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twitterLetter to the editor:
Gay unions opposed based on Scripture
Wednesday, April 22, 2009 | 2:03 a.m.
Frank Rich’s column in Sunday’s Las Vegas Sun (“Same-sex marriage no longer shocks”) misses the point. Those of us who oppose gay marriage are not “homophobic,” “brain dead” or “spreading the poisons of bigotry.”
We simply refer to God’s word, which states (in Leviticus and again in Romans) that homosexuality is sinful behavior and does not merit approval from God. I believe the vast majority of those who oppose gay marriage feel the same way.
Our nation was founded more than 200 years ago on Christian principles, and the United States used to be a Christian nation. I, for one, will continue to oppose gay marriage not because gays are “bad” people, but because God’s word says homosexuality is wrong.
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Uh, Rob? The US was NEVER "a Christian nation" and was NEVER "founded ... on Christian principles" because a good many of the founding fathers were either atheist or agnostic.
You are apparently unaware that there's a little thingy about separation of church and state ... THAT'S one of the principles on which this nation was founded. You are free to worship or not as you please as long as you make no attempt to force those beliefs on the rest of us.
I do have a question for you ..... how "Christian-like" is it to hate? Simply because you "believe" something to be true doesn't make it so. The sad fact is that many, if not most, of those in opposition to gay marriage do so solely out of hate though (hypocrites that they are) they mask it with "religion".
Near as I can remember from my religious studies many (many LOL) moons ago, Jesus taught LOVE ONE ANOTHER. There was no qualifier (e.g.) "as long as they are just like you". I doubt that's changed over the years; pretty sure we'd have heard if Jesus had come back & amended his words.
Mr. Gardner, What is it that makes you feel that your religious beliefs should be forced on all of us? The terrible governments that have existed, and still do, because they are wrapped up with religion are something this country has, rightly, sought to avoid through the concept of separation of church and state. It's too bad you don't live in one of those countries, but you don't. Leave your religion out of the lives of the rest of us. By the way, your Bible is so full of contradictions and confusing passages as to not be a helpful guide in many ways.
I do not believe in your anti-gay god (that is, if you even interpret your human-written holy book correctly). There is nothing anyone could do or say to make me believe so. That IS MY RIGHT, and the right of all of us who have seen the hate, violence, destruction, misguidedness, and simple lack of common sense brought on by many religious practices, and who choose not to participate. To me, many religious beliefs (such as birth to a virgin) are absurd. If you need miracles to believe, then you don't have true faith. Faith is the opposite of such things.
We who are not believers in what these fairy tales and impossibilities are discriminated against by not being religious. We have a part-African-American president, but it'll be a long, long time until we have an atheist. God forbid I say anything like this in public - I might be attacked by good Christians.
Christians have no right to cause legal, government discrimination to others who don't share their religious views. What a horrible country this would be if that were so. Please stop trying to keep decent, committed couples from such actions as being able to visit partners in hospital intensive care rooms. How horrible for them - and not very Christian of you.
Almost all of laws are forcing the collective understanding of morality on to the population as a whole.
Much of the collection understanding of morality is based on regilious and/or philosophical beliefs.
The gay agenda crowd wants it to be illegal for a pastor/priest/preacher to teach that homosexuality is a sin. That would be a breach of the 1st admendment in so many ways.
Obama and Reid are against gay marriage too. I guess now you are going to scream and call them "haters", too. No?????.....hypocrites to the nth degree.
This is great, we are at war with the Taliban because they force their stiffling religion on everybody yet the reli-nuts in the US are "afraid" of gay marriage. Only in the US.
Look here, I am not gay, it's not my thing. When I was in the hospitality business I worked with a lot of gay people on a daily basis, they were some of the nicest, most well respected employees in the field. I also worked with "flamers" who were outrageous.
At the same time, I worked with many straight people who were nice and well respected, and I also worked with drunken trailer trash idiots.
