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Freedom to protest proves protesters wrong
Tuesday, Sept. 15, 2009 | 2:03 a.m.
After watching the coverage of the protests in Washington, D.C., on Saturday, I was both proud to be an American (once again, people were able to peacefully gather to voice their concerns and seek redress from their government) and confused by the comments made by some of the protesters.
Many said they had gone to D.C. from across the country to take their freedoms back from the government and the Obama administration. It was a curious thing to say, considering that these folks were able to travel, unimpeded, through various states to get to their destination.
They also were able to assemble peacefully and voice their opposition to government policies without fear of persecution or prosecution. They carried signs, some insulting and others downright crude (depictions of Obama as Hitler or the Joker) without being hauled off to jail or attacked on the street by “jack-booted thugs.”
Some carried signs saying Obama is converting the U.S. to a fascist nation. Really? I wonder if any of these fine Americans can tell me precisely which “freedoms” they lost and need to “take back.”
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New word of the week
Wrong
The White House has a message to the tens of thousands of protesters who railed against big government during a rally in Washington Saturday 9-12-2009: You're wrong.
White House senior adviser David Axelrod said Sunday that the protesters, part of the "tea party" movement, do not represent the views of the public when it comes to health care reform. Axelrod said on CBS' "Face the Nation." "You know, My message to them is, they're wrong."
Saying they are wrong does not make you right
Axelrod is part of the problem in Washington. If you do not 100% agree with their thinking, you are "out of touch", or "wrong" or "do not understand what we are trying to do". Americans are not stupid and we know what is going on. We protested the immigration bill last year and sent it down in flames because we do understand. The same is true of the health care bill, we understand and will send it down in flames also. Come up with a plan supported by a majority and quit writing off any sign of protest as wrong.
more evidence that the stupid pathetic republican puke party is full of crap...
abc put the crowd at 60 - 70 thousand...
the organizers cited abc as putting the crowd at 1 - 1.5 million...
hee hee hee...
the stupid pathetic repuublican puke party is full of bold faced liars...
children that will do or say anyhting to get their way...
and let's not forget...
the stupid pathetic republican puke party lied to start a war in iraq...
a war that killed over 4,000 brave american troops and over 100,000 innocent iraqis...
and wasted over $1 trillion...
nothing but a pack of liars...
who the hell would want to join the stupid pathetic republican puke party these days!!!
and the name calling and republican bashing continues without an intelligent word being spoken from birdie. Isn't this the same post over and over again? You need to expand your thoughts, but wait, Obama just repeats the same thing over and over again. You dems think?? that if you say something enough times, it becomes true, and all will believe you. WRONG AGAIN, as usual.
Its simple, Axelrod is making money off it, thats why he's "right":
A media consulting firm with ties to White House senior strategist David Axelrod has been hired to produce a multi-million dollar ad campaign touting the Obama administration's health care overhaul.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/08/...
Don't forget Axelrod tried to recruit Blago to run for President before he settled on Obama.
He was a campaigner looking for a campaign. A former trainee to Dick Morris trained by the Clintons with win at any cost as the mantra.
Let freedom ring...(but we are going to force you to buy health insurance)
Let freedom ring.....(we want to require all people between the ages of 18 and 21 to do public service)
Let freedom ring....(we want to regulate and put out of business right wing talk radio)
Let freedom ring....(but we want to control how your doctor treats you)
Let freedom ring....(we now own GM and banks and other corporations)
Let freedom ring....(BTW our deficit this year is 2 trillion dollars)
Let freedom ring....(we want to raise taxes on energy to a degree where your quality of life will greatly suffer)
The wailer states: "I wonder if any of these fine Americans can tell me precisely which "freedoms" they lost and need to "take back."
Well why don't you do some research on your own instead of just wondering...
Dear Joel:
American freedom is more than unrestricted travel to a destination in Washington DC.
SgtRock lists the intrusions that this most of intrusive administrations attempts to shove down the throats of the American people. People are sick and disgusted with Obama, his kool aid drinking administration, and the Reids and Pelosis in Congress. The message is "don't tread on me"--there are going to be changes in 2010. The American people are going to declare their
power and independence at the ballot boxes of America!
