levels would only take more jobs away from our unemployed and in fact add americans to the unemployed list."
Sorry but I don't fully agree....This recession isn't going to last forever and in the long terms we will benefit from allowing immigrants with special skills and advanced education to enter the country....
We have benefitted for a long, long time with foreign students being educated in this country and then staying on (earning citizenship) and living and working here......
If we're going to compete with the rest of the world in a global economy, it very important that we have a well educated and well trained work force...
Mr.meowski, I don't ever listen to Limbaugh, I just read the Huffington Post article you posted, didn't you?
Well El Lobo the new Micheal Moore movie is due to come out this coming Tuesday, I heard those percentage points when he was on Larry King last night.
Lastly, what is wrong with hiring our educated college students? Why do you go directly to your point that we can only hire foreigners with an education. Are you looking to create a new work visa to give the educated holders a lessened pay scale so the employers will hire them before a citizen? Right now there are plenty of work visa's that already give the immigrant an edge over our citizens. Again where are your roots? They sure don't seem to be based here in the U.S.of A.
It's sad that you are in the cheering section for the immigrants.
"Mr.meowski, I don't ever listen to Limbaugh, I just read the Huffington Post article you posted, didn't you?"
I'm glad, my apologies. Most due and I'm glad you don't.
"Lastly, what is wrong with hiring our educated college students? Why do you go directly to your point that we can only hire foreigners with an education. Are you looking to create a new work visa to give the educated holders a lessened pay scale so the employers will hire them before a citizen? Right now there are plenty of work visa's that already give the immigrant an edge over our citizens. Again where are your roots? They sure don't seem to be based here in the U.S.of A."
I agree with Fremmasmind on this one. We should continue to hire our college educated rather than foreigners. Our education has gotten lower in the secondary divisions though, but it's made up at the college level. We should limit less immigration in my opinion and bring more the work that belongs in the U.S., rather than ship it out, but that's a corporation thing and part of the free market and process of globalization.
The illegal immigrants part though I might disagree but I agree that with a harder approach they'll leave this country (the ones without families are the first ones). If you know about how Arizona has handled it, you'd be surprised. Although the illegals with kids here pretty much have a way to permanent residency, but that's 'till the children are 21 which is a while.
I'm not a "liberal" even though some of my posts might seem, I just gave you my opinion and it's not liberal, more of a moderate approach. They're common sense and if you really believe that rounding up millions of people is the only way, you're clearly ignorant. There are better approaches than that that would spend less money especially for Republicans who are complaining on spending.
"Love your posts, they provide even more insight why not to vote for liberals in 2010 and 2012l."
Thanks. There will be more liberals joining the ranks by 2012. Many of the children of illegal immigrants are becoming 18 and will be able to vote, oh, they vote Democrat too!
lol.
fremmasmind.......
You don't get it. Why am I not surprised? I didn't say we shouldn't hire our own college students....not sure where you came up with that idea. I simply said that:
"We have benefitted for a long, long time with foreign students being educated in this country and then staying on (earning citizenship) and living and working here......"
Where in that statement did I say "we can only hire foreigners with an education. You said that, not me!
Yes, we need to hire our own college graduates if they are qualified for the jobs that are available, but many times they aren't qualified or there's not enough of them for the many positions available...
I see nothing wrong with allowing a certain number of legal immigrants to enter the country each year. If they have special skills or they're educated and cam immediately help us then so much the better...
Our whole history has been about allowing a certain number of immigrants to enter the United States each year to work and live.
Not sure what you're background is but unless your relatives were all Native Americans, then they like my relatives, got off a boat at one time or another......Have you ever heard the expression "melting pot?" Apparently not....
Lobo you don't do a very good job covering your own a**. Pretty bad.
One, two, a few, not many, some...NONE. It really makes me mad when I read how our government gives jobs to greencard holders and visa card holders, because of every job they give to a foreigner a citizen will suffer. Maybe some day when you grow up a sense will overcome your spirit to help all americans and let the foreigners be helped by their own countries of origin. We are not living 30 yrs. ago.
it is ridiculous that the government can't deport them quicker. if I can count 20 illegals a day from going about my day to day life, why can't they see them and deport them?
some of them do get better health care than some of us because they don't have to go bankrupt to pay for their hospital bills like many Americans do -- they can just go back to being illegal citizens.