Lumping people into "categories" doesn't help anybody but bigots. Let's be clear on this, ALL people on the earth have the capacity to be bigots. Gays, straights and in-betweens. We all have to live together so let's not have a book of curious origin and translational deficiencies become the rule of law. If you want to use it as a guide, go for it. I know people who worship trees and think the Lunar landings are a hoax and they are happy productive people. Let's get off our high horse and work on things that matter.
"The gay agenda crowd wants it to be illegal for a pastor/priest/preacher to teach that homosexuality is a sin. That would be a breach of the 1st admendment in so many ways."
Show me anyone who is advocating that? I want a cited quote, otherwise I believe you're making that up.
No one will stop a preacher from preaching intolerance - that's their right. What isn't right is saying that we're going to treat you like second-class citizens because of the relationship you have with another consenting adult.
How is it right for me to marry the woman I love, but not for my gay friend to marry the man or woman they love?
Marriage, despite its religious trappings, has secular elements to it. Why else would you have to get a marriage license from the state?
All we want (and by "we" I mean supporters of gay marriage, both straight and gay) is for any two adults to have the same right to get married whether they are heterosexual or homosexual. Churches can still preach what they preach, and can say they will only allow traditional marriages in their church - they're private institutions, they can do that.
Yes. In our theocracy, it's important that our invisible gods are given a say in legislating other people's rights. For example, my religion, the cult of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, proscribes death by stoning for practicing Christians. We picket their Sunday congregations, lobby Congress to restrict their rights, and remind them of the Flying Spaghetti Monster's wrath should they dare to maintain their ways. I mean: you're not "born" a Christian. You choose it. Why are these forelorn souls purposefully endangering their souls when it says clearly in our texts the punishment for Christianity is death. I will pray for them.
If there is no Intercourse, there is no Marriage...It's as Simple as that Both legally and spiritually! "and the two shall become ONE flesh" This is sex signed by GOD in Genesis. Also marriage is annuled legally if not consummated. Now all Gays have to figure out is how it is possible to have sex...Impossible as they are the SAME sex.
"The gay agenda crowd wants it to be illegal for a pastor/priest/preacher to teach that homosexuality is a sin. That would be a breach of the 1st admendment in so many ways."
Geez, jfNance32's straw man fallacies are so easy to see nowadays. He's really off the deep end.
adrian, you have just demonstrated the primary reason we (supposedly) have seperation of church and state in the Constitution.
I am over it, really. "I don't believe in it" The bible tells me so? That is the best you can come up with? No original thought in your that little bigoted brain of yours? Its okay to legally treat certain people as a separate class of citizens even though there is no verse but an amendment the says "equal protection under the law" that says it is wrong? A friend of mine's partner passed away after a 33 year relationship. There are bigots reading this who haven't broken a decade with a relationship but feel its okay that the surviving partner has to live with a death certificate that states his partner died single and he wasn't even put down as next of kin. That is wrong. I don't expect your religious organizations to bend to anyone's views, you can be as mixed up as you want. That is what this country is about, but don't impose your polluted philosophies on others. It is just wrong and quite frankly illegal and some day historically you will placed with other misguided people like those that opposed the freedom marchers in Selma.
I am in a heterosexual relationship who doesn't not believe in marriage. there are more and more of "US." (another "us" for you to worry about) What if we are happy the way are all? What we'd like is legal recognition of our status so we can partake in the benefits, some of which we help pay for with our taxes, that other couples get?
"I don't believe in it" Well folks times are changing. The bigots are on the wrong side of history on this one. Again.
DouglasDemocrat. We liberals don't want CARE what your priest tells you. We only care that you try to foist it on everyone. No one is forcing you to marry someone of the same sex and no one is forcing your church to either. What is it about "judge NOT" that you don't get? Live your life according to your beliefs and grant the rest of the world the same privilege.
Gay site praising that UK bans foreign preachers who preach against homosexuality and wishes that the USA do the same.
http://www.queerty.com/uk-to-ban-preache...
Sweden has passed a law making preaching against homosexuality a possible hate crime.
