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The power of the desert
Yes, solar electricity generated here could run the country; but no, it was never a formal plan
Sunday, April 5, 2009 | 2 a.m.
Chris Morris
Enlargeable graphic: How large is 10,000 square miles?
Sun Archives
- Solar firm sees bright future here (3-27-2009)
- Solar developers shoot to beat buzzer for cash (3-22-2009)
- Small-scale solar seeks incentives (3-16-2009)
- State faces obstacles to cashing in on the sun (3-9-2009)
- NV Energy asks about stopping renewable fees (2-27-2009)
- Solar company to focus on manufacturing (2-23-2009)
- Green can fatten Nevadans' wallets, too (8-20-2008)
People unfamiliar with Nevada’s vast desert often find it more difficult to see what is there than to imagine what could be superimposed on the seemingly endless landscape.
Nuclear waste wedged inside a mountain.
Towering mushroom clouds.
A network of nuclear missiles covering 10,000 square miles.
These days, a very different image is evoked for 10,000 square miles of Nevada desert: a 100-mile-by-100-mile square of solar panels, enough to furnish the entire country with electricity.
The image is a metaphor, not a plan.
It has been evoked for over a decade, repeated by scientists, solar promoters, politicians and journalists. As renewable energy has become more popular, so has the vision of a swath of Nevada blanketed with shining solar panels.
A scientist named Roland Hulstrom, now acting director of photovoltaic solar for the National Renewable Energy Laboratories, came up with it.
About a dozen years ago, scientists at the Denver-based laboratories were growing frustrated by a common but misinformed notion that the country could never rid itself of gas and coal power because the alternatives would take up too much land.
Hulstrom set out to prove that the shift to renewable energy wouldn’t require paving over the entire country with solar panels. It would merely take up the equivalent of about 11 percent of Nevada.
Hulstrom calculated the figure based on the nation’s energy use, the efficiency of solar panels and the amount of sunlight drenching the desert. To a Power Point presentation on solar energy, he added a picture of the state of Nevada with a giant square in the middle to represent the area.
In 1999, John Turner, another National Renewable Energy Laboratories scientist, published the calculations in Science Magazine. Eventually the idea made its way onto the Department of Energy Web site. The media began to repeat the idea, beginning in a 2001 National Public Radio interview with a solar lobbyist.
A star factoid was born. The only downside: In the retelling, people sometimes incorrectly state the size of the area.
Over the years the calculations have been updated to reflect increases in the nation’s energy consumption and the efficiency of solar technology. Renewable Energy Laboratories spokesman George Douglas said the calculations were last done in 2005.
Conveniently, the result has stayed the same. As energy consumption increased, so, too, did the efficiency of solar panels.
It could have been anywhere in the Southwest, Douglas said. Hulstrom chose Nevada not for the usual reasons the state becomes a proposed home for schemes — the land can look like a blank slate, the federal government owns 86 percent of the state.
Instead, Douglas said, Hulstrom chose Nevada because gauges at the Nevada Test Site were measuring the area’s solar potential. That made the calculations easier.
The idea was never intended to be taken literally.
“It’s not a serious proposal for a dozen different reasons,” Douglas said. “Imagine the size of the transmission lines. It would be ridiculous. And think of national security. One spot goes and the whole country goes dark.”
Instead, Douglas likes to take the imagined a step further. The giant solar square in the desert explodes into thousands of little pieces lighting up the entire country.
“That’s the beauty of solar — that you don’t have to have it all in one place,” Douglas said. “It’s just a way of helping people visualize in the vast scheme of things what this quantity actually looks like.”
The image, however, is relevant as Nevada contemplates whether to build big or small as it seeks to become a solar powerhouse.
No one is proposing a single site here that approaches 10,000 square miles, or even 100 square miles. The largest plant so far is 0.4 square miles, but projects that would consume more desert are in the planning stages.
As of January, 1,127 square miles of solar plants have been proposed in applications to the Bureau of Land Management. The largest single project would take up 48 square miles.
Depending on their location, utility-scale projects are likely to be controversial with some rural Nevada residents. In addition to the utility-scale projects, some in the solar industry would like to encourage more small-scale projects erected where the energy is consumed.