In 1872 the United States Supreme Court sanctioned the Chinese Exclusion Act. By doing that every person of Chinese extraction was deported and they quit admitting the Chinese into the country. It was cheaper than shooting them. They did shoot a good many of them and the Chinese became very proficient at outrunning bullets. Thats why they passed the law. You could look it up.
fremmasmind......
When I grow up??? Actually, I'm older than you and I've been around the block many, many times. It appears that the same can't be said about you.. Have you been around the block even once? I doubt it!
You appear to be from the old, old school of thought where you believe that most of our problems can and should be blamed on the immigrant. That belief is as old as this great nation and history shows that it's simply not true.
History tells us that one of the easiest things for us to do as citizens is to make "scapegoats" out of certain minorities/immigrants in our population....We have done it time and time again.... Matter of fact, we're almost masters at doing that...
This country was made great by the millions and millions of immigrants who came to our shores and worked hard to not only move the country forward but to move themselves forward....that's what the American dream is all about. You have heard of the American dream, right? You do know something about the concept of the Golden Door, don't you....?
Almost without exception, any time we have gone through a down turn in our economy, whether it's merely a recession or a depression, or a national crisis, the "immigrant haters' always come out of the woodwork in force to bash and blame the immigrants.
That was true in the early history of our country with the passage of the Alien & Sedition Acts and it was true in the late 1800's with the passage of the Chinese Exclusion Act that shut our doors to any and all immigrants from China.
We did a very similar thing during the 1920's when we blamed all of our problems on eastern European immigrants who stood out due to the fact that they looked a little different than most other Americans and they didn't speak English very well...
It was the old "ship or shoot" policy put into operation by the Republican administrations of that time period.
We did pretty much the same thing when we forced over 100,000 Japanese Americans (over 65% were U.S. citizens...) into relocation camps (interment camps) during World War II. The easiest thing to do was do what we did..........blame the Japanese-Americans for our bad luck....
Blame the Japanese-Americans for the attack on Pearl Harbor... Many Americans did just that....
To hear you and other tell it, much of our current problems can be traced to the number of legal and illegal immigrants that we have currently in the United States.
I guess you also believe that we wouldn't be in our current economic debacle if all the immigrants, both legal & illegal, were no longer here.....
Do I have that right?
So Mr. lobo, I'm not blaming the illegal immigrant because they are taking advantage of the open door left there by our elected officials.
Our government is to blame for not upholding our laws. This mess with illegals stems from our big businesses wanting cheaper labor i.e. greencard holders, visa card holders, illegal immigration. This is all for big business, as was the outsourcing of american jobs to satisfy big business by getting absolutely the cheapest labor the world could offer.
NAFTA,CAFTA, our government swore that these bills if passed would not only help our third world nations but the american worker would also benefit from these bills. They lied.
Did you know that the Security and Prosperity Obama was talking about tonight is conditioning the american public to our future Security , Properity, Partnership put together by Martin of Canada, Bush of the U.S. and Fox of Mexico in 2005. This is the precursor to the North American Union. Canada, the U.S. and Mexico are in line to become one entity as the European Union is. Why do you think our government wants us to get used to the fact that illegals are here to stay and this is why the feds are doing nothing about it. Conditioning.
The past has nothing to do with today, for the millions of unemployed americans who are screaming for help, they fall on the deaf ears of our government.
"The past has nothing to do with today, for the millions of unemployed americans who are screaming for help, they fall on the deaf ears of our government."
Well, there's a lot of work in the agricultural field, they get paid minimum wage. I don't know why Americans are going there for work.
fremmasmind said....
"The past has nothing to do with today, for the millions of unemployed americans who are screaming for help, they fall on the deaf ears of our government."
Sorry but I disagree. The past is why we're in the mess that we're currently in...As citizens we need to learn from the past and act accordingly... That's why the study of history is so important.
I believe the economy will slowly improve but its going to take a while. We didn't get in our current mess over-night and we're not going to get out of it in a few months...
Our economy is in far worse shape that many people would have us believe. The global economy and how we learn to deal with it will determine what direction we're going and how strong and sustained our recovery will be.