"Goran Lambertz, the Swedish chancellor of justice, declared in a formal note to the Riksdag that a church sermon describing homosexual practice as sinful "might" constitute a criminal offense under the law."
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2002...
EU is considering a law to ban speech in churches that preach homosexuality is a sin.
http://kc.csip.org.uk/viewdocument.php?a...
Gay site praising that UK bans foreign preachers who preach against homosexuality and wishes that the USA do the same.
_______
Good thing for you this isn't Europe, huh? Name me one thing in America that is illegal to talk about in church, short of threatening national security. You tell me who's rights are more infringed upon, a superstitious majority who's rationality for a bigoted position is "god told me to" (all the while ignoring the atrocities in the bible like "stoning disobedient children," rape, and genocide.
When you cease taking every word of the bible literally, you have by consequence selected your own morals. It's not god that tells you gay marriage is wrong, it's cafeteria christians deciding to interpret a couple passages to support their bigotry. If you don't consider the ENTIRE bible to be factual, how can you justify any of it?
correction** (I left out part of the 1st paragraph)
Good thing for you this isn't Europe, huh? Name me one thing in America that is illegal to talk about in church, short of threatening national security. You tell me who's rights are more infringed upon, a superstitious majority who's rationality for a bigoted position is "god told me to" (all the while ignoring the atrocities in the bible like "stoning disobedient children," rape, and genocide or a group of people who can't get tax breaks, hospital visitation rights, or adoption rights because they happen to be attracted to people of the same sex.
It is not surprising that jfNance32 would be outraged that Fred Phelps, a preacher who boycotts the funerals of war heroes, wouldn't be able to take a vacation to the United Kingdom. That is disgusting, jfNance32, and you should be ashamed.
Furthermore, the UK law bans hate speech, not sermons. "The ban rests on the government's legal powers to tackle violent extremism and incitement to religious and racial hatred. It does not permit somebody to be banned for simply holding disagreeable political views but will apply to those who advocate illegal means to further them."
You next example of Pastor Ake Green is stupidly out-of-date. So much so that it was overturned already. The Supreme Court later concurred.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/art...
Your wingnut hysteria? Debunked.
"DouglasDemocrat. We liberals don't want CARE what your priest tells you."
Sunvisitor, you have me confused with someone else. Reread my post - I SUPPORT gay marriage.
Huh, the Bible tells me to judge not... it says that judgment is only for "God," and that should I decide to undertake the Lord's work in judging people, I will be judged more harshly as punishment.
Then there is that pesky separation of church and state as already mentioned, which, if I am not mistaken, says that the laws of the Lord aren't to be applied as the laws of the land because, again, as already pointed out, the founding fathers were generally atheists... agnostics at best.
And, if I am not mistaken, wasn't it once argued that the Bible and the holy Christian trinity endorsed slavery?
Just a heads up, folks: the Bible is not the word of God. It is the word of monks and kings and aristocrats and societal well-to-dos who "clarified" it throughout the ages as they were translating it and producing additional copies.
It is 2009, people. Perhaps we can stop living like it is the middle ages. There is no almighty god to spite thee, and if gay people want to get married, how does that hurt anyone?
If it upsets the sanctity of the institution, then so too does adultery and divorce and domestic violence and child abuse and drug abuse and alcohol abuse and driving a car on Sundays or making dinner on the Sabbath or any of these other things that we have come to accept as ridiculous now.
So either admit you are a bigot, which you are, or learn to accept the reality of the world in which you live. But, for the love of your God (and I'm an atheist, BTW), maybe it is time to stop using Christianity and Jesus and the Bible as ways of rationalizing hate and bigotry.
The biggest bigot of the week is Perez Hilton!
Donald Trump is the biggest jerk for allowing Perez Hilton to open his ugly mouth. "Gay- marriage" is an oxymoron.
Is anyone listening? The Flying Spaghetti Monster will show HIS WRATH on practicing Christians! Repent now! You choose to be a Christian? Fine. But prepare NOT to get raptured when HIS spaghetti-like tentacles pull me up to Neverland and not you!!
