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Published Saturday, Feb. 23, 2008 | 4:59 p.m.
Updated Tuesday, Nov. 25, 2008 | 1:18 p.m.
Delegates and alternates crowd the hallway leading to Bally's convention center as they wait to get in to the Clark County Democratic Convention Saturday, Feb. 23, 2008.
The Clark County convention wrapped around 4 p.m., after supporters from both campaigns voted to suspend the presidential delegate vote.
When convention chair Bill Stanley initially moved to suspend voting earlier in the afternoon, the assembled delegates revolted and voted the motion down. The campaigns then met with supporters in separate rooms to explain why suspending the vote was necessary.
The lights are up, the balloons are coming down and a horde of angry Democrats have left the building. The Sunday Sun will tell you what went wrong.
It was a crazy day. I wrote about my experience at http://torqopia.blogspot.com/
Holy crap!
The Washoe County Convention was long but it was a piece of cake overall and Matt Dickson, the County Convention Chair, did a wonderful job!! Obama won the most delegates, of course.
Todays Clark County Democratic Covention was a perfect reason why we should be a Primary State.
Not only were we not able to vote for our candidate, Nevada ended up the laughing stock of the national election. They can talk all they want about having too many people being a good problem. You can take your Caucus's and put them you know where.
Here's a link to the Washoe County Dem convention and it talks about the Clark County Dem Convention fiasco:
http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/articl...
I want our primary back too!
While there were some Dems who were angry, most felt relief that everyone would get a chance to vote and that every vote would count. As the convention adjourned, there were hordes gathered around the booths selling Democratic t-shirts and bumper stickers. Hardly the actions of those who have lost faith in their party. It was a fascinating process to watch.
Now's the time to start planning the 2012 PRIMARY.
I stood in a line for an hour last night and then sat on the floor for four hours today. I was not amused!!
I was born a Democrat in 1960. I was a caucus chair and precinct captain on January 19th. I was also elected at my caucus to be a delegate to the Clark county democratic convention. As we all know the county convention didn’t go well and as always we may never know why. As a Obama supporter I’m very concerned that all the party officials at the convention were Clinton people. The only undeclared unbiased party official to attend was Senator Harry Reid. But Obama support was there in seemingly greater numbers than what was reported on January 19th that may help overcome the fact that nearly all Nevada Democratic Party officials are working for and supporting the Clintons.
As an elected delegate to the convention I would like to remind my fellow delegates that we are elected officials sent to the convention by our friends and neighbors to represent their wishes for our candidate. We stood up and said we would be inconvenienced to stand for our candidate, that we would take the time and make the effort to complete the process. I for one will not let my fellow citizens down and will stand for Obama as many times as it takes.
I'm with ya, RSN - and great speech in the Bronze Room by the young man going to school in (Minnesota, was it?) who will come back to Nevada as many times as it takes to ensure an accurate and organized convention is held. I look forward to the reconvening of the convention and feel confident that, with both campaigns involved in the planning this time, we will have a venue of adequate space and organization and ballot integrity.
At the Jan 19 caucus our precinct (run by Hillary supporters) released everyone after the 2nd alignment because everyone was so impatient to leave. I stayed behind to ask when and how the delegates were going to be determined. The Pct Capt told me, "Oh, that usually just falls upon the captains to take care of." I stayed to make sure delegates were apportioned correctly and signed on as an alternate delegate (for Obama) at that time.
I went to the Jefferson Jackson Dinner in NOv at Bally's and experienced first-hand the disorganization and frustrations of that event.
While standing in the long line at 4pm on Friday to register for the county convention, I told folks around me there were some 2,000 people or more at the JJD so I was really fearful of what was going to happen on Saturday with at least 7,000 people showing up - and both campaigns telling supporters to come and bring friends and family. What was the county party thinking (or not thinking)?!??
While I too was very frustrated and inconvenienced out of my Saturday, I was also disheartened that so many people didn't understand the motion to open recess the first time around. There were folks who also didn't understand what the purpose of the convention was.
I was surprised when I heard that thousands of delegates/alternates weren't even able to get in. When the 2 campaigns split up to caucus (meet) to explain and discuss the motion more thoroughly, I was surprised to learn that the delegates who had been on the convention floor had no idea there were hundreds and hundreds of us alternate delegates s who had been waiting (sitting and sleeping on the floor, doing yoga, confused, frustrated, angry) for over 4 hours before we split to caucus.