Jack booted thugs? There have been a number of instances of goons from SEIU (Stupid, Evil, Ignorant, and Useless) showing up at rallys to harass people. I don't know what kind of boots they wear. Yeah! I know, they're from the right wing. No they are the from Obama's welfare trash friends from ACORN who should be prosecuted under the RICO statutes and after prison be deported. I'm actually surprised that some SEIU offices have not been torched in this country.
Hey Joel: The more that government dos for you the more freedom you will lose this is something that should make you feel very uneasy in life. You need to be as self-sufficient in your own life as much as possible and settle for nothing less from yourself in life at all. NOW GET OUT THERE AND GET YOURSELF SOME!
And still no one here has answered Rector's question...Well let me do it. The answer is NONE!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUPMjC9mq...
My favorite thing about this video is that the interviewer is polite, lets the people say there perspective and only mentions some simple facts instead of shouting his ideology at them. He actually lets them figure it out for themselves.
"Let freedom ring...(but we are going to force you to buy health insurance)"
You can choose to buy the insurance, or you can choose to pay a fine.
"Let freedom ring.....(we want to require all people between the ages of 18 and 21 to do public service)"
Obama has proposed no such requirement. He's SUGGESTED a $4000 tax credit to college students who VOLUNTARILY complete 100 hours of service a year.
"Let freedom ring....(we want to regulate and put out of business right wing talk radio)"
Obama opposes the Fairness Doctrine:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/first100...
His pick for the head of the FCC also opposes the Fairness Doctrine:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB12452011...
The Fairness Doctrine is a red herring. There's been no legislation considered on the floor to bring it back. In fact, the legislation on the floor of the Congress has been about preventing a fairness doctrine, not instituting one.
In other words, it's common pandering and fear-mongering.
"Let freedom ring....(but we want to control how your doctor treats you)"
Yes, safety's an important thing. Too little oversight brings people like Dr. Desai, who infected scores of Nevadans with life-threatening hepatitis due to too little oversight. I guess SgtRock, err, jfNance32, err, James F Nance Jr thinks doctors should be able to do ANYTHING!
"Let freedom ring....(we now own GM and banks and other corporations)"
We don't OWN GM, any more than any other investor owns GM. We only control 60% of the stock. As for "banks and other corporations," we've already seen a profit from eight of the biggest banks that repair their obligations to the government. We saw a return of about 15% annually. That's better than the market average!
"Let freedom ring....(we want to raise taxes on energy to a degree where your quality of life will greatly suffer)"
Keep in mind, this is from someone who thought a $600 tax credit was only worthy of a "Happy Meal."
"The Congressional Budget Office says the net annual economy-wide cost of the cap-and-trade program in the House Energy & Commerce Committee's climate-change bill in 2020 would be $22 billion -- or about $175 per household."
http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2009/06/2...
"Let freedom ring....(BTW our deficit this year is 2 trillion dollars)"
Yet you and all of the other teabaggers were curiously silent when Bush cut taxes and raised spending. No tea parties, no demonstrations, just fawning admiration and pats on the back! HYPOCRITES!
ksand99. You just had to use the obscene word "teabaggers" that made your post no more than a obscene rant...
That video is produced by someone called "New Left Media".
At the end of the video is a message from them that states:
"All that stands in the way of universal health care in America are the greed of the medical-industrial complex, the lies of the right-wing propaganda machine, and the gullibility of voters who believe those lies".
Yea, that's a real independent, original, random sampling, unedited, statistically significant representation of the protesters at that march. And I'm Obama.
Larry: I completely expected you to flee at the first sign of an argument of substance. You never disappoint.
ksand99... I quit reading your post when I came to your obscene word "teabaggers" and consider your entire post as TRASH...
"You can choose to buy the insurance, or you can choose to pay a fine."
You are mocking the phrase "Let freedom ring" with the argument that the federal government, forcing you at gun point to buy this or pay that fine, is freedom? "KS": even for you that seems a little out there.
What about this: I am a salesman and I call you on the phone and say, "I am going to be in your area next week and will be stopping by. Would 1pm or 3:30pm be better for you?"
Assuming you didn't want to see me, what could you do now? I've only given you two choices. You're trapped. You don't want to see me but I didn't give you that option so I guess now you have no choice. I worked a Jedi mind trick on you with the old "two choices technique". I guess the sale is made?