Re: The biggest bigot of the week is Perez Hilton!
Donald Trump is the biggest jerk for allowing Perez Hilton to open his ugly mouth. "Gay- marriage" is an oxymoron.
______
Please provide a reason besides "it's in the bible" for why gay marriage is an "oxymoron." It shouldn't be a problem since you find it so absurd. When you bigots start providing secular reasons as to why gay marriage is harmful to society, the rational thinking population might take you guys seriously.
But what about the Flying Spaghetti Monster? Aren't you Christians afraid of HIS WRATH?
FSM: Chapter 1, verse 2-3
"And ye witnessed his wrath on the worshippers of the cross for their blatant rejection of truth. With foolishness in their hardened hearts, they scoff at the true Master."
Doesn't anyone care? This is real!
FSM: Chapter 3, verse 2-4
"Woe to those who bear the mark of the Cross. Shoud ye come across a group of them praying, take them away and kill them. Thou shalt not suffer a Christian to live."
See? Believe me now?!??!
Mr. Gardner,
This nation was in no way founded on Christian principles. You won't find representative democracy anywhere in the Bible. The founders argued long and loud about whether to cite the Bible in the Constitution. Not only did they decide against doing so, the Constitution specifically forbids the government from being involved in religion both in the First Amendment and in Article VI.
"...no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States."
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."
By "establishment of religion" the Constitution means that the government shall not establish a national religion. So making Leviticus the law is unconstitutional.
While we're on the subject of Leviticus, that book also says:
"And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death."
"And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, and all the congregation shall certainly stone him: as well the stranger, as he that is born in the land, when he blasphemeth the name of the Lord, shall be put to death."
So should we execute all adulterers and blasphemers? Should we enforce Leviticus as the law of the land?
For cryin' out loud, how does allowing gay people to enter into civil unions threaten anyone in any way? What church would be required to perform such a ceremony? Get over yourselves, folks.
Re: For cryin' out loud, how does allowing gay people to enter into civil unions threaten anyone in any way? What church would be required to perform such a ceremony? Get over yourselves, folks.
______
Funny, they never seem to present an answer to those questions.
Obama and Reid agree with me that gay marragie should be banned in states that wnnt it to be banned.
Also, Obama and Reid themselves are against gay marriage.
Reid supported Nevada's ban on gay marriage.
Re: Obama and Reid agree with me that gay marragie should be banned in states that wnnt it to be banned.
______
Who gives a crap? That doesn't make it right. It would have been political suicide for Obama to come out (no pun intended) in support of universal gay marriage. It's bad enough he has to pander to you religious zealots. Don't take his stance as some kind of victory for your discriminating practices.
No, jfNance32 wants us to think that Reid and Obama are just like him!
So I guess jfNance32 supports antidiscrimination laws, ending the Defense of Marriage Act, Don't Ask, Don't Tell, and federal recognition of domestic partnerships.
Oh, wait. Jfnance32 doesn't support that. He cowers behind Reid and Obama.
The GLBT community has much stronger allies in Reid and Obama than they will ever have in the wacky religious right.
Obama ended Don't Ask, Don't Tell.....when did he do that....in your La La land world.
I think he punted on that for later date.
Strong moral leadership those pair....Obama and Reid.....Oh by the way.....they are against gay marriage.
ksand99 makes them look two-face....they are against gay marriage, but down deep they are for it.
Courage....leadership........LOL
"Oh by the way.....they are against gay marriage."
Then why did they both vote against a constitutional amendment restricting marriage to only between a man and a woman? You've never answered that question. I wonder why...
They're so "against" gay marriage that they didn't want a constitutional amendment banning it? That, like you entire line of reasoning, makes no sense.
Ah, I see tomstaph is another Pastafarian. Ramen, my brother.
And may His Noodly Appendage grace your life :)
Nance, do you support civil unions?
"They're so "against" gay marriage that they didn't want a constitutional amendment banning it? That, like you entire line of reasoning, makes no sense."
You got me this time.