“People always say there’s nothing out there in the desert, so let’s put solar and everything else,” said Rob Mrowka, conservation advocate of the Center for Biological Diversity, who favors solar plants in certain desert locations. “They don’t think about the richness that does exist in the desert and the vistas, the openness, the spiritual values people get from that openness.”
Back in Denver, Douglas and others at Renewable Energy Laboratories are pleased that the image has helped people understand the nation’s energy equation, but they wonder how many times they have to say it: It’s 100 miles square, not 100 square miles.
Discussion: 36 comments so far…
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Think about the Environmental Impact Statement on this project; the NIMBY Effect; where will Desert Tortoises live, Desert Bighorns?; and this would be off limits to firearms. These are a few reasons why Alternative Energy doesn't work in most places!
This sounds likea great idea that will never become a reality.
ALTERNATIVE ENERGY WORKS EXCELLENT IN MOST PLACES. There are just a lot of un-imformed or mis-informed people who never even see a glimpse of the future, that continue to misinform people. Ask anyone who already has a wind turbine or someone who already has solar panels on their home. Solar panels are now down to $2.70 a watt or lower wholesale. They are projected to be down to $1.00 a watt or less by the end of 2010.(source solar today). Firethorne, just keep paying NV energy bills with the 16% plus increase (source las vegas sun) they are now asking for.
Just DO IT!
It's about time REAL IDEAS & REAL SOLUTION were put on the table; as if everyone filling up with used restaurant french-fry oil was a solution! "I'll have 2 Big Macs, an Apple Turnover, a Coke, and Fill it Up with french-fry oil."
Desert tortoises will all live on the BLM "ranch" that is established by Searchlight. Look at a map, that leaves the rest of Nevada for solar.
This is to easy for me; Iowa has Corn, California has Fruits and Nuts, Idaho has spuds, Kansas has Wheat, DC has Idiots and Nevada has Solar. We all contribute.
The "Oil" men in Congress will never allow this to happen.
Good article by Alexandra Berzon. Good to see that she covers both sides of the issue.
There is no way that you can power the US on solar alone. Or wind. There is no way to store this energy. There will be coal, nuclear and natural gas. It is a myth that 100 square miles can actually do this. In fact, it is laughable BS!
Plus, there will always be the NIMBY's that the urban name callers hate so much. You just can't take all that land-even with Reid's plans for eminent domain. Urban roof tops will have to be included. This 100 square mile myth simply will never happen.
And what about all of you NIMBY's who refuse to put solar panels on your roof? Why are you not making any contributions? You will be paying for these solar facilities. Your rates will go up 10 to 50 cents for every one of these they build. Look it up! I'll bet people in Vegas will start getting vocal when more and more of their smoking and drinking money ends up going to their energy bill. The Obama followers will turn on their holy man when their favorite road is closed for a solar panel field and when their electric bills are doubled.
Clean energy produced on the roof does not pay for Reid's promise to give the big energy companies all of the wealth. There actually are ways to produce clean energy that do not require putting an over priced mess of power lines and glass mirrors in every direction. You can have wildlife, open space and clean power. Too bad that the big energy companies have bought their way into all the propaganda. The inconvenient truth of Al Gore's new economy is that it will be an environmental disaster in the southwestern US.
"Desert tortoises will all live on the BLM "ranch" that is established by Searchlight. Look at a map, that leaves the rest of Nevada for solar.
This is to easy for me; Iowa has Corn, California has Fruits and Nuts, Idaho has spuds, Kansas has Wheat, DC has Idiots and Nevada has Solar. We all contribute."
How are YOU contributing? I vote we put a wind mill on YOUR roof. If you don't like the noise, too bad. We all have to contribute! Don't be a NIMBY!
I love this post. It is the poster child for urban stupidity! We can stack all of the tortoises vertically so they can all fit on the ranch near Searchlight. We can hire people to feed them carrots when they get hungry!
Great article, thanks for covering both sides and many perspectives of the renewable energy debate.
Also, I have to note, that our electricity bills will be going up to cover NV Energy's new infrastructure costs: do you think they wouldn't go up even more when they start building all these industrial-scale solar power plants?
