Facebook
Fark
Digg
Reddit
StumbleLETTER TO THE EDITOR:
Training Afghan army worth the time
Sunday, Nov. 29, 2009 | 2:04 a.m.
To those who have expressed concern about the length of time it is taking to train the Afghanistan army, I, as a retired U.S. Army colonel, would like to offer my thoughts.
One must take into account that it takes about half a year to become a qualified Army private. Don’t forget how long it takes to qualify drill instructors who push and pull the recruits into shape, or how long it takes to train and qualify regimental commanders and their staffs who see that the soldiers have plans, food, ammo, medical care and clothing.
My point, missed by many who want things unrealistically clean, neat and fast, is that training an army (not just privates) requires immense expenditures of time, money and other resources.
Intelligent application of these resources eventually gets you an army that can plan, fight and care for its soldiers. There was no “army of Afghanistan” when we arrived. Soldiers had either been killed by the Taliban or left the country. Talent has to be developed over time, and in Afghanistan this is compounded by the need for trainees to unlearn the bad habits and cultural traits that characterize their country.
The South Korean Army, one of the best (if not the best small army) in the world, is an example of turning an ineffectual rabble into a great military force. That took about 10 years.
It’ll take time to remake the assembled Afghanistan volunteers into a real army their country can depend on. That is an investment the United States has to make to have a partner it can depend on.
Discussion: comments so far…
Comments are moderated by Las Vegas Sun editors. Our goal is not to limit the discussion, but rather to elevate it. Comments should be relevant and contain no abusive language. Comments that are off-topic, vulgar, profane or include personal attacks will be removed. Full comments policy. Additionally, we now display comments from trusted commenters by default. Those wishing to become a trusted commenter need to verify their identity or sign in with Facebook Connect to tie their Facebook account to their Las Vegas Sun account. For more on this change, read our story about how it works and why we did it.
Only trusted comments are displayed on this page. Untrusted comments have expired from this story.
No trusted comments have been posted.
Post a comment
Most Popular
- Viewed
- Discussed
- E-mailed
- Superstar Whitney Houston dies at 48
- Two dead after accident in downtown Las Vegas
- Instant Analysis: Debating whether UNLV should continue series with San Diego State
- Police looking for man in white Ford Explorer
- Dining Guide: 2012 Valentine’s Day options in Las Vegas
- Color from the scene at Thomas & Mack Center: We have a wire job! Rebels win, and Louie Armstrong sings!
- Four people injured in car accident
- Blog: Justin Hawkins’ steal seals UNLV’s thrilling 65-63 victory against San Diego State
- After Nevada and Florida wins, Mitt Romney trying to prove he’s ‘severely conservative’ to CPAC base
- UNLV makes key plays down stretch to hold off San Diego State 65-63
Blogs
The Kats Report
Color from scene at Thomas & Mack: We have a wire job! Rebels win, and Louie Armstrong sings!
South Point owner Michael Gaughan's take on 'Vegas Stripped': 'I'll give it an 8' (4 Comments)
Author relishes writing the life story of ‘larger-than-life’ Oscar Goodman (3 Comments)
Elsewhere
Landowner: All roads could lead to Uxbridge casino
Revel reveals smoke-free casino opening
Cirque du Soleil show in Sands China casino to close this month
Meet the woman behind Sheldon Adelson
The Sun
Locally owned and independent for more than 50 years.
"There was no "army of Afghanistan" when we arrived."
Seems to me that would have been a good way to leave it. When this army turns on the U.S., we will have our government to thank. When it turns on other countries, we will be responsible.
Are we creating a monster?
Creating yet another warring force in the world, which will take resources from other, more important things that we need here, is not necessarily a good thing.
Is the Taliban really a threat to the Afghan people? And will this Afghan army keep religion out of its operations? Who's to say this force will not just join forces with the Taliban?