Either Obama and Reid are lying when they say: "I am against gay marriage."
or
They really mean it when they say: "I am against gay marriage."
Or you are a complete idiot.
You pick.
The Declaration of Independence refers to "the Creator:"
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
The First Amendment says "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...
I don't think anything says "separation of church and state".
I'm not really opposed to or in favor of gay marriage but it seems there are some misconceptions being talked about.
Patricia - are you part of the congregation of the reformed or conservative Pastafarians?
Ramen back to you.
tomstaph, I laughed so hard a noodle came out of my nose. I that sacrilegious?
Getalife - reformed or conservative?
getalife;
that is the single most cogent post you've written. Well done sir. And we even agree!
getalife;
well, the post before the noodling.
Awww... jfNance32 is mad.
Calling people names because he can't keep up with the argument?
You couldn't even answer the question.
Why did they both vote against a constitutional amendment restricting marriage to only between a man and a woman?
And this is the last place I'd expect to find a gaggle of FSM worshippers, but I'm very pleased. Ramen.
We do not "hate" Christians. We love them. We pray for them. We want to save. (FSM: CH 12, vs. 345: "Woe to those who prayeth yet believeth not. They shall be cast out into the lake of boiling marinara. Only through HIS crusty appendage can thou livest eternally in his bowl").
I'm trying Lord. I'm trying. They knowest not what they do. Peace.
jldour,
Since when does "Creator" mean "Christian G-d"?
Thomas Jefferson wrote the Declaration of Independence and he was no Christian.
Do you understand what "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion" means? Do a little reading and learn what this means, please. Start with "Freedom and the Court: Civil Rights and Liberties in the United States" by Henry J. Abraham.
I guess out of the three answers...you have correctly selected the one that fits you.
jnfnance
May the mercy of the Flying Spaghetti Monster be upon you.
Obama says: "I am against gay marriage."
Reid says: "I am against gay marriage."
Reid also releases a letter that says he would vote for the Nevada ban on gay marriage and his campaign says that Reid supports the Nevada ban on gay marriage 100%.
ksand99: Obama and Reid are for gay marriage.
Perfect lib logic.....
tomstaph, to put it out there, reformed. I used to be a mormon but got seriously tired of the insane hypocracy, now I freelance.
Interesting story, when the first Nevada prop came around the local mormon church leaders came to my house and told me how much money I needed to give to help defeat the gay's. That was pretty much the end of my "mormon" days.
I would be willing to look into the Flying Spaghetti Monster deal as long as good craft beer is allowed.
Reformed Pastafarian? How dare you challenge the original dogma! Blasphemer! Heretic! Master had no more than 10 noodly tentacles! Why does the reformist congregation insist on 12?
FSM (ch 3, vs. 444, "And with the spirit of 10 shall ye be touched by his grace").
Doesn't that mean anything to you?
OK - in all seriousness though, look at this pathetic debate I found on a Catholic forum debating the differences in the Trinity between the Orthodox and Catholic churches. Honestly, what a waste of time and intellect (this was the inspiration behind creating a heretical sect in the church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster). Read on and just laugh (does this make any sense or really matter at all??!!!)
"Unfortunately some of the Greeks say that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father alone. While Scripture does not say in explicit words that the Holy Spirit proceeds form the Son as it says the Son proceeds from the Father, nevertheless the teaching of the Church has a sound Scriptural basis. The Holy Spirit is called the Spirit of Jesus, the Spirit of the Son. This means He is breathed or spirated by the Son. The Holy Spirit receives from the Son, but the only thing He could receive is the divine nature. Jesus tells the Apostles He will send them the Holy Spirit, but the Son could not send the Holy Spirit on a temporal mission unless the Holy Spirit eternally proceeded from Him. For, since the Holy Spirit is God, the divine will concerning a temporal mission could not be intimated to Him unless the divine substance be eternally communicated to Him. Finally, the Second Council of Lyons says: "the Holy Spirit eternally proceeds from the Father and the Son . . . as from one principle . . . and by one spiration."