Come to a Solar NV meeting. Lots of people in town are working to make this happen. There are environmental, geopolitical and national security reaasons we should do this. Fossil fuel is finite, it is stupid to pay for oil from countries like Saudi Arabia, Iran and Venezuala that want to destroy us and carbon based fuels are making the planet unihabitable for humans. Write Senator Reid and "Mr. No: John Ensign today. Let them know.
http://www.congress.org/congressorg/offi...
Electricity produced in Nevada can not power the entire country - the power line losses to transmit the electricity to east of the Mississippi are just too great. Besides, what will the country use when Nevada is in the dark or under clouds - stable fossil and nuclear power plants that's what. Needing to have double the generating capacity will add 30% to each kwhr cost.
As to comments about installing home systems, these cost between $25000 and $50000 dollars which will never pay for themselves without huge rebates subsidized by those who don't have the systems. If everyone gets them, then obviously there is no way to subsidize the systems. Additionally, by what right does Nevada think they can charge other states' citizens for this subsidy?
Solar is not being used on a wide scale for a reason - it is presently far too expensive and unreliable as well as having significant negative impacts on the environment. Someday it might be viable, but it is not now.
Unfortunately due to feel good politics, Nevadans will have more unemployment as business leave due to the requirement to use 25% renewable energy is invoked - paying 2x or 3x the present cost will drive everyone out of Nevada.
Not too mention that 95 percent of all the renewable energy produced in Nevada will be sold to California. Seems hypocritical to say that we should not import our energy when the same people who want energy independence don't even care about using their own local energy. Industrial renewable energy in Nevada will not only destroy the environment, but it will be exported. The Governor will not even accept a tax from California companies who produce their renewable energy in Nevada. Kind of like the gold mines from Canada. Come to Nevada, destroy the landscape and groundwater with pollution from gold mines. Don't even pay Nevada for it. Nevada politicians roll over for these big energy and mining giants all the time. They get a contribution and end up screwing the people of Nevada.
"As to comments about installing home systems, these cost between $25000 and $50000 dollars which will never pay for themselves without huge rebates subsidized by those who don't have the systems."
The US government is using our tax dollars soon to give away grants to big solar companies to make industrial power plants out in the desert, up to 30% of the costs of construction. We could give these same grants to the solar companies that manufacture photovoltaic panels for home use, thus bringing the price way down for the consumer. Oh, I forgot, that eliminates the profits that go to the utilities if we all get off the grid.
Several cities in California use feed-in-tariffs, local government loans, and power purchase agreements to make solar power for homes very affordable (or even at no cost up-front). We just have to get our politicians' heads out of the corporate feeding trough to enact some local laws that help US!
Whine, whine, whine!!
Just:
a) Pull up your pants
b) Roll up your sleeves
c) Hard work
d) Imagination
and a workable answer will evolve!!
I am not sure which is more silly of a "news" source.....the DailyKos or the Las Vegas Sun.
Blaring in the headline is a statement that solar power can feed the entire nation's power supply.
That is a very foolish statement to make.
First, there is not one single major solar power plant on the planet that generates 24/7 reliable power.
Second, the best that they can do is generate power for 12 to 14 hours and that is with expensive power storage systems and that is only during the bright summer months.
Third, it would be extremely expensive to run tranmission lines over the Rocky mountains.
This paper is getting silly day by day.
VegasJ - Agree completely and there are lots of people out there, who are not posting here, LOL, who are working hard to make this happen.
Thermal solar plants do generate power 24/7 and photovoltaic produces it during peak times when its need most.
We are not going to let Europe and China beat us in developing this technology. We led the industrial revolution and we will lead the energy revolution.
Only the human race would see an opportuntiy for free, clean energy, and then not take advantage of it. Or something such as cloning and biomanufacturing food, which could save millions of people from starving, but not submit there resrouces to that either.
"Thermal solar plants do generate power 24/7 "
Name one major thermal solar plant that generates power 24/7.
Yep....complete silence because there are none.
It is silly people that say stuff like that will make our energy policy become a weight around our necks in 15 to 30 years.