This is a huge expense and gamble for us. Why are we funding this? Do we think that, with such an army, attacks on the U.S. will not be planned? That the Afghan people will be spending every waking moment looking out for us, if we fund their army? That's pretty naive.
Does this mean we will now have a permanent presence in Afghanistan to watch over this army?
If the U.S. would stop spending so much war money trying to bully the rest of the world into submission, the rest of the world would not hate us so much and be trying to attack us. We would have so much more to spend on fixing our messes at home.
But that's not what these wars are about - they're about making more money for the richest and greediest. Come on, birdie, tell it.
Anyone who's experienced the Las Vegas economy should understand this: The bigger they come, the harder they fall. The U.S. is on its way out. We cannot keep spending these trillions on war, yet we are. Is this what we want to be bankrupted by? I'd rather be bankrupted knowing that I have health care even if I lose my job. And maybe we wouldn't have to go bankrupt if it wasn't for this war spending.
Well, President Obama, where's the leadership here?
our goal was to kill the terrorists who attacked us on 9/11...
not to go around the world nation building...
w the scum bag liar loser clown had bin laden in his sights then turned his attention to iraq...
he distorted the mission...
he lost the moral authority we once was held...
and now we are alone...
while others enjoy the fact that we continue to spend american blood and treasure to fight radical islam...
bottom line...
we are broke...
we need to put other countries on notice...
you either start pitching in or we are out of here...
and you guys can deal with radical islam...
and oh the way...
pakistan is much much closer to china and russia and india and germany and france and spain and england...
Mr. Turk: You have written a good letter explaining the time it takes to train an army.
My concern is however that the USA cannot afford to train another country's army. The USA is daily putting itself in worse financial shape.
Canada is pulling its troops out of Afghanistan in 2011. Even our ultra conservative government appears to realize that war is too costly, and Canada's previous proud reputation as a peacekeeping force only has been sullied by our joining the coalition as combat forces.
My hope is that President Obama will soon decide that domestic issues must take priority for his outrageous spending, and that war spending is money down the toilet.
I'd like to know what branch of the army LtCol. Turk was a part of.
The U.S. cannot continue this nation building, I agree with gunowners that these trillions being funded to our defense contractors and being paid by "we the people" would do more good "for the people" if we would stop these occupations and bring our soldiers home and start concentrating on the major problems we have in our own backyard.
When Obama announces that he will order more troops to Afghanistan we will know that the greenlight is on to prepare for the construction of the 2 pipelines that the U.S. has been trying to build since the mid 90's.
We as a country cannot let the politicians in our country destroy what has taken over 200 years to build. Greed is a powerful sin, and when in the wrong hands will destroy all the good and descent people it surrounds.
We can see all the evidence around us today with what is going on in our economy and how the world bank is controlling every entity and slowly showing everyone that it is taking control.
Armies cannot take control of a country as effectively as when the banks take control of a countries economy.
Why do you think Bernake and Geitner are so nervous right now with Ron Pauls bill to audit the fed has gained enough sponsorship and is close to being passed?
Since its beginning the Federal Reserve has manipulated our currency, banks, IRS and countless other federal entities which in turn has caused recessions and depressions in our nations history.
Now is the time to bring those responsible in taking part in destroying and manipulating our economy to justice. If we don't start today by telling our politicians that "we the people" want our representation that we voted them into office for and hound them until we get the attention and respect we deserve as citizens, we will never be able to control the Monster which has taken the place of our government.
LOL! Gun Owners for Obama????
Investing more men and money was one of Obama's promises.
We should support him on this one.
Oh Canada just can't keep his big nose out of others business. As if Canada does not have enough of their own problems.
Your too late anyway "Oh Canada" because in just a couple of days President Obama will do what is right and increase the troop level in Afghanistan. Canada will probably follow and increase their troop level by sending an additional 10 soldiers.
Maybe "Oh Canada" was a Vietnam era draft dodger who deserted to Canada and wants to come back to the U.S. if he can get free health care as he does in Canada.