With arguments like this, it's only a matter of a few years before "Scripture" (whatever the hell that implies) gets steamrolled and gays and lesbians are finally awarded their long overdue dignity. If you haven't noticed, science has had this masterful, quiet, and humble ability to trump religion all throughout history.
JfNance32, you said Reid and Obama are against gay marriage.
I am asking you: then why did they vote against a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage?
You have chickened out and avoided answering the question. You've given noncommital answers, or "it could be either this or this or this!"
Tell me: in your opinion, JfNance32, why did they vote against the quickest way to ban gay marriage if they hate gay marriage so much?
Ksand99 - give it up. Let him quote his primitive text books until he's blue in the face. Just ask the idiot if there is one scientifically-based objection to gay marriage.
Why is Nance cowering?
Nance, do you support civil unions?
Does Flying Spaghetti Monster? THAT'S what matters. Stupid.
Supposing for a moment that anti-gays are correct in their interpretation of Leviticus and Romans. And let's see if that is really the standard that anti-gays use when it comes to granting civil rights.
God is very clear that a whole host of people do not merit his approval: pagans, menstruating women, disobedient children, worshipers of Baal, and the list goes on. And on.
Yet never do these guys seem to think that we should ban Pagan marriage or atheist marriage or disobedient children marriage. Heck, you gan get married dancing in the nude while worshiping Baal and sacrificing a goat. And they won't even bother to write into the paper about you.
After a while you come to realize that they've only picked one type of person out of the list to oppose. And you realize that what they object to about gay marraige isn't the "God doesn't like it" part; it's the "gay" part.
And then their argument becomes nothing more than animus, bias, and personal dislike.
And, by the way, you are all heritical. The REFORMED Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is the only one true holy and apostalic orthodox church. All others have been deceived by the sauce.
John F, I am just saying that the country was founded on religious principals. Certainly I am not an expert on the Declaration of Independence and such, but it seems to me that there are many religious symbols still used by the government even today. Our currency still refers to God, when President Obama was sworn in his hand was on the bible used when Abraham Lincoln was sworn in. I do however know that when Benjamin Franklin asked for a prayer before the constitutional convention started, he was turned down because the framers wanted that document to be secular. It's an interesting debate, just thought I could put my two cents in.
"JfNance32, you said Reid and Obama are against gay marriage."
I do not say that.
Reid says that he is against gay marriage.
Obama says that he is against gay marriage.
Perhaps you should ask them if they are lying.
I hope that is what you must be thinking or you could be just a crazy person who does not have the understand of the English language when a person says, "I am against gay marriage" that they mean that they are against gay marriage.
Perhaps it is one of those what does "is" mean things or "not any taxes...no tax of any type" things.
Here's a good debate on Larry King about gay marriage:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTE9zWaQc...
You decide.
"Reid says that he is against gay marriage.
Obama says that he is against gay marriage."
The question was, again, if Reid and Obama are so against gay marriage why did they vote against a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage? You can look up the roll call vote on the Senate web site.
It's a simple question, nance.
jfNance32 knows the answer. He's too afraid to admit it.
I would also like to know if jfNance32 supports civil unions.
Wow.....so many libs have a problem with standing plain English. Now I understand why they have those lame crazy ideas.
Reid and Obama are not for a Federal gay marriage ban.
Both are for the states banning gay marriage.
Reid released a letter where he said that he voted for Nevada's gay marriage ban.
Now, watch Obama. See his lips move. Hear him say these words.
Obama: "I am not in favor of gay marriage. I believe marriage is between a man and a women."
http://think.mtv.com/044FDFFFF0098989A00...
Reid: "He feels this is an issue best addressed at the state level and not through a constitutional amendment," Manley said of Reid.
Reid, the Senate minority leader, agrees with the church in that marriage should be between a man and a woman, said Sharyn Stein, a spokeswoman for the senator. In the past, he voted in favor of the Defense of Marriage Act, which defines marriage as between a man and a woman and allows states to deny marriagelike unions that are recognized in other states."
http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2...