I was thankful, however, that our Obama campaign had the planning and organization to reserve those Bronze rooms and that water was available for us (the hotel staff did an AWESOME job of keeping the rapidly depleted water tanks replaced and the rapidly filled trash bags replaced). If it hadn't been for that, the Bronze rooms probably would have been booked with another meeting and I don't even want to THINK about where we (alternates and guests) would have been sequestered for those 4 hours!!!
Take 2 I fear is going to have a short fuse so let's hope at least the venue is large enough.
Let's get real everyone - this is the tsunami many politico's have been predicting would happen - and it's a wonderful, historical event!
What happened is that because the Nevada STATE Democratic Party failed to adequately train the Temporary Precinct Chairs a great deal of work did not get completed and caused an unbelievable amount of confusion leading up to the County Convention. So, we had a lot of problems caused by the ineptitude of the NSDP to try and correct before, or during, the County Convention.
Then factor in that BOTH campaigns have been doing a fantastic job energizing and turning out the base for both Clinton and Obama - and no one, including the campaigns, can honestly say they knew, in advance, what a tsunami of support would pour forth!
The newly elected progressives in the Clark County Democratic Party are the best people we've ever had in leadership positions - but, even good people can make mistakes. In just a few short months they were able to hold the biggest Jefferson / Jackson Dinner ever in the history of Nevada with over 2,500 people - we've never had more than 1,000 in the past!
The previous Chair, Liz Foley, shouldn't be criticizing anyone - especially John Hunt, Bill Stanley and the 40 key people who put together a volunteer team of nearly 100 to try and make this even go smoothly. Liz Foley couldn't get a dozen volunteers to work together and she left the Clark County Party thousands of dollars in debt - which Hunt inherited and had to fix!
We had 40 check-in stations with 2 people working together.
The main convention hall was large enough for 5,000 people - but, we only needed space for around 3,300 PRIMARY Delegates and enough space for staff and media. The idea was to first determine how many Primary Delegates showed up and determine how many Alternate Delegates would, then, need to be seated - that's why there were two seperate lines for Primary and Alternate Delegates.
Much of the problem was due to newly active citizens that simply didn't understand the process - many I talked to didn't even know their Precinct Number, let alone if they had been s/elected as a Primary or Alternate Delegate! So, let's be fair and realize there is some basic level of personal responsibility involved. Many didn't even realize they would have to travel, on their own time and dime, to Reno for the NSDP State Convention - let alone how the process worked on to the National Convention in Denver?
So, PLEASE, everyone get the facts straight! Go to the NSDP and Clark County Websites and do a little homework.
Hunt, Stanley and Company are all about making sure the vote is protected for EVERYONE! Now, with everyone aware of how big this thing has become, and with BOTH campaigns providing more volunteers and working together democratically we will get through this phenomenal growth - but, let's focus on doing our duty and stepping up and volunteering to help us move forward!
I will agree with Johnathan_Abbinett that the state party should have identified more temporary chairs to work the caucuses and ensure that delgate names were sent in properly, but it seems as if there was no effort (as there was in 1984) to enlist the campaign's help to identify delgates for the 226 precincts that did not submit names.
The notion that the Bally Events center was large enough to hold the event is ridiculous. 7452 delegates were allocated at the caucus, not 3300. (As you suggested Johnathan, Check the NSDP website) The County Party knew that both campaigns would rally their supporters to ensure that every space was filled under the alternate rules in such a close election. So chosing a space large enough for 5000 was and I want to use bad language here, but lets just call it -- an arrogantly foolish decision of Bush-ian proportions.
Even if the plan were, as you say, to line up the delegates and seat them as needed, where were they going to be held? The bronze room was rented for Obama supporters only -- they graciously allowed it to be used for all alternates once it was clear that the main room was far to small to accomodate everyone.
Equally foolish was the idea of using unsecured, roving bankers boxes to collect the alignement preferences. Many of the delegates weren't sure where they were, or if they were candidate specific.
Not expecting a "tsunami" of support requires absoulte blindness to the process to date. John Hunt (and I don't know the man personally, I'm sure he's everything you say he is) and his support seems to have failed to make even the most elemenatry of calculations in planning for this event. The party should seek a venue that seats 12-15 thousand for the next one, because supporters on both sides are going to come out in force to make sure it's done right.