I like Canadians but this one with the big nose is an example of Canadian Liberalism...
Again, "the right thing" becomes the topic of the day. Some feel the right thing is to spend trillions more of the tax payers money, ship more of our soldiers into harms way, continue this occupation, and kill more innocent Afghanis, for what? To secure the installation of two pipelines through Afghanistan?
To others the right thing is to remove not to send more troops into harms way, stop spending our citizens hard earned dollars on nation building, stop the killing and mameing of our troops and innocent Afghanis, and concentrate on the problems we as citizens are facing here in the United States.
Two totally different views. Who's right? When it's beyond our control it doesn't matter who's right. We just have to sit back and watch the events take place and pray for our soldiers in harms way. They are the hero's who have everything to lose.
This war in afghanistan is not winnable. Our training an army for them is like arming our own enemy with our tactics, weapons, ammo and hoping for the best. We are in a Vietnam like war and there will be no end to it, until and unless we decide to pull out now.
Warn all of these Muslim nations sponsoring and supporting terror that any, and I mean any attack on the US or our supporting allies will mean total nuclear anihilation for each and everyone of them regardless of how the attack comes, who carries it out, or where it occurs among our allies or our own nation.
The only thing they really understand is power, strength and resolve not the mealy-mouth approach we have been using. Train them, my ass, we need to get the hell out and warn them once and for all. Immediate and total anihilation awaits you if you dare launch an attack by rocket, plane, single suicide bomber or a whole brigade of suicide bent nuts. Death will be your immediate heritage.
Do what you want to your own people but a curse and plague upon you if you touch us. Don't think that Mohammed Binglybingly Dumbob will be able to get away with any suicide attack on us. Death will await you.
When the United States entered the war in 1941 we had no real standing army of any size. Within 3 and a half years we inducted, fed, trained and killed all our enemies in Germany, Italy, and Japan. How long have we been monkeying around in Afghanistan? In order to properly train an army you must have willing students. I don't think the Afghans want to fight, they just want the 3 square meals and the nice shiny shoes.
Would you want to be trained to kill your own countrymen? Afghanistan is having a hard enough time getting citizens to join up much less finishing training and becoming a soldier.
Obamas decision came from powers higher than him. We call him the President, but he actually is the orater in chief.
When we threaten the citizens of Afghanistan with nuclear annihalation, at that point, we are only playing the same game they are and we then become worse than they are. Obama was told what to say and because of this we will see many more of our loyal soldiers giving up their lives in more ways than one. This decision as told by our President will take away any chance of him getting re-elected.
Of course what other decision could have made not to go with the surge? Remember what happened to JFK we he refused to escalate Viet Nam?
It would be ideal if some people could obtain the mailing addresses of others --- enabling them to restrict their little mini-battles with each other.
Also, when reading some ultra-lame comments, I keep thinking: If you lack the ability to read and think properly, please give your computer a rest.
Example: Pay attention, and avoid this silly mistake - the use of "Your" (for you're - you are). Just because you dislike the Republicans doesn't require you to use the lower case for the "R" --- unless you don't know any better.
However, the omission of one's true name most likely hides one's ignorance --- let alone their missing their distemper shots --- and I could give names.
At times I wonder if some of these comments would be more rational if people had to use their real names. Birdiedreamin or Birdbrain? What's really in a name?
Back to the subject ...
The Soviets armed and trained the Afghan Army (yes, the Afghan Army. Afghanistan also had an Air Force). They became unhappy with Afghanistan politics and in 1979 they invaded. The Afghans naturally used the Soviet weapons and training to resist the Soviet occupation.
Back then, America was still a great nation, but we fell under the control of one Ronald Reagan and V.P and former CIA Director, G.H. Bush. They and their cabal sent weapons, lots of weapons to assist the Afghans in their fight to end the Soviet occupation. Under the leadership of one Osama Bin Laden, they were successful. In 1989 the Soviets hung their tails between their legs and retreated back home to nurse their wounds.