Libs translation of the above: "Reid and Obama are for gay marriage."
Now does everybody understand on how twisted the lib mind is.
So they are against gay marriage, but only on a state level? They're for gay marriage on a federal level? Or are they not as "against" gay marriage as you claim?
How is one "against" it when they won't vote against it?
It follows that the easiest way to ban gay marriage is through a constitutional amendment. Neither Reid nor Obama voted for a constitutional amendment. Nance apparently thinks rhetoric trumps action. How cute!
Meanwhile, he still won't answer such a simple 'yes or no' question. Why are you hiding, Nance?
Nance, do you support civil unions for same-sex couples?
Obama is against gay marriage....he says so. I guess theBS is calling him a liar.
Reid is against gay marriage. He says so and he released a letter saying he would vote for Nevada's constitutional gay marriage ban. I guess theBS is calling him a liar.
Lib Democrats are liars??????
Say it ain't so!!!!!
What is the world coming to!!!!!
I am hearing you, theBS.
Must be hard accusing your heros of being liars.
It must be done.
Good courage, theBS....keep up the good work.
Geez, someone's a little 'fraidy cat.
He's afraid to answer a simple question.
JfNance32, do you support civil unions?
I guess poor Nance isn't familiar with the creature many of us know as "politicians."
He gleefully believes anything our politicians say. He doesn't take into account their actions. What? Their actions don't match their rhetoric? "Who cares?" thinks Nance. "All that matters is what they *say*!"
Ah, to live in such ignorance. Must be nice there, Nance.
Hey, by the way, do you favor civil unions for same-sex couples?
"He gleefully believes anything our politicians say. He doesn't take into account their actions. What? Their actions don't match their rhetoric? "Who cares?" thinks Nance. "All that matters is what they *say*!""
Thank you thank you thank you.....
You are saying that Obama and Reid are two-faced. They say one thing but do another thing.
They are lying politicans.
I am Ok with that and would totally agree with it. They are really down deep for gay marriage but they lie to the people and say that they are against gay marriage.
In 2010, can Republicans say that Reid is really for gay marriage based on his actions as you put it? I surely hope so.
But you keep arguing that they are against gay marriage. Now you are saying the opposite?
LOL, you debunked yourself!
You are totally hopeless.
Hey, only one of us is known as the Black Hole of Logic, and it isn't me.
But you want to argue that you agree with Reid and Obama, who are against gay marriage, AND you hope your party can attack Reid for being FOR gay marriage... and you don't see that as contradictory.
Must be pretty dark in that black hole.
Ksand - I'm believe marriage is between a man a woman and you call me biggot, homophobe, etc.
Obama believes marriage is between a man and a woman and you call him God. Explain the double standard.
I know you hang on to Obama's every word, so hang on to these:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6K9dS9wl...
Awww. PuppyDawg's following me around again!
"I'm believe marriage is between a man a woman and you call me biggot, homophobe, etc."
Really? Did I? I don't remember doing so. Yay, baseless allegations! Plus, I'm not dumb enough to misspell bigot. Or is "biggot" a new french term I'm unaware of? I don't speak french, you know. Ever since your side waged a war on french fries, I've cleansed my palate of all things cherchez la femme.
"Obama believes marriage is between a man and a woman and you call him God. "
Really? Did I call him God? Nope. Do I give him credit for voting against a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage? Yup. Do I give him credit for wanting to repeal the Defense of Marriage Act? Yup. Do I think his views will evolve on gay marriage? They have a greater likelihood than anyone on the right.
Does Puppy need his belly scratched? Bad dog!
"But you want to argue that you agree with Reid and Obama, who are against gay marriage, AND you hope your party can attack Reid for being FOR gay marriage... and you don't see that as contradictory."
Simple questions:
Is Obama for or against gay marriage?
Is Reid for or against gay marriage?
What a country, America. I love it.
Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
Unless your gay, black, or a woman.
JNance:
Do you favor civil unions for same-sex couples?