I agree that our government lied to us when they told us that both NAFTA & CAFTA was good for the workers of this country. Nothing is further from the truth...
Our biggest threat to us as a nation is not Obama's attempt to take us down the road to socialism as many people believe, but the fact that we are becoming a country run by America's corporations.... Big business, Wall Street, Bankers, Corporate heads, etc....are calling the shots.
Unfortunately more and more of the nation's wealth is controlled by fewer and fewer of the people. Approximately 90% of the nation's wealth is controlled by less than 10% of the people..... It reminds me of the days when the "Robber Barons" were calling the shots.....
The global economy is a big plus for America's corporations but the global economy has not helped this country's middle class one iota...
How much longer can we continued to out-source American jobs to points off-shore and survive as a nation? How much longer can we import 70% of the oil that we use and be competitive with competition around the world?
Mr. Lobo, my post which said the past has nothing to do with today, was meant for the time we did open our doors to immigrants who came into our country legally through the Golden Door. Today our economy has been over abused by illegals and our government has let it happen.
All of the manufacturers who have outsourced their businesses to foreign countries were expecting to produce their goods overseas and sell them in the U.S. at a 10% or more mark-up to make their profits larger than they ever experienced here in the United States.
Business was going good for them in the beginning but finally the reality of our unemployed middle class not having the buying power they used to gave them major setbacks. They never realized that when you take citizens livelyhoods away from them, they won't be able to spend like they used to. So much for intellegence.
Between the outsourcing and illegals, it's no wonder our middle class is struggeling, and the Monster keeps watching us.
"The past has nothing to do with today."
I would sure like to have one of you guys tell my wife that!!!
I don't know if I have enough nerve to tell that to her in person... Maybe over the phone...
fremmasmind said.......
"Between the outsourcing and illegals, it's no wonder our middle class is struggeling...."
I agree with the outsourcing part of your statement, but I believe you are putting far too much into your belief that the illegals are a major, major problem....a problem but not a major, major problem!
The presence of the illegal's has hurt us but there's many other things that have had a much larger impact on our economy than the illegal's have had.
Keep in mind that most of the jobs taken by illegal's are lower paying jobs that most people, who we would classify as middle class, are normally not interested in...
Most middle class Americans can not make a living doing those jobs.....
With that being said, I'm sure the present economic debacle that we find ourselves in has encouraged/forced some Americans who are unemployed to take many of those low paying jobs in order to survive... They normally would not pursue those jobs...
Our number one problem is simply a culture of greed that has taken over in this country, particularly among the upper class.......bankers, Wall Street types, Corporate CEO's, etc.......
As I mentioned earlier, 10% of the population controls over 90% of the country's wealth.
We have deregulated our economic system far too much & the deregulation, along with the greed factor, have driven the economic bus off a steep cliff and into a ditch.
It's not enough to simply get our economy back up and running again. We also must put back in place many of the regulations that we removed from the system over the last 25+ years.
There's many parallels that can be drawn between what happened during the 1920's and what has taken place over the last twenty years in this country. In both cases, the end result was a massive recession/depression.
One of the key contributing factor's that led to the Great Depression was a policy of complete economic "laissez-faire" by the government.
Deregulations might currently be another way of saying "laissez-faire." Deregulations has been a disaster for this country's economy....
Both parties have played major roles in deregulation with the Republicans "robbing the bank" and the Democrats driving the "get away car."
Strange... I always "assumed" the word "illegal" meant... ummm... well, NOT legal (not according to or authorized by law : unlawful, illicit; not sanctioned by official rules). That would make Illegal immigrants, imigrants who are in the United States, NOT legally, against the law, right?
Well, if I broke a law, I may go to jail, no? What price would an ILLEGAL immigrant pay? Free health care, free food, free rent? Paid for by me, a LEGAL citizen-not breaking the law?
Wow, this is really making it hard to teach my children right from wrong.
Oh! and if the definition of ILLEGAL has changed recently, can somebody post it for me?
Wolfy stated:
"Both parties have played major roles in deregulation with the Republicans "robbing the bank" and the Democrats driving the "get away car."
Good going Wolfy...
your a good boy today...
I will give you a treat later...
Just don't hold your breath...