You posed the following: "The Congressional Budget Office says the net annual economy-wide cost of the cap-and-trade program in the House Energy & Commerce Committee's climate-change bill in 2020 would be $22 billion -- or about $175 per household."
Before people believe that they should also see this:
"Applying the U.S. Energy Information Administration's economic forecasting model, Science Applications International Corporation reports reducing U.S. carbon dioxide emissions 70 percent by 2050 could kill 4 million U.S. jobs, cause gasoline and electricity prices to more than double, and reduce household income by more than $7,000 each and every year. "
http://www.heartland.org/publications/en...
I have a computer, too.
"I have a computer, too."
Would you be posting on the Sun's WEBSITE without one? Congratulations, Captain Obvious! I'm sure your mom is proud!
As for your SAIC study (snicker, snicker), you must not be familiar with the concept of GIGO analysis.
But here's the basics: even with wildly out-of-line assumptions and projections, even big business' studies indicate a GDP growth of 9 trillion dollars and 20 million new jobs created by 2030 under the Cap and Trade bill.
I wasn't aware 20 million new jobs and a 9 trillion GDP growth would kill us. You teabaggers have some ironic sense of criticism
In fact, it's curious that the SAIC would release a study duplicating at study of the EIA, since the EIA released a study several months PRIOR to the SAIC's GIGO study that prove's SAIC's projections wrong.
You can find the report debunking SAIC's study here:
http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/servicerpt/s...
So, Captain Obvious, let me ask you another question: why is SAIC's projections based on reducing carbon emissions 70% when S. 2191 doesn't even go that far?
Garbage in, garbage out my obviously oblivious friend.
ksand99 has to resort to namecalling to get any attention.
Like they say: "Garbage in, garbage out..."
poor larry.
I am be poor, but at least I have moral character.
or..
I MAY be poor, but at least I have moral character.
First off: "I have a computer, too"
It's.....like....a joke. Get it? See, it's funny because....well...obviously the fact that I am posting here means I have a computer.
See....It's funny because it is obvious. Otherwise it would just be stupid.
Also, it can be interpreted as "I have a computer, too" in that I can look things up on the computer, too, like you do when you post evidence for your opinions.
Were you really that taken in by that comment? Maybe your response is satire, or play on words, or tongue in cheek, or simile, or metaphor?
Dude, get a sense of humor, already.
Also, you always use the "the study YOU used for your point was bogus" routine.
The link you posted is for a paper 74 pages long and, no, I don't have time to read it.
The big point, which you always seem to miss, is that there are plenty of studies for and against issues. If I didn't have a life or a steady job I am sure I could find something to rebuke your study and so on.
See....again, that's the point.
I find the word 'teabagger" offensive. All references/definitions to this term are of a derogatory nature despite how much it is uttered on MSNBC.
And, please leave any references to my "mom" (regardless of how proud you think she is of me) in any form or fashion 'out-your-mouth".
Wow, 3 comments all in response to one post? You seem a little scatterbrained, pbim.
First off: jokes are supposed to be funny, and shouldn't need a 6 paragraph diatribe defending them as being funny. If they need that, trust me, it wasn't funny.
"The big point, which you always seem to miss, is that there are plenty of studies for and against issues. If I didn't have a life or a steady job I am sure I could find something to rebuke your study and so on. See....again, that's the point."
Well, typically someone MENTIONS THE POINT in their comments. You did not. I'm glad you've realized that your comments are vague and, at least in this case, fail to mention your "point" altogether. I'm sure you'll try harder next time.
As for "teabagger," I'm not really concered that it offends you, to be quite honest. Most of the ideology of the right offends me, but I don't presume to tell you what you can and cannot say. That's the joy of the first amendment, something that I love and will protect and will exercise at my discretion.
Didn't you hear? Conservatives are adopting the term 'teabagger' and , to quote a writer on National Review Online, "It could be that conservatives will "own the insult" and use "teabagger" as a badge of honor. It could become some proud conservative N-word. President Reagan said, "I'm a contra, too." Well, I'm a teabagger too -- and the Anderson Cooper types can [go jump in a lake]."