I will be volunteering for the "do-over" and then I will be asking for John Hunt to step down for new leadership.
Fine "Santabear" and I'd like you to be a good sport and introduce yourself - so I can nominate you to run for Chair of the Clark County Dems and lead us on a path to nirvana!
You know the argument AGAINST a popular vote is based on the premise that the "common" people don't know the difference between good people (who do make mistakes) and corrupt people that are master confidence me manipulating them - and that's the case here!
The blame falls on the last cycle of so-called leaders who left the NSDP and Clark County in debt and dessimated our volunteer base with their arrogant egos and abusive personalities - Tom Collins and Liz Foley are the one's to blame!
Jill Derby returned us to using the Rules of Order and a dignified sense of civility - and John Hunt has nearly performed miracles in his short tenure!
This is NOT the time to take off heads - especially when we have so much to do in an a Presidential election year cycle!
Now, is the time for everyone to step up, volunteer and patient with one another, so we can correct our mistakes and move forward to win the White House and as many seats as possible in the Senate and House of Representatives!
DAMN! Get the BIG picture here folks, and some sense of scale and perspective - voting out the best people we've ever had leading us is just insane!
I learned early in my career from a Sr. Executive at my company "Never confuse efforts with results"!
Hearing that the Democratic County Party members worked hard to put on the Clark County convention does not surprise me, but it was a complete and utter failure! The sooner they acknowledge this fact the sooner they will be able to prepare for a successful follow-up convention.
Why the Party wanted 7,000 plus delegates, alternates and guest at the convention is mind boggling to me when I believe the county only seats roughly 2,500 delegates to the state convention. I suggest that they spend more prep work on getting with the Clinton and Obama campaigns and assure the seating of the assigned delegates as defined from the January 19th Caucus along with 10-20% alternates delegates in order to assure a successful convention.
Focus on the purpose of the convention and leave out the hoopla!
Dave Littman
Clark County Resident
TO John_Ab
I think you have blinders on. Kudos Santa
Nev Dem Caucus & Conv 2008, “Be Afraid, Be VERY Afraid”!
Jan 19, 08, I attended the LV Nev Cauc for the first time as a Nevadan, born and raised Calif in 1954. OK, I admit that most of us Calif’s “watch” the political scene not participate, probably out of apathy, but also because every event involves hundreds of thousand of people vs. 117K +/- that Nevada experienced as a record turnout. I saw and heard both Hillary, Barack and Bill speak in person. By the time the caucus was here, inspite of the fact I thought the whole caucus process was outdated and didn't allow for everyone to participate, I was excited. We were emotionally invested. My husband and I volunteered.
The caucus was a circus with nobody totally in charge and everyone looking for their precinct on a large campus with no understanding of where the individual needed to be. This does not sound like a terrible disaster until you are listening to the complaints personally. (no room to list them). OK, no one but Harry Reid, Senator majority leader, expected the turnout Nev got. My Bad! Live and Learn. Well live anyway, Nev Dems obviously did not learn!
Feb 23, 08, just a little over one month later, Nev Cty (LV) Conv. Again, we volunteered to help with organization on the day of the conv. Arriving at 7:AM at Bally Conv Ctr, expecting to help send delegates to the Nev State Dem Conv and maybe even the Natl Dem Conv. Once again, not one person I talked to in the Hillary Camp knew when or how the votes were going to happen. That was the least of the problems that day. Silly me! Did no one count how many delegates there were going to be? No wait, they did know but chose to ignore the facts. But it is not their fault. What??? Now I know a few more names to be afraid, John Hunt and Bill Stanley. It was reported the Fire Marshall closed the doors and did not allow any more people in at around 11AM. What I do know is that we were registered the night before and we were ready to vote. Well, that was not to happen that day, a recess was voted on at about 4PM after a lot of arm twisting, some finger pointing (at the lack enough of volunteers, rumors of vote tampering,etc), some apologizing, some trying to put a positive spin saying it was a “good” problem and we needed to protect the votes for our candidate because we might disenfranchised voters and our delegates, Nev’s big 25, might be endangered at the Natl Conv if we did not recess now. So, we recessed on the promise, the next regroup would be a quick 15 min vote for our candidate and our state delegates. Yeah right!