Look...a marriage is Not a marriage without being consummated by sexual Intercourse. Intercourse in the dictionary means sexual CONNECTION. If this doesn't happen, it is legally Annulled ! If you Gays just don't get it, it Must be because your brains are wired Wrong or you need a course in Biology..eg.Hint; the anus is for feces going out not coming in...Opposite of INTERcourse.
Nance: Do you favor civil unions for same-sex couples?
Oh, how cute. Now jfNance32 wants to ask questions. Even though he won't answer such a simple one that everyone's been asking him.
Tell you what, jfNance32, I will answer both of your questions when you answer the one that everyone is asking of you: do you support civil unions for same-sex couples?
To PatriciaLV and others with similar misconceptions: Because christians believe in God's word as opposed to man's popular beliefs, it doesn't mean we hate gays. We just don't agree with the lifestyle. The reference in the book of Leviticus is right between incest and beasteality, to give some indication of how God views it. Anyone can see that the anatomy of a man and a woman go naturally together, but man and man, or woman and woman is unnatural. The bible also says "Let God be true, but everyman a liar."
To The Word:
That's nice that you believe that is what the Bible says. Fortunately for all of us, we are not a theocracy. You are allowed to believe what you want to believe, but you do not have the right to make laws that discriminate against others based on those beliefs.
Almost all laws in the USA are based on the collective understanding of morality.
Much of that collective understanding of morality is based on religion and secular philsophy.
It is how democracy works.
For example, some people want to marry more than one person. We have laws against that. The law is based on religious beliefs of the New Testament where Paul recommends that a man should have only one wife.
Who here likes fish sticks?
That, Nance, was a punt.
I cannot believe how much of a coward you are being. Do you support civil unions for same-sex couples?
Are you having a hard time reading today?
If the Bible is the basis by which we, as a Democracy, determine the rights and priveliges granted by marriage, and to determine what is a "sin", then the entire country should wholeheartedly embrace a constitutional ammendment that "protects" marriage. That said, you should keep in mind that for every mention of "homosexuality" in the Bible there are at least five passages condeming adultery. In fact Adultery, and not Homosexuality, is one of the few "sins" clearly forbidden in the Ten Commandments. So if we are to take every illogical, outdated Biblical premise at its face value then anyone in America who has gotten a divorce, or plans to, due to committing adultery (which is lovingly and quaintly referred to by God-fearing Heterosexuals as "having an affair") should keep in mind, that according to the Bible, they are to be stoned to death. Quoth the "Scriptures" - that bastion of common sense and modern law.
A gay union is not incest, it's not polygamy, it's not beastiality or any other thing already addressed in common sense law. That is why we are now seeing people race about attempting to write laws that heretofore did not exist to discriminate against people with whom they do not agree. It's just that simple. So don't get your panties in a twist folks. If you truly believe in the Bible there is no doubt that you personally have a lot more to worry about than your gay neighbors. Take a good peruse through Romans and Leviticus before the next time you plan on going to Red Lobster. You can't cherry pick morality from the Bible.
I knew the gay agenda would one day be the down fall of this nation. There is no winning on this one, just shut up and be as PC as possible
Funny, I always knew it would be a lack of punctuation.
I've tried to understand christianity and it's moral teachings and here is my summary:
In the old testament god hates the Amalekites and frequently askes for them to be slaughtered: men, women, children and infants. Slavery is fine but eating shellfish is an abomimation.
God can be very jeaslous and frequently kills people. Though once you're dead he'll leave you alone.
In the new testament Jesus comes along and introduces the idea of hell. According to him "anyone who says 'you fool' should fear the fire of hell". Jesus may torture you for eternity for thinking things that he doesn't aprove of.
Also the same God who created hell and threatens people with eternal torture says he loves you, he want's you to love and to fear him. Under some circumstances pardon's will be given and people can avoid hell and so we should be very grateful.
The Bible should be used as the basis of all moral teaching.
mmm, I think I'll stick to Reformed Pastafarianism. ( http://reformed-pastafarianism.org/)