Dear Nye county Local, You can buy all the panrls necessary, the controler, and the inverter for about $4.50 to 5.00 watt shopping online and if you can plug 2 wires together you can probably install it yourself. Typicaly a home needs from 2000 to 4000 incoming watts to offset your electric bill. Bobmbard Electric (the solar leader in Nevada) charges from $12.00 to 16.00 a watt installed. Too pricey for me. I bought my solar and wind on line and 2400 watts runs my freezer, refrigerattor, TV, Stereo, and most hand tools. it is simple, it does work. So there all you doubting Thomases! Hope this helps you.
Solar and wind power does not have to located all in one spot. In Iowa, Texas, and other states up the midwest corridor have Windmills in all parts of their states. It is said there is enough windpower in North and South Dakota to power America also. Again this is only for comparison. Every windmill, every solar installation, every homeowner who adds wind or solar, helps to keep one more barrel of oil from a foriegn country. T. Boone pickens plan is good. In a few years the Mid East can drink their oil.
Solar and wind power has very little to deal with oil consumption.
T. Boone Pickens's plan is to have cars powered by natural gas. He wants wind power to replace the electrical power that is generated by natural gas so that natural gas can be dedicated to power cars. He also wants offshore drilling and ANWR opened. Nobody in power in DC is supporting his plan.
Again, another comment that demostrates that the left is so full of kool-aid that they will ruin our energy structure.
Solar proponents will have to overcome a very powerful opposition from the Coal lobby in Washington. Lobbiest payoffs to our wonderful Senators has dictated how this country is run for far too long.
Following is a brief explanation about concentrated solar power, the various storage technologies that exist today and links to the Department of Energy, National Renewable Energy Laboratory and several others where you will find all the information you need to explain this technology. I'm surprised you dont know this because Nevada Solar One is a concentrated Solar plant. You can close your eyes and your ears but this change is coming.
Heat storage allows a solar thermal plant to produce electricity at night and on overcast days. This allows the use of solar power for baseload generation as well as peak power generation, with the potential of displacing both coal and natural gas fired power plants. Additionally, the utilization of the generator is higher which reduces cost.
Heat is transferred to a thermal storage medium in an insulated reservoir during the day, and withdrawn for power generation at night. Thermal storage media include pressurized steam, concrete, a variety of phase change materials, and molten salts such as sodium and potassium nitrate
Solar Tres is a planned 15 MW power plant based on solar thermal energy. It is located west of the city of Ecija, in Andalusia, Spain.[1]
Solar Tres is based on the solar power tower concepts pioneered in the U.S.'s Solar One and Solar Two demonstration projects. Solar Tres uses a molten salt as its working fluid, allowing it to be stored in the molten state for power generation at any time.
The project, which has received a subsidy of five million Euro from the European Commission, makes use of the Solar Two technology tested in Barstow, California, but will be approximately three times the size. Solar Tres will make use of several advances in technology since Solar Two was designed and built.[2] These include:[3]
Although the turbine will be only slightly larger than that at Solar Two, the larger heliostat field and thermal storage system will enable the plant to operate 24 hours a day during summer and have an annual capacity factor of approximately 65%
Department of Energy Solar concentrating basics
http://www1.eere.energy.gov/solar/csp_ba...
National Renewable Energy Laboratoty
http://www.nrel.gov/learning/re_csp.html...
Another description of concentrated solar power
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2008/0...
Good old wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_power...
Nevada Solar One Concentrated Solar Power right here at home
http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/rea/...
.[55][56]
"Thermal solar plants do generate power 24/7 and photovoltaic produces it during peak times when its need most:"
They also require 6 acre feet of water per megawatt. Nevada can not sustain that. So now we have to build a desalinization plant and a pipeline! What's another five billion dollars? Your power bill will be so high, you'll need to burn candles to read it at night! The dreamers and the hope preachers are fine, they just are short a couple of tea spoons of reality!
24/7 also means winter. That will not stay warm in December, January, February, March, October, November. So we have to back it up with a base load. Now we are back to natural gas, coal and nuclear. You can run batteries charged from the roof at night. CSP tecnology is dated and inefficient because it requires an arid desert with sunny days and way too much water. The dry cooled plants can not produce nearly as much power and cost a lot more to run. All of the links in the world won't change that. Solar One in El Dorado Valley is a dinosaur. No more CSP plants for that part of Nevada. Why? All the water has been appropriated and when you have to build massive power lines, it helps if you can hook up the the Hoover Dam line that was already there. Obama's three thousand miles of transmission lines will mostly go back east. No money for such nonsense! The arm chair scientists on the Internet can read all the info they want on line but at some point, there has to be a reality check...