What little I have learned is you have to know the number of delegates each candidate earned during the caucus before you can elect any delegates to the state convention. I am afraid; I use to be afraid of GW Bush, Chaney, etc, now I’m afraid of our own incompetence. I am still a Dem, one scared Dem but still a Dem. Teresa Littman (moving back to CA)
Dear Dave,
It's obvious that everyone has admited to the mistakes and their fair share of the errors - do you need a publicly certified document of some kind?
There are 2,463 Primary Delegate slots to fill from Clark County to go to the NSDP State Convention on May 17th in order to ensure a full delegation - which has never, ever happened in the history of our party!
Once Primary Delegates learned that they would have to travel to Reno on their own time and dime many didn't realize the responsibility that goes with becoming a delegate - and they had to be replaced with Alternates.
Both campaigns knew this, and took advantage by attempting to "pack the stack" - we'll get it worked out in a fair, democratic manner that protects everyone's right to participate and vote and the integrity of the vote tally!
Would you care to volunteer to help out? If so, feel free to go to the NV Dems and Clark County Websites to do a little homework then follow-up by contacting them and volunteering - THANKS!
The Clark County Democratic website (http://www.clarkcountydemocrats.org/) is seriously outdated. All through the weeks leading up to the Jan caucus I repeatedly checked it, looking for information, but there was nothing useful there. I also tried other websites which linked back to this site.
Where I got all the information I was looking for was on Obama's highly organized Nevada website. It's also where I went to find much needed information on the County Convention, although finally - rather late in my opinion - the Clark Co website posted a link to the "special convention website", which really isn't very informative. I trust Obama's campaign to provide the information all of us really need.
I did the same thing before and after the caucus attempting to be informed and understand the commitment require to be a delegate. All the websites were outdated. I did look again last night and found a little more info but too little too late. John, quit cheerleading and assuming we have not tried to understand the process. Give others some credit for intelligence, Dave was a volunteer, he was the one who dragged me into the whole process. Teresa
I'm not just "cheerleading" and meant no offense to those many, many volunteers and delegates that did make a due diligant effort to get up to date and be informed - please accept my apology if anyone misunderstood my points about those issues and needing more volunteers.
It is true that we've had problems with getting the Clark County Website updated - in fact, we have a few I.T. volunteers designing a totally new webstie we hope to roll out soon - but, of course, that won't be of any value until it is launched and available for everyone. Again, we are utilizing the generous time of good hearted volunteers and trying to save as much money as possible until we can get through an audit and get a budget set-up. Our only source of revenue is from donations from everyday people like you!
It's a mess - we all know that - help us fix it - that's all I'm saying, and let's be a little more patient and a lot more compassionate in the process shall we?
Dear John,
So basically you’re confirming my knowledge regarding the number of county delegates to go to the state convention...Thank you! You also seem very emotionally involved in this to the point of losing perspective of other's blog. I was there at the convention and voiced my opinion based on firsthand knowledge of what I observed and heard.
Also, one should not be so presumptive as to assume that I've not been active in this process. I was a Precinct Captain for Hillary. I also filled in with a few patriotic citizens at the caucus to act as Precinct Chairperson since our assigned chairperson had to be ambulanced away just prior to the caucus starting. We worked through many problems to assure the integrity of the caucus and I personally delivered those results to the County Party Offices.
Now my advice is to avoid the “packing and stacking” by have the County Party taking more leadership for the next convention.
I will check the website regarding volunteering and maybe we’ll have the pleasure of meeting face to face.
Oh, and this will be my final response to you on this subject, I never liked email tit for tat at work and don’t want to start one on this blog.
Dave
I am emotionally involved as I know the how hard we've worked over the past couple of cycles to vote out the good old boys and go along girls and replace them with the good people we have leading us today - and I know all of them to be people of good character and have never had much tolerance for people bullying people and trash talking with rumour, innuendo, hear-say and gossip!
I apologize if I came across "presumptious" and I do THANK YOU SINCERELY for volunteering and sacrificing so much of your time in support of your candidate and the democratic process. If I can be of any assistance please feel free to e-mail me at jlabbinett@cox.net or feel free to call me at 220-9303 anytime between 9am and 9pm.