I mean, teabagger's the new "proud conservative N-word."
"And, please leave any references to my "mom" (regardless of how proud you think she is of me) in any form or fashion 'out-your-mouth"."
Wow, you take insult even when I complement your mother's pride? Touchy!
The best thing, though, is the "The link you posted is for a paper 74 pages long and, no, I don't have time to read it." Is there any better example of the closed-mindedness of the convervative movement? They're quick to criticize Cap-and-Trade using Limbaugh's talking points yet too lazy to read evidence which contradicts their ill-considered opinion?
You may have a computer, but it seems you're unwilling to use it.
If you teabaggers don't like the name, stop
holding tea bag parties.
You can't really think you are as smart as you pretend to be, can you? Are you so full of yourself, Kevin, that you think you can convince me that an insult is a compliment? Look, friend, follow the bouncing ball:
Just because you don't get a joke doesn't mean it's not funny. If I thought I could explain it to you in less than 6 paragraphs I would. Admit it, you got burned on that one. You're so literal with your thinking that you wouldn't know humor if it teabagged you (that's funny by the way). If that has to be explained to you.....
And if I'm a teabagger, then you're the recipient of my teabagging.
Oh, and don't forget, teabagger-receiver, it's guys like me that keep you employed so that you can have a computer (that's not a joke, in case you are wondering).
Close-mindedness? You have to be kidding. If your mind were any more closed they would have to board it up (Insert rim shot here. OK, not tremendously funny but it's the best I can do on short notice).
I guess I get it. If I were a liberal progressive trying to remake the U.S. into a Communist country I suppose I'd spend my days on the Daily Kos scanning for my talking points. Keep up the propaganda, Kev.
I dunno, I just think that a well-crafted joke doesn't need a multi-paragraph dissertation as to why it's funny. But that's just me.
Cross-apply that to your teabagging "joke." Again, we don't need a lecture as to the humor of your joke. If it's funny, it stands on it's own, and doesn't need a multi-paragraph dissertation. That's just pathetic.
"Oh, and don't forget, teabagger-receiver, it's guys like me that keep you employed so that you can have a computer (that's not a joke, in case you are wondering)."
No, I can say, definitively, it's not guys like you who keep me employed. I'm selective of my clientele, and it's fairly obvious I don't choose lazy, imcompetent clients, nor would I lower my standards.
"Close-mindedness? You have to be kidding. If your mind were any more closed they would have to board it up (Insert rim shot here. OK, not tremendously funny but it's the best I can do on short notice)."
Of course you're close-minded. You boldly declared you wouldn't bother reading evidence to the contrary of your position. That's somewhere approaching a DSM-IV level description of close-minded.
"I guess I get it. If I were a liberal progressive trying to remake the U.S. into a Communist country I suppose I'd spend my days on the Daily Kos scanning for my talking points. Keep up the propaganda, Kev."
Oh, if only my life were so easy. It's obvious some fairly easy things escape your attention, but I sort of see my role here as DEBUNKING the propaganda that comes from the rabid right. Every time SgtRock, err, jfNance32, err James F Nance Jr posts utter lies or those hilarious slurs and slander coming from that "braniac" Glenn Beck, I think it's sorta my patriotic duty to point those lies out and hold them accountable. You don't seem to be too interested in accountability. You take offense to the term "teabagger" then turn around and use it. There's a term for that: hypocrite.
The term "teabagger is only offensive to Barney Frank. As for Mr. Rector, your question is moronic, simply ask the thousands of investors in GM if they believe any of their freedoms were lost! El Presidente simply trampled on the bankruptcy laws of the U. S. Are you suggesting that my money is not related to my liberty? Mr. Rector does not know what the meaning of freedom and liberty is. My suggestion...go back to school and find out who was responsible for cheating you on your education.
I think if Larry and the rest of you nuts would quit pointing out that "teabaggers" is a "dirty word" (grow up.) 90 percent of the readers of the Sun wouldn't have had a clue.
Well, aren't we lucky to have you as the voice of reason and fact checking.
Contrary, gmag, that was/is the purpose of"...pointing out that "teabaggers" is a "dirty word."
Maybe we can have a discussion without the name calling and profanity.