Sun Lizard,
You are not an credible source.
Please provide references where we can check your facts. Put up or shut up.
Fortunately the majority of Americans believe in this technology, "drill baby drill" is dead, and we only have to listen to this fossil fuel nonsense and not live it.
Only one person has attempted to post something about 24/7 power from a major solar plant.
All they could post are experimential small plants and not a major commerical plant actually in production.
Funny that they do not list the cost of power from those experimental plants because it would be in the strato-sphere range.
Just a FYI, the plant located south of Vegas does not generate 24/7 power.
All coal, Natural gas, oil, and many of the new solar thermals use massive amounts of water, about 25 percent of all the fresh water used in America. Why dont the power companies put a condensing coil over the steam vents and reclaim all the distilled water and sell it back to the water district? Is that too simple?
Alexandra Berzon has written a thoughtful, informative article that attempts to clarify the myth surrounding a factoid that often causes a lot of confusion.
It seems that half the commentators did not even read the text.
Bottom line: Energy and water efficiency = Solution
If we can't get along comfortably with the amount of natural, real-time energy in the world, we are doomed to fail.
Too many people are addicted to ancient sunlight and have no clue how unique and profligate our energy use has been over the last several decades within the historical context of human history.
Our current fossil/nuclear energy paradigm is an anomaly, not a right!
Thanks Alexandra. Keep up the good work!
"You are not an credible source.
Please provide references where we can check your facts. Put up or shut up.
Fortunately the majority of Americans believe in this technology, "drill baby drill" is dead, and we only have to listen to this fossil fuel nonsense and not live it."
Very cliche and predictable. You don't have to be an oil person to see the problems with your "logic". As far as the references, you can gather enough info from this web site alone to see how expensive and how much water this kind of renewable energy will use. Look it up. I'm not going to babysit you.
I will once again give Alexandra a thumbs up for writing a great article.
Well, I've got the DOE and NREL and operating power stations to support my case and provided the links.
You've got "I'm not going to babysit you" , cause you've got nothing.
Like I said. Put up or shut up.
Jfinance - You are right. Solar One is not 24/7 but it is concentrated solar. The plant in Spain is not a "small experimental plant" and if you had read the link you would know that. That is why I post links. There is no substance to support your statements. They are just your opinions. Anyone who is genuinely interested in the subject can follow my links. These aren't my opinions - they are facts. But then you guys all seem to have trouble with that.
Do you guys all work for oil companies or what? Anyway, I'm done on this thread. But I'll be around to myth-bust your crazy, unscientific and wrong comments.
"Solar Tres is a planned 15 MW power plant based on solar thermal energy. It is located west of the city of Ecija, in Andalusia, Spain"
15mw is a very very small output when compared to commerical power production plants.
The average size of a coal power plant in the USA is around 230mw.
Also, your article admits that it only generates limited power at 65% capacity during its 24 hour period and that is only during the summer months.
During the winter months where there will be many cloudy days it does not generate 24 hour power.
You have still failed to list one major (at least 150mw or higher) solar power plant that generates 24/7 reliable power.
"Anyway, I'm done on this thread. "
Thank you. Ignorance has no limits.
To manufacture solar cells uses galium, arsenic and other infintely long lived deadly elements. Yucca Mountain is nothing compared to the long lived waste for solar cells and batteries to store its energy.
If it sounds too good to be true, it is. Solar is a fool's errand in Democratic sheep clothing, not to mention that a single massive energy source would be a terrorist's dream target.
Wake up people and realize you are being played by the socialist left who wants to destroy free America as we know it and replace it with their version of controlled utopia. You don't see Hollywood elite or Pelosi giving up their jets to ride on trains, etc!
Green Energy is in a bubble and when people begin to realize how wasteful American's are they'll learn that conservation is more effective than green energy.
How about we just use less?
Stop looking for a panacea, there is none.
100 miles square of solar panels wouldn't make a dent in the amount of energy the US requires. Even with wind mills we might get close %20 of the nations power. How do we supply the other %80? ANSWER: USE LESS!