A decade later comes George W. Bush and Dick Cheney, who were apparently rather poor students of even recent history, and who thought they'd succeed in making the Afghans our Best Friends Forever by arming and training an Afghani Army. What? Me worry?
The Colonel makes many valid points with his editorial.
I dare say, none of you have bothered to think about the literacy rates in Afghanistan and how that impacts being able to quickly train a new military force.
"Afghan Military Training Poses Challenges"
http://waronterrornews.typepad.com/home/...
"The biggest challenge to training the Afghan Security Forces though is pure ignorance. Afghans are smart and stubborn, but illiteracy is the norm. While in the US, 75% of potential recruits are turned away for a lack of ability to meet basic requirements, including education, few Afghans can even sign their own name and some recruits don't speak a language known to their trainers, not Pashtu, not Dari, not Uzbek."
Illiterate and 7 years hard to train, yet these same ignoramuses build IEDs and attack UN forces although outnumbered 12 to 1. Maybe if they learned to count, they might give up.
In support of Col. Turk's letter, I would like to offer the following observations, and as a Master Instructor in the military for many years, I think I have some experience in this area.
The Col. states that it takes about a year and a half to turn an average American civilian into a qualified Army private. This assumes that the man (or woman) has a reasonable amount of intelligence and sophistication, usually meaning that they have attained at least a high school education or equivilant.
Our training cadres in Afghanistan are charged with trying to train poor ignorant farmers who still live in a thirteenth century society in the use of modern military and police procedures, weapons and tactics, and turn them into professional police officers or soldiers. They are often required to do this in sweltering deserts or freezing mountainous terrain filled with pissed-off Taliban or al-Qaida (essentially one and the same) who would rather shave the backs of their legs with a cheese-grater than submit to occupation by a foreign country for which they have only contempt. We are the Infidels, the Unbelievers, and our women have far too much influence over our lives. Also, the trainers are usually required to rely on local interpreters to translate the instruction into the appropriate dialect. All of this is going to take time, and no amount of second-guessing by arm-chair generals is going to make it happen any faster.
A major problem our guys face is trying to determine which of these recruits are joining to help their country and which guy might be an al-Qaida or Taliban mole joining to be able to get inside in order to cause trouble. Also, with some of the more fanatically religious Afganis joining up, the slightest perceived slight , insult, or disparaging of their faith or the Holy Koran can result in a sudden outburst of violence. The GI's call it "going Jihad". This has happened time and time again when an Afghani has suddenly turned on his trainers or other coalition forces and started shooting. Our troops can never let their guard down, even when they think the guys they are soldiering with are the good guys.
This effort is going to take time, patience, perseverance and much confidence in one's own ability to stay with the training program. However, their job is to complete the mission, no matter the time and effort required. We owe them all of our support, not sniping about things about which we know very little.
You tell them bigdon... Right on the mark...
I could not have said it better myself. Well, probably I could not have said it at all, but no matter, I was thinking it anyway.
Some of these guys think that our troops could have trained the whole Afghan army at one time. I am sure that with limited resources, the training classes are small and our troop are doing the best job possible.
Good to see you back on duty...
I think bigdon has made a powerful case for us getting the heck out and keeping them ignorant of modern tactics and weaponry.
We are the infidels, the unbelievers, and I'll admit many of us are controlled by women. It is wrong for the U.S. to go into any foreign country, overthrow their government, and occupy them by force and think that we have the right or the duty to make them think they way we do, act the way we do, worship the way we do, etc. The best way to support our troops is to bring them home. No more wars for profit. Our government has been doing this for 60 years.
Isn't it time for our citizens to wise up?
Remember when that Congressman from Texas worked to get the Afghans the hand held rockets to fight the Russians? Then they used them on us. I say give them nothing.