Thank you, John, your tone and message is now coming through instead of making me angrier. I see that you are dedicated, sincere and knowlegeable in what you believe. I am sure now that "you" have acknowledged the mess dare I say debacle, which is good, maybe the next convention has hope. I am still not sure John and Bill have done so in reading the newspapers but those have been know to misquote or take out of contents. So I am going to give them the benefit of my large doubt on your say so. Mostly because as you point out the options are few. If I can be there for the next convention, I will. I will volunteer to help before the convention again because as a Dem, I am a gulton for punishment, ok just sort of kidding. Maybe we can shake hands at the next event. Call us if you personally need us to help because no matter how many times we sign up we do not get asked except to make more phone calls, that we will not do.
Teresa and David Littman 240-2492
Thankyou Teresa and David and let me give you a little hint - they (meaning EVERYONE, the NSDP, Clark County, and EVERY Candidate's Campaign)always need more people to do the dirty work - and very few people want to make phone calls and participate (in any way) calling people and interrupting them at home - especially during dinner hour!
I make calls only when I support the event, or the candidate, and only during REASONABLE hours - and simply refuse to do so otherwise! You have every right to say "I want to help - but, I will NOT make phone calls!" and stand your ground - there is a lot of other work that needs to be done - but, they always try and get people to do the least desirable tasks first (for obvious reasons).
Most people can not afford to donate money, let alone big money, so we give our most valuable resource our time and talent - and don't let anyone disrespect that important gift!
Give the Clark County Democratic Party call and ask to speak with our Executive Director to volunteer - and make sure and sign-up on the Clark County Website!
We do want volunteers from both the Clinton and Obama campaigns involved in volunteering so we have plenty of eyes everywhere and we really do want to make sure things are fair for everyone!
The Clark County convention was planned when Hillary was ahead 30 points in the polls in Nevada and she was the "inevitable" Democratic nominee. If that had held, Obama/other candidates would have received about 2000 delegates in the county caucuses; Hillary would have be declared the nominee on February 5 and Ballys would have been the perfect size for a Clinton pep rally on Saturday. The problem was that Hunt and Company, like Clinton and Company, had no Plan B.
I can't believe you people here are buying into the fraud that is taking place. The political elite that pulls the strings is doing the same thing on both parties because they are bought and paid for by the same international banking interests. Do some research and you will find out that Rupert Murdoch (Fox News Owner) and Roger Ailes (CEO at Fox and Lush Limpjaw's boss) have held fund raising parties for Hillary. The Republican Party pulled similar garbage by moving their convention date from the 23rd to the 8th of March. What is hoped is that the establishment choices were so far out in front that our convention was worthless. There are only two people running for president that aren't bought and paid for and they are Dennis Kucinich on the Democratic side and Ron Paul on the Republican side. It is time for everybody to wake up and understand that the elite are playing the Hegelian Dialectic on much of what you think to be true. The election system is a fraud now with electronic voting machines being easily manipulated; watch Hijacking Democracy to see what is going on. The only bad thing about the documentary is the fact that the US government was established as a Republic not a Democracy.
Go Ron Paul
I was part of the fiasco at the convention on Saturday, and I was amazed at what I can only perceive as a lack of leadership on the part of the Convention Chair. When someone at the microphone announced that more than 3000 people had registered on Friday night, I couldn't help wondering why a red flag didn't go up for the people in charge: "Gee, turnout is going to be huge. We should take some steps now to prevent chaos tomorrow. First, only registered delegates should be allowed into the hall. Alternates and guests should be placed in a waiting area. And tomorrow we should have people who have lists of elected delegates circulating through the line to identify and fast-track their registration." Instead, I get the feeling that the county party never quite figured out that the light at the end of the tunnel was an oncoming train....
Interesting thought Lilly!
So if Obama has another sweep on March 4, or at least wins Texas and Ohio.....potentially Hillary's campaign may be over and she drops out, in which case...the reconvening of our County convention is a moot point?
Or
If Hillary wins Texas or Ohio and stays in the race, then Clark Co, Nevada all a sudden becomes extremely important to both camps.
"Hunt and his team knew that the Obama campaign was suspicious of them because they were seen as helping the Clinton campaign, but still they behaved like exclusionary high schoolers in the cool clique. And Hunt and his team, in the aftermath of their excruciating incompetence, now are trying to blame the campaigns, especially the Obama folks, for a cataclysm of their own making."
Jon Ralston
Las Vegas Sun